Author Topic: Hmm, this gun study in Australia may differ from Vulcans opinion  (Read 1079 times)

Offline Ripsnort

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Compliments of Dune:

Quote
Nationally, Australia imported 40,939 firearms last year, an increase from 28,016 in 2001-02 and 30,666 in 2000-01.

The Sporting Shooters Association said yesterday the figures confirmed buyback schemes were a "waste of money", with gun owners simply restocking and upgrading to legal weapons.

"By reducing the number of legally owned firearms in the community you do not make the community safer," said Victorian president Sebastian Ziccone.

"Since the Port Arthur buybacks in 1996 and the current handgun buyback, there has not been any impact on firearm crime. The government pays people buckets of money to hand back currently illegal weapons and a large number of people then go out and buy currently legal firearms to participate in their sport."



http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5744,9264273%255E2702,00.html

Offline -tronski-

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Hmm, this gun study in Australia may differ from Vulcans opinion
« Reply #1 on: April 17, 2004, 08:45:38 AM »
wow...this study was really informative....

there are people legally buying guns in australia..

that it is "it was not known whether the guns had been imported by recreational shooters, law enforcement agencies or the armed forces."

that a Shooters Association president said yesterday the figures confirmed buyback schemes were a "waste of money", and had no impact on crime

That Gun Control Australia president John Crook said yesterday it was disturbing that 100,000 firearms had been imported since 2000. However, some of the guns could have been imported by police and security firms.

....where was the study part again?

 Tronsky
God created Arrakis to train the faithful

Offline Ripsnort

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Hmm, this gun study in Australia may differ from Vulcans opinion
« Reply #2 on: April 17, 2004, 09:08:20 AM »
Okay, well, someone obviously went and looked at some data out there, they would have been considered "studying" the data. Thus the rhetorical "study" imply.  I guess my term was lost in translation of text on the internet..

Offline lazs2

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Hmm, this gun study in Australia may differ from Vulcans opinion
« Reply #3 on: April 17, 2004, 10:16:59 AM »
that study is nothing new... Every study shows that the womanly panic has simply allowed the govewrnment to take away their basic human right to self defense and has only made things worse... Now that things are worse the government will use the next incident to further crack down on their subjects.

I do admit that australians buckling under to their women and government shook me up a little..  I used to admire the aussies as rugged individualists.   Like rural Americans but...

lazs

Offline Gixer

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Hmm, this gun study in Australia may differ from Vulcans opinion
« Reply #4 on: April 17, 2004, 02:55:32 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by lazs2
that study is nothing new... Every study shows that the womanly panic has simply allowed the govewrnment to take away their basic human right to self defense and has only made things worse... Now that things are worse the government will use the next incident to further crack down on their subjects.

I do admit that australians buckling under to their women and government shook me up a little..  I used to admire the aussies as rugged individualists.   Like rural Americans but...

lazs




Have either of you actually ever been to Australia, let alone the Outback? Or even actually met someone who has? I assume not as you wouldn't make such a simple minded and naive statement.

Personally I have nothing but the greatest respect for them.



...-Gixer

Offline Yeager

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Hmm, this gun study in Australia may differ from Vulcans opinion
« Reply #5 on: April 17, 2004, 03:02:05 PM »
QUIGLEY DOWN UNDER!!!!!
"If someone flips you the bird and you don't know it, does it still count?" - SLIMpkns

Offline Airhead

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Hmm, this gun study in Australia may differ from Vulcans opinion
« Reply #6 on: April 17, 2004, 03:02:10 PM »
I can't respect a Nation that spawned Yahoo Serious.

Offline -tronski-

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Hmm, this gun study in Australia may differ from Vulcans opinion
« Reply #7 on: April 17, 2004, 07:34:51 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by lazs2
that study is nothing new... Every study shows that the womanly panic has simply allowed the govewrnment to take away their basic human right to self defense and has only made things worse... Now that things are worse the government will use the next incident to further crack down on their subjects.

I do admit that australians buckling under to their women and government shook me up a little..  I used to admire the aussies as rugged individualists.   Like rural Americans but...

lazs


smarter?  :D


Actually, this doesn't news report confirm that legal gun ownership has increased, that only banned firearms have been taken away?

Quote
Originally posted by Gixer
Have either of you actually ever been to Australia, let alone the Outback? Or even actually met someone who has? I assume not as you wouldn't make such a simple minded and naive statement.

Personally I have nothing but the greatest respect for them.



...-Gixer


Onya Gixer!

 Tronsky
God created Arrakis to train the faithful

Offline lazs2

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Hmm, this gun study in Australia may differ from Vulcans opinion
« Reply #8 on: April 18, 2004, 09:47:38 AM »
soo... you can go into a gun store in australlia and buy a 1911 colt or clone and licence to carry it?   You can buy a 44mag to carry on your hip in the outback for defense?   .357 mag revolver?

What types of handguns and semi auto rifles can you have there now?   What kinds of rifles or shotguns or handguns period?  I looked it up and it seem pretty bleak.

lazs

Offline Gixer

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Hmm, this gun study in Australia may differ from Vulcans opinion
« Reply #9 on: April 18, 2004, 01:14:04 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by lazs2
soo... you can go into a gun store in australlia and buy a 1911 colt or clone and licence to carry it?   You can buy a 44mag to carry on your hip in the outback for defense?   .357 mag revolver?

What types of handguns and semi auto rifles can you have there now?   What kinds of rifles or shotguns or handguns period?  I looked it up and it seem pretty bleak.

lazs



So your definition of a  rugged Aussie is whether he can carry a 44mag and an assault rifle around with him in the bush? LOL

Only thing I ever used when traveling in the outback was a short barrel shotgun for snakes.

