The French Gov't caught red-handed

[B17Skull12]

i agree, let Putin deal with this.  they have a sizeable amount of manpower to draw from.  they don't our help.

[Chortle]

Originally posted by Ripsnort
One question that begs to be asked is...how much is the French Gov't helping arm insurgents via 3rd parties like Syria, Iran, etc.?

French involvement in Syria is limited to diplomatic personnel. Haliburton exploiting a loophole in the US trade embargo with Iran via a front company in the Cayman Islands might help arm insurgents more than selling them a few Renaults.

[Saintaw]

Why do you care, if it's french, it's cr*p, it must be... right?

[Lazerus]

An interesting subject all around. Those that are opposed to the US government actions in the last few years can and will cite similar, but not like, actions made by the US government two decades ago. Arguments can be made on both sides, but it comes down to apples an oranges. The pertinant question is what role did current governments play in supporting Iraq, either through illegal arm sales, illegal oil purchases, or illegal trade. What role did the leadership of the UN have in any of these actions? What effect, if any, did these actions have on decisions made by leaders in respect to current events?

There seems to be a cover up going on in the UN right now. The world should only hope that it is brought to light, and that if any wrongdoing is found, those responsible are handled according to their crimes. The unfortunate thing is that it is not being published by the major world media sources. Most people you talk to have no idea of any hint of what might have gone on.

[deSelys]

After the huge stockpiles of WMDs, the french SAMs...



I pity the poor pilot who got shot down in his invulnerable A10 by a crappy french missile... The shame and dishonor must be unbearable.

[Ripsnort]

Originally posted by Chortle
French involvement in Syria is limited to diplomatic personnel. Haliburton exploiting a loophole in the US trade embargo with Iran via a front company in the Cayman Islands might help arm insurgents more than selling them a few Renaults.

http://www.wlo-usa.org/Intl%20Opinion/french_connection.html

[deSelys]

Front Page Magazine...with Ann Coulter as columnist.

Exactly how neutral and unbiased is that??

[1K0N]

Originally posted by deSelys
After the huge stockpiles of WMDs, the french SAMs...



I pity the poor pilot who got shot down in his invulnerable A10 by a crappy french missile... The shame and dishonor must be unbearable.

What does this inuendo have to do with the origonal questions other than sarcasm...The article doesn't encourage any belief that french weaponry is bad or that being killed by french weaponry is a disgrace, unless you can point out I missed it in the verbage. We want to know how the equipment found its way to the area!
We know that the new cold war is with western europe, but everyone is afraid to admit it in fear of hurting feelings! Im not inclinded to be sensitive when it pertains to french treachery or should we say the new vichy france and its use of the UN for personal business transactions.

Best Regards

IKON

[deSelys]

Because, my friend, all this so-called proofs of the french treachery seem to be as volatile as the WMDs which were the main reason to inva....oops sorry free Iraq. Besides, the 'journalists' revealing those weapon sales are mostly so right-wing that they must be ashamed of their left limbs. Their credibility is hence minimal.

The USA should acknowledge that they are mad against France because it refused to admit the necessity to go to war in Iraq (not in Afghanistan, may i remind you). I have no problem with that, the right to be angry is universal. But there is absolutely no need to mount those european conspiracy theories which look just as rediculous as the 'pentagon mysteries'.

The 'cold war' your talking about is only in your head.

Lastly, the sarcasm wasn't aimed towards the article but towards all those here who bashed France for its total lack of military value...

[Ripsnort]

Originally posted by deSelys
Because, my friend, all this so-called proofs of the french treachery seem to be as volatile as the WMDs which were the main reason to inva....oops sorry free Iraq. Besides, the 'journalists' revealing those weapon sales are mostly so right-wing that they must be ashamed of their left limbs. Their credibility is hence minimal.

The USA should acknowledge that they are mad against France because it refused to admit the necessity to go to war in Iraq (not in Afghanistan, may i remind you). I have no problem with that, the right to be angry is universal. But there is absolutely no need to mount those european conspiracy theories which look just as rediculous as the 'pentagon mysteries'.

The 'cold war' your talking about is only in your head.

Lastly, the sarcasm wasn't aimed towards the article but towards all those here who bashed France for its total lack of military value...

Oil vouchers were allegedly given either as gifts or as payment for goods imported into Iraq in violation of the U.N. sanctions.

The following are the names of some of those listed as receiving Iraqi oil contracts (amounts are in millions of barrels of oil):

Russia
The Companies of the Russian Communist Party: 137 million
The Companies of the Liberal Democratic Party: 79.8 million
The Russian Committee for Solidarity with Iraq: 6.5 million and 12.5 million (two separate contracts)
Head of the Russian Presidential Cabinet: 90 million
The Russian Orthodox Church: 5 million


France
Charles Pasqua, former minister of interior: 12 million
Trafigura (Patrick Maugein), businessman: 25 million
Ibex: 47.2 million
Bernard Merimee, former French ambassador to the United Nations: 3 million
Michel Grimard, founder of the French-Iraqi Export Club: 17.1 million


Syria
Firas Mostafa Tlass, son of Syria's defense minister: 6 million

Turkey
Zeynel Abidin Erdem: more than 27 million
Lotfy Doghan: more than 11 million

Indonesia
Megawati Sukarnoputri: 11 million

[deSelys]

Ripsnort, a quote without a source is hot air.

