Author Topic: Bomber Formations.. Partly automated  (Read 1709 times)

Offline CJ

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Bomber Formations.. Partly automated
« on: November 08, 2000, 08:16:00 PM »
I just posted this in a different thread "I like this" below, about a day ago.  

What do you think?

>What about making the bombers historically accurate. This would necessitate large formations of bombers to have a chance of success. With a limited player base like in Aces High, this severely limits large formations UNLESS we had automated bombers. This could be done by allowing each bomber pilot lead say... 3 other automated bombers in a formation. The 3 otto bombers would do their best to keep up with the lead plane, and would hold a decent formation, and drop with relatively good historical accuracy. The other 3 planes would have otto gunners with accuracy that mirrors the human controlled gunnery statistics of AH. This would bring large formations of bombers to AH, and still allow the effectiveness and sense of accomplishment to bomber pilots WITHOUT having super accurate bombing computers, that somehow negate the effects of turbulence (which there would be in real life, and which would randomize the drop.
To do this, bombers with simplified flight models could be programmed to follow the leader. The leader could select different numbers of bombers for his flight depending on a) the type of airfield he flew from, b) the status of that field with respect to damage, c) relative numbers of players for his country. This would allow large stratiegic formations from rear bases, and smaller tactical strikes from front bases. Also, if a side was outnumbered, they would be allowed more bombers to help keep the balance even. Experimentation in the game could be used to determine a fair (bomber formation modifier) to compensate for being outnumbered 2 to one or 1.5 to one. Maybe it could simply be based on number of aircraft int he air at a given time for each country, so that it would balance out any formation death staring that could occur.

Anyway.. this was just a brain storm.. what do you guys think?

CJ



Offline sax

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Bomber Formations.. Partly automated
« Reply #1 on: November 08, 2000, 09:34:00 PM »
I think all player controlled bomber pilots
should be able to form up on the leader and
relinquish flight control to him, even when
you are in gunner position. The only way for control to be taken back is by actually breaking away from the group. This would allow tight secure formations all the way to the target.
sax

Offline Naso

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Bomber Formations.. Partly automated
« Reply #2 on: November 09, 2000, 02:12:00 AM »
Nice this, Sax.

A sort of "formation autopilot".

I like it.

Offline Fishu

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Bomber Formations.. Partly automated
« Reply #3 on: November 09, 2000, 03:18:00 AM »
Can I also have a group of AI fighters with me in that case?

[This message has been edited by Fishu (edited 11-09-2000).]

funked

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Bomber Formations.. Partly automated
« Reply #4 on: November 09, 2000, 04:12:00 AM »
AI BUFF wingies would rock.  Then you could reduce bomb accuracy and gun effectiveness to realistic levels.

Offline StSanta

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Bomber Formations.. Partly automated
« Reply #5 on: November 09, 2000, 06:36:00 AM »
Well, a word of caution.

I want to know that whatever I blast out of they sky is flown by a human.

That's part of the charm with AH.



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Offline Fury

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Bomber Formations.. Partly automated
« Reply #6 on: November 09, 2000, 07:17:00 AM »
An interesting idea.

I am scared of gunner otto in any form; your suggestion sounds good.  However, part of the fun of jumping a buff is catching him head down or just daydreaming.... otto can guarantee that this won't happen any more.

Fury

Offline juzz

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Bomber Formations.. Partly automated
« Reply #7 on: November 09, 2000, 07:21:00 AM »
Auto-formation would be nice(AH does have auto-takeoff after all) - BUT - only if everyone gets the option to use it, not just bombers.

Combat AI(AI gunners, AI planes etc) should be avoided at all costs I think.

Offline Westy

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Bomber Formations.. Partly automated
« Reply #8 on: November 09, 2000, 07:59:00 AM »
 Internet lag and issues aside, that needs it's own solution, I have to chime in with I do not like the idea of auto-formation. Why? It takes no skill. And imo that is a dumbing down feature.
 Learn to fly in formation. Or be a target.
 As for AI bombers with AI otto? Not a bad idea. But I would say no "otto."  If you make it to target then the extra bombers are gravy for you and they help hit the target. If you don't make it or run into opposition then the AI bombers should be simple drone targets that shouldn't be any extra boost to your survivability.
 But I'm of the "AI for box sims only" clan, not AI for a sim intended to be people vs other people.  AI is fine for ack and FA II has a nice feature where the ground forces are AI. But aircraft in an MMP aircombat sim? Not crazy about that at all.

  -Westy

Offline Midnight

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Bomber Formations.. Partly automated
« Reply #9 on: November 09, 2000, 08:05:00 AM »
I like that idea of formation Auto-pilot. Maybe it could be coupled to the Wingman command, so that once you select who you want as wingman (say that would select flight leader) you could then go to autopilot and your plane would match the flight of the leader.

I think for it to work, you would have to get your plane into good position BEFORE selecting auto-pilot. Then, your plane would maintain a position, say with two new commands,
1. wingdistance = x yards
2. wingaltoffset = x feet

Your plane would then automatically fly in formation until you turned off auto-pilot or the lead plane broke formation by executing a maneuver that would put him outside your forward view (i.e. hard bank turn that auto-pilot could not match)

Maybe could be done... I don't like the AI stuff, it takes away the human error factor (i.e. no more suprize attacks) and puts additional load on the server to control the possibly hundreds of airborne guns.


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Midnight

Offline Midnight

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Bomber Formations.. Partly automated
« Reply #10 on: November 09, 2000, 08:12:00 AM »
What I would like is for the Panzer's top MG to be AI. Either that, or it would be nice to be able to hear a plane coming in to bomb/strafe you, so you could do something about it.

I hate being in a tank, trying to line up a long range target only to be killed by a plane that is basically stealth because it makes no audible engine noise that would be VERY easy to hear in a tank at idle.

How about it? At least a text message, "TANK COMMANDER: ENEMY PLANE APPROCHING!"



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Offline Ripsnort

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Bomber Formations.. Partly automated
« Reply #11 on: November 09, 2000, 08:15:00 AM »
I don't like the idea, since currently, the  sim only requires (1) Lanc to be able to take down 50% of enemy radar.

Offline JimBear

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Bomber Formations.. Partly automated
« Reply #12 on: November 09, 2000, 08:19:00 AM »
Sounds like something out of Fighter Ace 1.5
No Thankyou, robot Aircraft are just fine for offline fare.

Offline Westy

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Bomber Formations.. Partly automated
« Reply #13 on: November 09, 2000, 08:51:00 AM »
 Midnight, tank engines are extremely loud not only when under the strain of moving but alos at idle.  I'm not sure you'd ever hear any aircraft unless it was a Stuka and he was coming down verticly on you and you could hear it's siren..
 
 Oxford huh? Btw, I'm typing this from Charlton.  

 -Westy

Offline Fishu

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Bomber Formations.. Partly automated
« Reply #14 on: November 09, 2000, 09:09:00 AM »
 
Quote
Originally posted by Westy:
Midnight, tank engines are extremely loud not only when under the strain of moving but alos at idle.  I'm not sure you'd ever hear any aircraft unless it was a Stuka and he was coming down verticly on you and you could hear it's siren..
 -Westy

I'd guess that you could hear plane if you're stationary and TRYING to hear for planes..
Though.. hearing or MG34 doesn't help much when those uber hispanies comes at you..
though, if its any other gun in the air than hispanies, you can just bend back and start sniping the enemy plane.. (its funny.. no other gun does anything to tank than hispano.. no matter how many times you hit and from what angle.. and with hispanos you dont even care about the angle)