Aussie is like here if you can prove to the police you want a handgun for sport or an assault rifle to go shooting you have to prove it and get the appropriate licence.

But of course that's a whole other debate (open a message thread if you like) and find your opinion of no respect towards Aussies compared to Americans just because of gun laws very narrow and simple minded.



...-Gixer

Offline Vulcan

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Hmm, this gun study in Australia may differ from Vulcans opinion
« Reply #10 on: April 18, 2004, 02:00:52 PM »
Sorry Rip you struck out on this one.

This article is more on Aussie taxpayers funding a scheme which is being abused (ie briing a gun in cheap from Ebay, get 3 times what u paid for it back from the govt) as opposed to a comparison on gun law effectiveness.

Offline Bluedog

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Hmm, this gun study in Australia may differ from Vulcans opinion
« Reply #11 on: April 19, 2004, 03:06:57 AM »
You cant have ANY semi-auto weapon larger than a handgun here, not even a .22
You can only own and keep a handgun if you are a registered member of a pistol club, you keep the weapon at that club under lock and key, and you have a pistol licence .(unless you own land If you are a property owner with more than 200 acres, or have the permission of such a person to shoot on their property, weapons and permits are pretty easy to get, both rifles and handguns, unless of course you have a criminal or psychiatric history)
True assault weapons (pistol grip, 30 rnd box mag, flash suppresser) were allways fairly rare, but were available fairly easily on the 'not-so-legal' market, I doubt that has changed much, if at all.
Bolt action sporting rifles are fine, no problems keeping one of them at all, requires a shooters permit, but you can get one of those from any Police station.
Shotguns are fine, so long as they arent semi-auto or pump action.
The REAL stupid part, lever action rifles are a big NO NO !....who the hell ever commited a crime with a lever action .30/30 in the last hundred years???


It's nothing new about the buy back scheme being a total crock, everyone I know who handed in anything was vastly overcompensated, including myself.
I handed in 3 pieces of rusty crap, and was given enough to buy a brand spanking new Carl Gustav .270 with a Ziess 3~9X variable.
Everyone I know who had any semi autos of actual value, didnt hand them in.

Whole thing was and still is a sad joke, blatant over-reaction by the people who have no need of, nor use for any weapons, giving those of us who at times do a few more hassles in getting /using one.

BTW firearms crime hasnt slowed one little bit down here, infact Sydney and Melbourne 'crime families' seem to be shooting each other at an alarming rate just lately.

Really all it means is that there are a hell of a lot more illegal weapons in Oz than there used to be....the weapons were allways here, it's just now they are banned.
Doesnt mean people dont possess them though.
If guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns. As the say.

 
Apart from handing in some busted old crap semi-autos which were useless anyway, the gun laws havent really effected me much, except I had to update my licence, and buy some PVC tubing.
In fact I spent last weekend destroying some evil cans with a mate's Desert Eagle....havent chased many porkers though, I dont like the idea of fumbling with a bolt when 100kg of pissed off bacon is charging me :) I used to relish the thought with an SLR in my hands.

Just as an afterthought, as far as I am aware, it is legal to own and keep a fully automatic assault rifle or submachinegun, or a full size machinegun for that matter, if you own a boat of ocean-going capability. Something to do with international law regarding defence against pirates !!

Offline lazs2

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Hmm, this gun study in Australia may differ from Vulcans opinion
« Reply #12 on: April 19, 2004, 08:13:09 AM »
thanks bluedog... pretty much what I had read.   If I was gonna have a shotgun for defense or snakes it would be a pump or semiauto... If I wanted to keep my hands free... a pistol.  

If I wanted to defend myself against the bad guys... you know the ones who well.... shoot and rob people and such... then a concealed handgun would fit the bill nicely.

I have no use for a handgun that is kept at a "shooting club" or at some friends house.

good news is that you could, I guess, keep a sawed off double barrel by the nightstand... A little clumsy and slow to reload but better than a stick.  

people haven't gotten any nicer.  disarming the law abiding or hamstringing them with laws that take away their RIGHT to defend themselves is as silly now as it ever was and should be viewed with extreme suspicion by any free person.

lazs

Offline Ripsnort

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Hmm, this gun study in Australia may differ from Vulcans opinion
« Reply #13 on: April 19, 2004, 08:19:53 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Bluedog

{the}Whole thing was and still is a sad joke, blatant over-reaction by the people who have no need of, nor use for any weapons, giving those of us who at times do a few more hassles in getting /using one.

BTW firearms crime hasnt slowed one little bit down here, infact Sydney and Melbourne 'crime families' seem to be shooting each other at an alarming rate just lately.

Really all it means is that there are a hell of a lot more illegal weapons in Oz than there used to be....the weapons were allways here, it's just now they are banned.
Doesnt mean people dont possess them though.
If guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns. As the say.
 


Seems like Vulcan and Blue have differing opinions on firearms down under. Imagine that! :)

Offline lazs2

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Hmm, this gun study in Australia may differ from Vulcans opinion
« Reply #14 on: April 19, 2004, 08:26:44 AM »
saadly... law abiding citizens er... formerly law abiding citizens won't be able to show or shoot these now banned weapons in the open any longer..  few new ones will be made or imported and the nannies will have their way... only the worst of the criminals will have the good guns.   The banned weapons will take on a stigma and normaly logical people will think "assault weapon" or "handgun" and imagine the devil making them in hell so that they can come to australia and grow little feet and kill people or... turn sane people into murderous psycopaths.

The traditions of shooting will be lost and the city girls will win.

lazs