Terror in the Sky, a Co-alt N1K2

[-duma-]

Actually Santa, in H2H there are a lot of very good 109 pilots, and flying against them in an F4U-1D has become one of my favourite fights   It's very much a game of tactics in order to get the 109 into a position where I can hit it, and I enjoy that. I think it's very easy to at least avoid 109s using this tactic.

N1Ks have terrible roll rate and not too good guns. In the D I just screw up their energy state with a few low-g barrel rolls and run  

[leonid]

I switch between the Yak-9U and La-5FN nowadays, and though the N1K2 is an aircraft to respect, I don't appear to have too much trouble with it anymore.  Neither Soviet fighter can turn with it horizontally, but both can handle the N1K2 by e-fighting.

[Lephturn]

What in the heck is a "tshjook"?  I've been playing these games a while, and I've never heard that term.  I take it this is some strange reference to the C-Hog?  Where did you guys ever come up with that name?



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Lephturn - Chief Trainer
A member of The Flying Pigs  http://www.flyingpigs.com


"My P-47 is a pretty good ship, she took a round coming 'cross the Channel last trip.
Just thinking 'bout my baby and lettin' her rip, always got me through so far."
 - Steve Earl

[Minotaur]

I am glad this discussion got off the flame and maime routine.  WTG Gents!    

From what I know the of the N1K2-J it definately  a "Late War Bird".  I expect its performance to be very exceptional.

The N1K2 was a land based Naval, heavily armed, relatively light fighter with lots of Hp.  

The N1K1 was derived from a floatplane as an air superiority fighter and a high altitude bomber interceptor (B-29).  The N1K1 was a extremely complex A/C and consequently had many problems.  A most notable design feature was a manuvering flap (on the wings leading edge) that would deploy automatically via a speed sensing device.  This gave the N1K2 an exception turn rate at mediun and low speeds.

The N1K2 was derived from the N1K1, but was greatly simplied concerning complexity of the A/C and manufacture.  Most noticable changes was that the N1K2 had a low wing vs mid wing design and much a shorter landing gear.  

Additionally, the N1K2-Ja was able to carry 4 x 250kg bombs under wing or 6 x rockets under fuselage.

Power to weight comparisons:

• N1K2-J - 1990Hp  5858-10714lbs  P/W = .34 - .19
• F4U-1 - 2000Hp  8873 - 14000lbs  P/W = .23 - .14
• Spit IX(AH) - 1565Hp  5800 - 9500lbs  P/W = .26 - .16
• 109K-4 - 2000Hp  4886 - 7937lbs  P/W = .41 - .25

N1K2 advantages:

• 4 x 20mm cannon
• Very good climb rate and acceleration at lower altitudes
• Good climb rate at and acceleration high altitudes
• Very good endurance
• Very high turn rate at medium and low speeds
• Exceptional E retention
• Moderate roll rate up to medium speeds
• Exceptional dive and very stable zoom
• Moderate top speed
• Forgiving stall and spin characteristics

N1K2 dis-advantages:

• Slow rate of cannon fire with low velocity balistics
• Low high speed turn rate
• Very low high speed roll rate
• Low overall A/C toughness

My understanding is that the N1K2 suffers at high alt, but do not be mislead by this.  It still has considerable performance being able to maintain climb rate with a P-51 and manuvers quite nicely at high alt.

My conclusion concerning fighting a N1K2 Co-Alt:

• Get it fast - moderate dive to 3O0-400mph
• Make it roll - scissor
• Keep G load moderate - low cannon ballistic speed
• Don't turn with it - suicide
• Be ready to bug out

I am really pleased 104 FM gave the N1K2 a more realistic and better FM.  

However; it is still awefully frustrating for me and my low skill ACM ability to comprehend and defeat.  I am often left doubting, did that machine beat me or did the pilot?  This is just flat wrong thinking, so I go back to the basics and figure out how to beat both.  For me the N1K2 is a very difficult nut to crack.

Please post your comments and thanks for the help!    

PS - My information states that the N1K2 climb to 19685ft (6000m) was 7.4 minutes.

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Mino
The Wrecking Crew

"Anyway, more golf..."
Humble

[This message has been edited by Minotaur (edited 10-14-2000).]

[humble]

Observations from the golf course ....hmmm they messed with the FM on my titleist, it never turned that well before...whoops wrong topic.

Anyway , I think the underlying issue here is percieved expectations...what should a particular plane do. I'd expect any japanese ride to turn well and to accelerate quickly. I due feel the new FM seriously changed the nature of the game, maybe for better in long run. However, I'm still not convinced it's "right" yet. I don't see how some of the things I see are possible, although wells gave me some pretty reasonable answers on some of it. Bottom line is many of the planes don't perform as I'd expect them to. As for Nikki co alt, I was amazed at it ability to out perform yak in vertical, could come of gas and pull some G's right to zoom and top out over you with no problem. I didnt have same problem in Tiffie under 10k or so. Nikki only plane that can turn 180 and catch you in a zoom on merge. I'd say go for front aspect snap shots and try and keep nikki turning, only problem is 4 20mm on nikki make a mistake fatal if he gets nose around on you...now where did that damm ball go, need em to model a sea plane version

[Jigster]

Actually the N1K1-Ja and N1K2 kept the basic design, the major technical issue (that could be fixed) that plauged the N1K1 was the telescoping landing gear and the tiny rudder. The lowering of the wing removed the complex gear system (wing was not changed, oil cooler was moved, flarings were kept, I've heard that it had barely any change on flight characteristics), and a full length rudder that resolved the torque issues on take off.

Flap system was the same though, automatic based on speed (and I think G loading is mixed in there too) They weren't leading edge though, those would be slats.  

- Jig

[StSanta]

Lephturn:

thsjook is my derogatory name for the chog - itĝ's how I pronounce it, and I spit a lot when I do so  .

Duma, while the N1K has a worse roll performance than the F4UD, it is still better than the G10. When fighting chogs, I either z&b them outta the sky, or saddle up for the ride. The difference in roll rate can make this tricky, but with some careful maneuvering, I am mostly succesfull. As long as I do not overshoot, the superior engine of my 109 can keep me in a lag pursuit and away from his guns. I can also disenagage at will, spiral climb and pounce again. Very enjoyable  

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StSanta
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"

[Lephturn]

Thanks StSanta,

As long as it wasn't some way to slam my beloved Jug without me knowing.  

Oink!

------------------
Lephturn - Chief Trainer
A member of The Flying Pigs  http://www.flyingpigs.com


"My P-47 is a pretty good ship, she took a round coming 'cross the Channel last trip.
Just thinking 'bout my baby and lettin' her rip, always got me through so far."
 - Steve Earl

[funked]

Mino said:    

My understanding is that the N1K2 suffers at high alt, but do not be mislead by this. It still has considerable performance being able to maintain climb rate with a P-51 and manuvers quite nicely at high alt.

Nope

     

     

And the N1K2 looks even worse when compared to the real high-altitude specialists:

     

     

Speed charts are even uglier.  N1K2 is 60-80 mph slower than these US planes at 25k.

[This message has been edited by funked (edited 10-15-2000).]