No distinctive icon for perk planes!!

[Delirium]

I like Alf's suggestion!

Edit: I like the second (bottom) suggestion only. It would save alot on the, "What that a G10, or a G6?" on open channel.

[TDeacon]

Alf has some valid points.  Unique icons for everything, at long range, would penalize some of the early war planes with "kill me" labels as well.  

However, I would prefer the distinction between sub-types to be made by actually viewing the models/skins, as currently.  For one thing, it puts all these nice models/skins to good use.  Also, there is some historical justification for this.  If I recall correctly from books, I don't think you could tell the difference between a Spit V and a Spit IX at 1000 yards.  "...The Mk IX, was essentially a Mk V with revised bearers to take the new engine and modified radiators under the wings...".

[Overlag]

Originally posted by lasersailor184
Someone once had an idea of the icon changing at different ranges.

I.E.

6.0k-3.0k standard base model like A6 Zero, or Spitfire.
3.0k-1.0k Specific Model Like A6m or Spit 9.
1.0k-0.0k Any perk plane becomes obvious.  Like a spit 14 will be a spit 9 up until it is under 1k.  Then the tag turns to spit 14.

hey that was my idea!!!

i wish HTC try and do something like this...

[Tilt]

FWIW I like Alfs suggestion

[Engine]

Innominate's right, make all the tags general.

[Wotan]

Thats not what HT is looking at engine. He is considering making all tags unique. That doesn't help those with perk tag anxiety.

Innominate the F4U-4 with 100% fuel climbs at 3500 fpm above 3k. Reduce that fuel weight and then test it.

Who cares why folks don't fly perk planes more often. There is no "lack of perk planes in the main" problem. They are perked to be rare, if the tag contributes to that then great.

On the topic of making all tags unique it will have a much greater impact on early variants of certain plane types. The AH main is almost "all late war as is". Making all tags unique will mean those lesser performance planes will be the priority targets. Who's going to fly a Spit 1 or 109E now? Almost no one flies them now but what will happen when the 51s and la7s see the "Spit I" tag? They will be all over him like white on rice. You will have the "perk tag anxiety" spread to early planes as well.

The G-6 for instance gets confused between the rocket G10 and manuverable G2 etc...

It seems to me that would be the best way to make the main all P51D's and La7's. But what do I know.

[Seeker]

Make them all general. I doubt very much if any one could tell if they were facing a 109 F or G from the cockpit; in the same way I doubt very much if someone could tell if they were facing a Spit V or IX from the cockpit.

If perks are to be hunted; then maybe a simple asterix in the icon could suffice.

But why include type at all? Why not just a red closure icon?

[Tilt]

I would prefer them general to AC type Spit, Lav, 109 etc

However before the onset of multiple skins we could see (when close up) that a Spit V was brown/green and a Spit IX was grey/green. (even if the the spit V was not doing turns the IX just cant do)

Now the skins can confuse this.

Typically skins used to reveal the sub type at 400/600 so i guess that would be the range to switch the sub type icon on.

Re hunting

Gang banging (IMO) is one aspect of game play that is not an asset to AH.


I see little evidence of folk massing to counter a perked plane..... I see a lot of evidence of folk massing to chase the "easier kill".

When in a Spit V I like the idea that my opponent may cautiously treat me as a SpitIX which I can out turn.

When in an La5 I do not like that my opponent knows I am not an La7 and so knows he can out run me etc.

Icons are pretty "gamey" now IMO. Whilst I see their use it would be neat if the info they revealed was revealed much as one might  discern it in RL.

[Edbert]

Originally posted by Seeker
I doubt very much if any one could tell if they were facing a 109 F or G from the cockpit; in the same way I doubt very much if someone could tell if they were facing a Spit V or IX from the cockpit.

Regarding the 109s you are correct, the G2 was identifiable if you got close enough to see the FAF markings, the F4/G6 we nearly indistingushable to anyone but experten. Some of the new skins will make them easier over time, like the white F4 or the one with a brown wing and a green wing. But the new skins will also make the Spi9/Spit5 harder to tell apart. I used to have no trouble seeing the brown or the gray paint. Now there's a grey Spit5 you'll have to rely on FM to tell the diff, and if you guess wrong you could be in big trouble. Of course I expect folks will be B&Zing in the spit5 soon just to make people think they're a 9 and make an error in judgement.

All I'm trying to say is that the new skins will throw a new twist on the plane ID portion of a pilots SA. I am in favor of the idea of range effecting how much info you get as was mentioned earlier, maybe not exactly as posted here but the concept is sound.

