Why soo many players fly P38s in AH2?

[Tilt]

Two of us ( a 51 and me an La5) agin Kappa 's 38 last night. He flew it just like he did in AW..............

He was without an aileron fully flapped holding the edge......... constantly evading our bead............constantly changing his plain of flight..........constantly holding onto his slender e state.

I went loose for a few secs........came back and his 38 hung nose up pushing a manouver..........I was certain he was gonna flop out as he dropped.

But no ................I rolled over him and there he was still falling............ still holding his nose up ........I was dead in in his sights.......... I woke up in the tower.

Awsome.........

I think the 51 bugged out at that point..............probably the wisest thing to do.

I have to admit that after flying AW and AH since 96 proficiency to even a medi ocre standard in the 38 is something I can only admire from afar.

[simshell]

iv never had much trouble defeating it

i do hate facing them not because of geting on there 6 but because of how strong they are i have many storys of me putting half of my 109f-4 1 20mm load unto a p38 and he still flys

P38's are great E fighters in the top of E fighters in AH2 but there not great turnfighters almost all the P38s that i killed were trying to turn then they tryed to run but found out that there P38 was not a dweeb 190d-9:rolleyes:

it seems like most flying the P38 in the main dont know what there doing

if i had to tell a LW pliot how to fly the P38 i would tell him to fly it like a 109g-6 only with better guns

[Raptor]

Originally posted by Captain Virgil Hilts
I can not only fly it, but I can land as well, with kills. I can actually maintain a positive k/d ratio. I have no skill. Therefore the P-38 cannot possibly require skill.

Depends on what you are flying against and how you are flying it. There are those who BnZ with it, that wouldnt require alot of skill IMO. But others like myself, we get out there and TnB against spits, NIKs, and whatever crosses our path.
I started flying the P38 cause I liked getting a big bird to do what a spit or NIK can. I went from one of the few P47 pilots who would turnfight with a spit9 and win, to the p38.

BTW, does anyone else feel like the p38 has a little bit of torque now? Also in alot of stalls I have experienced lately, turns into a flat spin. Then after fighting the stall it stops spinning and just falls straight down.

[Sikboy]

Originally posted by simshell
iv never had much trouble defeating it

i do hate facing them not because of geting on there 6 but because of how strong they are i have many storys of me putting half of my 109f-4 1 20mm load unto a p38 and he still flys
 

You're not kidding there, I will avoid taking shots on a 38 in a furball, since I know I'm destined for the assist. Unless I'm in a 9T, then I'll take the shot, but that's pretty rare. In fact, I can only ever remember shooting a 38 in a 9T, and I was only using the .50 at the time.

-Sik

[SlapShot]

Originally posted by Raptor01
Depends on what you are flying against and how you are flying it. There are those who BnZ with it, that wouldnt require alot of skill IMO. But others like myself, we get out there and TnB against spits, NIKs, and whatever crosses our path.
I started flying the P38 cause I liked getting a big bird to do what a spit or NIK can. I went from one of the few P47 pilots who would turnfight with a spit9 and win, to the p38.

BTW, does anyone else feel like the p38 has a little bit of torque now? Also in alot of stalls I have experienced lately, turns into a flat spin. Then after fighting the stall it stops spinning and just falls straight down.

I find the BnZ part easy .. its the turn-fighting that requires more of my energy (constantly trimming - flaps in/out - rudder).

Last night I was fighting 2 109s or 190s or 1 of each ... all I know is that they had a 1 a 0 and a 9 ... anyways, I attacked one of them that I had the better angle on and pinged him up on multiple passes while avoiding the other one. I finally get nose up (elevator trimmed up to the max and 1 notch of flaps) to the right for a deflection shot and send a stream that cuts his wing off. At this point I am slow but still within the boundries of stall fighting the P-38.

Number 2 is now 1K behind me and zooming up so I kick hard rudder, to swing the nose in the direction that I had established for the deflection shot, to try to get nose down under his zoom.

In the blink of an eye I am spinning counter-clockwise very rapidly. I cut throttle, kick opposite rudder, retract flaps ... I tried everything I could think of and nothing would stop the rapid flat spin. I would say that the spin started at between 3-4K and I ended up in the drink. I was pissed !!! to say the least.

I don't know if the spin was induced correctly for the conditions that I created or if I should have been able to pull out of it, but it just doesn't seem right to me ... I could be wrong.

Also, if I have trimmed for level flight and take my hand off the stick, the plane wants to yaw to the left and it doesn't matter what direction the wind is blowing.

