Nascar needs more minorities

[jamusta]

Demaw,

These subjects come up alot. Instead of having a mature discussion about it, it turns into exactly what this post did. A joke. I wasn't going to reply at all but I could not help myself. Now a joke is a joke, but I found nothing humorus about being chased by the police and so on. It may seem funny to some but to tie real life problems into a joke, I think not. Say if you lost your house and I made a joke about you not paying your note, would that be funny?

[Eagler]

but i think the average NASCAR driver would happily swap paychecks with the average NBA'er

[lazs2]

mt... you don't believe that certain skills can be genetic?  

jamusta.   We would probly get along just fine.   If we were together and you were truely being discriminated against I would back you up unless you brought it on yourself with attitude or whatever.   I would also laugh at you if you were sensitive around me.   I am pretty much an equal opportunity insulter.  

I am not around blacks much.   the majority of the ones I see, I would shun based simply on appearance.   what we have her, where I live, the most of is mexicans.   my currrent girlfriend is mexican and my grand daughter is half mexican..  I am around mexicans all the time.   for the most part... I am much more tolerant than of race or even mexicans than they are..  They truely hate some 'types" of mexicans... I guess in much the same way that some white trash disgusts me.

At the last wedding I was at I was the only white.   most of the people there were either not citizens or recent ones.   There were a lot of people there who treated me very well but a percentage, maybe 10% were openly hostile and even with my limited spanish I got it.    Being a head taller than the hostiles and sober and friends of the important people there was a big help.

I have said... my first decades of my life were pretty biggoted.   I have SS tatts.   I grew up and became logical (I think) about the whole thing.   That does not mean that I condone overly sensitive behavior or discrimination, reverse or otherwise.

It is far to complex to expalin here... you would have to know me.

lazs

[Wolf14]

I agree somewhat with what your saying MT. What I am trying to point out is that regardless of credintials at the basic level a driver has to be able to run with the big boys, keep his car on the track, and not be a hazard to the other drivers. Some folks just cant hold and maintain a line at speed. Regardless of the reasons why they cant hold the line and maintain speed NASCAR isnt gonna let them on the track for a race.

The minimun speed is a percentage of the pole speed. There are some tracks that the minimum speed doesnt matter as much. If a driver doesnt qualify in the top 38 and doesnt have any provisionals he is going home. Those are rules that apply to anybody that wants to run, Doesnt matter what the name is.  So yes skill is involved. If you cant drive the car you are not gonna run. Last name doesnt help at all. The other thing to consider is that the guys that are 3rd and 4th generation drivers, Racing is all they know. The Track and pits is where they grew up. Its a family thing.

Also you may have missed my point, You have one sport that is very white dominated. You have another that is very Black dominated. Asking to have more of one group in one sport is just like asking to have more of the other in the other group. Some things just arent going to mix due to interest/ skill. Forcing it to happen isnt gonna help either. Its a matter of free choice. NASCAR is open to anybody, but you have to be able to run the numbers just aas in the NBA, you can play but you gotta be able to kick bellybutton and make the shots.

[Capt. Pork]

Originally posted by jamusta
So when you get the chance...GET OVER YOURSELF

I admit that what I said about the Police cars was pretty crappy.

But to be honest, I feel far worse about making you feel bad than I do about cracking a joke. I've been the target of plenty of racial humor myself. When the jokes were made by blacks or hispanics, it was about my whitness, when the jokes were made by whites, it was about my being Jewish. I'm not complaining, I'm just saying I've been there. Crappy as it was, we learn to deal with it... Occasionally, when there's genuine humor involved, even laugh a little.

I'll accept that it was out of line given the nature of the thread and this BBS as a whole.

I still think JJ is a schmuck and a poor roll model.

[SoulzofAW3]

@ the ignorance in this post.  Keep it up fellas  

[jamusta]

I am far from sensitive lazs. I cut into people all the time, but if I dont know you I would be sensitive to saying any type of racial joke around you. Now if we were sitting back having drinks and start cracking on each other, I can go with the best of them. My only point to this thread is that it seems when topics like this come up, every one wants to jump in and start throwing out the racial jokes. Now are you guys trying to be funny or are you guys hiding your racism in a joke?

I have way more respect for a man who can say, "I dont like this race or that race", than a man who tries to hide it.

[Masherbrum]

The horse is dead.   But, in all honesty jamusta, you're cussing more than anyone that was "racial".  

Karaya

[midnight Target]

Originally posted by lazs2
mt... you don't believe that certain skills can be genetic?  .

lazs

Of course they can. Kobe Bryant's dad was a pro, as was Luke Walton's etc.

Point is.. they didn't get their shot because they had dad's in the game. They got their shot because they were talented.