[Seeker]

I meant in real life; Edbert :-)

I've read some quotes that claim the LW were a bit jumpy after the intro of the Spit IX (at first, at least).

They went from complete confidence that the 190 was definately the Spits's master to being unsure if they were facing an inferior or an equal plane.


Imagine if the Icon merely said La? you'd never know if you were facing a 5 or a 7. What would it do to your flying? Because that's the advantage 109 and 190 drivers have at present in AH (if you can call it an advantage - I think I do.)

OTOH; one risk that's definately missing in AH is blue on blue mistakes. There were Jugs that were bounced because their wing profile wasn't recognised. There were p38's that were attacked because the RAF pilots didn't know what the hell they were (North Afrika); there were hurri's shot down simply for being in the wrong place at the wrong time.

I can see a use for specific icons in events and the CT if ALL icons were the same colour (teaches you to know your sides plane set).

Other than that, why show plane type at all?

Icons are one area, perhaps; where WWIIOL is a little bit ahead.

[Karnak]

I'd rather not see more stuff on the icons.  The more red text there is the more eye catching the icon becomes and the more you watch and fight the icon and not the plane.

I would not be massively opposed to simply having the country icon and the range indicator.  Baring that I'd like to see the ID data as small as possible.  Use lowercase letters where possible and limited to three or fewer characters.

A20
A6M
234
B17
B26
B5N
109
110
C47
D3A
F4F
F4U
F6F
190
Hur
Il2
87
88
61
67
84
Lan
Lav
LVT
LVT
163
262
M3
M8
M16
Mos
N1K
Ost
38
40
47
51
Pan
PT
SBD
Spi
TBM
Tig
Typ
Yak

[Urchin]

I'd actually be more in favor of completely generalizing the icons, like they are for the 109/190.  I think singling out the perk planes kinda sucks- I really doubt someone would have known that they were facing a Spit 14, and not a Spit 9.  An La5 looks identical to an La7 (to me anyway), F4U4 looks exactly the same as all the other F4Us... the Ta152 looks like a really ugly stretch limo version of a regular 190.

I think (like most other people seem to) that making the icons read "109F4" or "Spit5" would give away too much information.  I'd rather not know exactly which one I'm fighting than have everyone know exactly which one I am flying in.

[Edbert]

It sounds like most of us are in agreement on this subject. Some favor full disclosure icons and some prefer low disclosure icons. But one thing we all seem to agree upon is the double standard is a problem. I don't see why 109/190/F4U/51/spit get genericized icons when the La5/La7 don't. It is also 100% agreed (from numerous other threads) that it is the icon that keep the numbers down on the Spit14 usage, even though the Chog gets no special treatment.

[tactic]

I think it works both ways,IMO it dont matter if you know its  a perk plane or not, what would matter is if you were able to tell who is flying that perk plane. In the right hands they are down right scary to fly against.  whether you know its a perk plane from 6k to 200 feet is not gunna matter, someone is probley gunna see you and advise everyone your comming.  

 The icons of perk planes can disrupt the whole area they flying in, thats whats cool.  funny to hear over the vox...  oh my god! 262(spt 14, temp, etc...) over field, or the  check 6 everybody 262 diving in hard and fast, believe me it livens up the whole area, the 262 or other perk planes dont really become the hunted 90% of the time, they are the hunters like that lion that scatters the whole herd.  Dont even have to fire a shot, scream through at 600mph usually screws everybody up, after that, knowing everyone is gunna want a piece of your perk plane has its uses for sure.

It's the icon that does make it exciting to fly . when i see a perk plane  I  just hope its someone that dont know how to fly the perker plane, because if they do , it is not gunna matter if you know what plane it is, your probley gunna die.    I'm no threat in a 262 or any plane for that matter, but they dont know that, all people know is its a perk plane and they hope its someone like me in it.  

It's like, who buys a viper or bmw and removes the tags, you want people to know what ya got, (that bling bling thing) teehee.  besides a good pilot is gunna kill ya in anything,  unless he cant catch you.  Good plane or bad plane ,  icon or not if the pilot can stick it , good luck living.    No plane is a suprise to us, not like the 262 was when noone knew about it until it was shooting a plane down for the first time, after that happened we took precautions for the 262 in the areas they were likely to be encountered.

[Karnak]

tactic,

Only the 262, 163 and Tempest match your description.

Every time I fly a Mk XIV I get hunted and the few times I flew an F4U-4 or Ta152H-1 I experienced the same thing.  There are a lot of players out there than know their airplane outperforms your perk plane and they want your scalp.