[SlapShot]

Originally posted by Sikboy
You're not kidding there, I will avoid taking shots on a 38 in a furball, since I know I'm destined for the assist. Unless I'm in a 9T, then I'll take the shot, but that's pretty rare. In fact, I can only ever remember shooting a 38 in a 9T, and I was only using the .50 at the time.

-Sik

Don't be afraid at this point, the P-38 tail separates from the body quite easily in AH II.

Since flying the P-38 in AH II, I can't remember a situation where I have taken fire in the rear and come away with rudder and/or elevator damage. It's either nothing or the tail comes off ... no gray zone at the moment.

[SlapShot]

Taken from an excellent link that, I believe, straffo found that provides all the text and pictures for "Hanger Flying - complied and written for pilots - by pilots".

Lockheed produced a series of newsletters called Hangar Flying filled with tips and humorous cartoons.

========== Issue 2 ==================

The '38 is a pilot's dream-come-true when it comes to the stall characteristics. They are unusually good and-although not generally used-are worthwhile investigating so that in an emergency you will know what performance to expect from your ship. We have discovered that the power stall occurs at about 70 M.P.H. with about a 50-foot loss of altitude. The counter rotating propellers eliminate torque and there is no tendency for either wing to dip or fall away.
 
You will find "she" is just as steady in a power off stall with gear and flaps retracted or extended. One of the finest characteristics of the '38 is the accelerated stall. Such stalls, accompanied by normal buffeting, occur on any ship when the angle of attack is increased to the point that the airflow over the wing becomes turbulent.
 
As you know, this can happen in sharp turns, pull-outs or other severe maneuvers. The '38 is designed to take the buffeting of the stall and has no tendency to fall off on either wing at any altitude. If combat necessitates, you can hold it in the accelerated stall as long as you can take the buffeting -- the ship will take it much longer. To get out of an accelerated stall immediately, ease up on the stick, permitting the airflow to reestablish normal lift.

====================================

This is not what I am finding when flying the P-38.

Here is the link ... http://www.jamesreese.org/hangarflying/index.htm

[Murdr]

Originally posted by SlapShot
Taken from an excellent link that, I believe, straffo found that ...

Funny it still says the same thing as when I posted it on page2 of "P38 still has problems" nitpicking the departure characteristics of the 38 under AH2 FM.

[Murdr]

Seriously though, for the flat spin you guys are describing, Ive found the quickest way out is through asemetrical power.  ie. chop throttle, throttle up engine opposite of spin only, just enuogh to counter the spin, chop throttle and nose down.  Done this in less than 2k alt.  I dont have dual throttle, but I do have select eng1, eng2, and eng-all mapped to my stick.  Dont know how much longer it would take using key commands.

[straffo]

Originally posted by Murdr
Funny it still says the same thing as when I posted it on page2 of "P38 still has problems" nitpicking the departure characteristics of the 38 under AH2 FM.

I plead innocent !
I didn't read the this thread (a thread speaking of a non-russian/non-german/non-british plane got little interrest for me ) I just did found this site when searching for "accelerated stall"

[SlapShot]

Originally posted by Murdr
Funny it still says the same thing as when I posted it on page2 of "P38 still has problems" nitpicking the departure characteristics of the 38 under AH2 FM.

I don't doubt that Murdr ... just trying to reiterate or keep it on the radar so to speak.

Originally posted by Murdr
Seriously though, for the flat spin you guys are describing, Ive found the quickest way out is through asemetrical power. ie. chop throttle, throttle up engine opposite of spin only, just enuogh to counter the spin, chop throttle and nose down. Done this in less than 2k alt. I dont have dual throttle, but I do have select eng1, eng2, and eng-all mapped to my stick. Dont know how much longer it would take using key commands.

Thats sounds good, but pretty desperate measures for recovery of a spin that should not really happen. I don't have the engines mapped to my HOTAS ... maybe I will try it

[Raptor]

I have recovered from flat spins by putting throttle on idle, then the nose goes down and it appears I have recovered, but when i slightly start to pull up and add a bit of throttle I spin (nose is down so its not hard to get out of that one). By this point I have lost alot of alt and when trying to pull up I hit a tree or something.
I have died more times from multiple stalls than from being actually shot down.

[Murdr]

yea, there are different degrees of spins.  I was refering to the one that the radious point is about center between the boom and tail.  That one takes a long time to get a response out of with control surfaces.

For that few seconds when the spin stops, the nose is down, and you need to pick it up fast...Ive found that lifting a majority with flaps and minimal elevator works ok for me.

I was just messin with straffo, i thought he'd find this thread

[Murdr]

LOL, Kweassa offered the same solution as I in another thread