[Masherbrum]

Originally posted by midnight Target
Of course they can. Kobe Bryant's dad was a pro, as was Luke Walton's etc.

Point is.. they didn't get their shot because they had dad's in the game. They got their shot because they were talented.

MT, I'm glad we finally agree on something.  The Jimmy "The Greek" BS is just that, BS.  

Karaya

[demaw1]

jamusta,i am going to ask a question and i will take your word as the last word.   look at midnight targets thread a bout nascar drivers dads. i read it this way, for sake of arguement ,all the last names are white people, there fore the main reason their sons got the chance is because of the good ole white boys dads run the show. well maybe they have a little skill,but they got the chance cause daddys back ground and the good ole boys network.

[never mind they have been groomed their whole life for this.as tigers dad groomed him for golf and the williams girls dad did for tennis] [ i know nothing about basketball so i will use baseball as i almost made it.To suggest all blacks were drafted because of skill and not daddys last name... doesnt wash many blacks [and others ] that had realitives that played have been drafted that should not have been out of respect for the former player. i know i played with some.and whats wrong with that,Ididnt not make it because of these players but because of the ones that made me look like i was standing still.My point, we are all the same,u get tired of this ,i get tired of that, they get tired of everything.The white people are not the blacks problem,the aisians are not the whites problem ,the indians are not the hispanics problem etc,etc,
,question is did i read the thread right or am i just hearing this stuff so much that is all i hear?

[jamusta]

My opinion on the whole NASCAR issue is this. I am sure that these drivers have been doing this long before the joined NASCAR. Probably started with go-carts in kindegarden. There is no doubt that a person who has been around the track for years has more skill then say I would trying to start off. To me it all boils down to sponsors in this environment. Who is likely to get the sponsors? Two drivers with equal talent. One of the drivers is yourself. The other is Petty's son.

As for the Williams sister's and Tiger no one paid them any mind until they started showing some dominance. In any other sport that is the way it is, you have to be a dominant player. No one cares who your daddy was. They just want you to sell tickets.

Bill Waltons son is a perfect example. His dad a great Hall of Famer but who cares. His son picked low in the draft. He doesnt even start. Noone goes to a game to watch him play but his dad.

[storch]

Originally posted by rpm371
"The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides by the inequities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil men. Blessed is he who, in the name of charity and good will, shepherds the weak through the valley of the darkness. For he is truly his brother's keeper and the finder of lost children. And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my brothers. And you will know I am Skuzzy when I lay my vengeance upon you."

So run and tattle to skuzzy again.

[hblair]

Originally posted by midnight Target
I find it difficult to swallow the notion that simple skill is all that is involved in NASCAR or any other racing league's ladder of success. It is pretty obvious that while NASCAR drivers are undoubtably skilled, they also seem to get some boost from having the correct last name.

Earnhardt
Waltrip
Petty
Andretti
Unser

I'm sure I've missed a few.

The point being that comparing NASCAR to basketball is just plain silly. No one ever got an NBA draft invitation simply due to his last name. Now please understand. I'm not saying these sons and brothers and uncles of drivers aren't skilled. I'm saying that they got the opportunity to become skilled due to their family background.

Not necassarily because daddy gave 'em a free ride. Most second generation drivers grew up eating sleeping breathing at the track. It's only natural that they pick up the skills and the connections. earnhardt didn't do much at all for junior til he really advanced and started winning races.

As far as black drivers in nascar. You won't see much of that until you see minorities at the grass roots level. At the local dirt track in alabama on a saturday night being competitive in a late model car, or at indy raceway park winning races in a sprint car. Then they'll work their way up. jj can't just throw a black guy in a cup car and expect him to do well.
The only problem with that theory is there are no blacks at the local dirt track. or none that I noticed a few weeks ago when I was there. Not even fans in the stands. That'll likely have to change before we'll have a competitive black driver in a cup race.

[Torque]

Originally posted by hblair
Not necassarily because daddy gave 'em a free ride. Most second generation drivers grew up eating sleeping breathing at the track. It's only natural that they pick up the skills and the connections. earnhardt didn't do much at all for junior til he really advanced and started winning races.

As far as black drivers in nascar. You won't see much of that until you see minorities at the grass roots level. At the local dirt track in alabama on a saturday night being competitive in a late model car, or at indy raceway park winning races in a sprint car. Then they'll work their way up. jj can't just throw a black guy in a cup car and expect him to do well.
The only problem with that theory is there are no blacks at the local dirt track. or none that I noticed a few weeks ago when I was there. Not even fans in the stands. That'll likely have to change before we'll have a competitive black driver in a cup race.

Word!