And IF it is true, why don't you go after Russia first? Too big for you?

[straffo]

try to post a more complete list next time :
Syrie
1- Awad Amoura (plus de 18 millions de barils 18mb) 2- Bachar Nouri (plus de 12 mb) 3- Ghassan Challah (11 mb) 4- Mohammed Ammar Naoufal (3,5 mb) 5- Tamam Chehab (1 mb) 6- Hamida Naanaa (plus de 9 mb) 7- Firas Mustapha Tlass (6 mb) 8- Salim Al-Toun (3,5 mb) 9- Lotfi Fawzi (2,5 mb) 10- Lid pour les réalisations (3,5 mb) 11- Ghassan Zaccaria (6 mb) 12- Mohammed Maamoun Sabii (4 mb) 13- Hassan Kayyal (2 mb) 14- Anwar Al Aqad (2 mb)


Oman
1- Groupe Chanfari (5 mb)


Chypre
1- Mohammed Al Houni (plus de 17 mb) 2- Naphta Petrolium (13,2 mb) 3- Continental (3 mb)


Turquie
1- Zeinelabidine Ardam (plus de 27 mb) 2- Lotfi Dougane (plus de 11 mb) 3- Mohammed Aslan (13 mb) 4- Takfun (15,5 mb) 5- KCK entreprise (1,5 mb) 6- Delta Petrolium (4 mb) 7- SITA (2 mb) 8- OZIA (2 mb) 9- SAMIR (2 mb) 10- Muhtashem (2 mb) 11- Mukdar Sajzine (2 mb)


Vietnam
1- Finapco (1,2 mb) 2- Darlink Med (3 mb) 3- Fina Food (6 mb) 4- OSC (2 tonnes)


Soudan
1- Smaso (8 mb) 2- Entrprise de production de pétrole (2 tonnes) 3- Oil Plus (2 tonnes)


Yémen
1- Abdelkarim Al-Aryani (7,8 mb) 2- Toufik Abdelrahim (1,5 mb) 3- Chaher Abdelhak (plus de 7 mb)


Bengladesh
1- Moulana Abdelmannan (43,2 mb)


Inde
1- Biham Think (5,5 mb) 2- La parti du Congrès (4 mb)


Pakistan
1- Oil & Gas Group (10 tonnes) 2- Abou Abdelrahmane (11,5 tonnes) 3- Monsieur Azzaz (1 tonne)


Malaisie
1- Fayek Ahmed Chérif (12,5 mb) 2- BITMAL (4 mb) 3- Trad Beer (4 mb) 4- Mastek (Fayek Ahmed Chérif) (57 mb) 5- Hawala (7 mb)


Indonésie
1- La fille du président Suharto (2 mb) 2- Hawa Atlantic (2 mb) 3- Makram Hakim (3 mb) 4- Mégawati (8 mb) 5- Mohammed Amine Rayes (4 mb) 6- Natona Oil (2 mb)


Émirats arabes unis
1- Val Petroleum (1,8 mb) 2- Ahmed Maneh Saïd Al Outaïba ( 11 mb) 3- Jiwan Oil (4 mb) 4- Sultan Bin Zayed Al Nahyan (7,5 mb) 5- Al Hoda (22,9 mb) 6- Issa Bin Zayed AL Nahyan (5 mb) 7- Millinium (2 tonnes) 8- Bonny Fioul (1 tonne)


Maroc
1- Abdallah Salaoui (7,2 mb) 2- Nadel Hachémi (5,7 mb) 3- Mohammed Basri (4,5 mb)


Algérie
1- Abdelmagid Attar (6 mb) 2- Abdelkader Bin Moussa (6 mb)


Tunisie
1- Makades Petrolium (6,7 mb) 2- Vernaco (3,7 mb) 3- Maidor (4 mb)


Italie
1- Roberto Frimigoni (24,5) 2- Selvatori Nikotra (20 mb) 3- Monsieur Felloni (6,5 mb) 4- Père Benjamin (4,5 mb) 5- West Petrol (2 tonnes) 6- Hetrelk (2 tonnes) 7- ABS (1 tonne) 8- Association pétrolière italienne (1 tonne)


Espagne
1- Bassem Kakich (17,5 mb) 2- Javier Robert (9,8 mb) 3- Ali Balloute (8,8 mb)


Yougoslavie
1- Parti socialiste (22 mb) 2- Parti de gauche [JUL ?] (9,5 mb) 3- Parti italien [en Croatie ?] (16 mb) 4- Parti de Kostunica [DSS] (6 mb)


Biélorussie
1- Parti libéral (6 mb) 2- Parti communiste biélorusse (7 tonnes) 3- Entreprise Bielminal (14,2 mb) 4- Entreprise Bielpharm (4 mb) 5- Directeur du cabinet de la présidence (6 mb) 6- Entreprise Lada (2 mb)


Roumanie
1- Ylef Adrelnec (1 mb) 2- Parti du Travail roumain (5,5 mb)


Grande Bretagne
1- George Galloway / Fawwaz Zreikate (19 mb) 2- Moudjahidin du peuple (36,5 mb)


Canada
1- Arthur Mel Holland (9,6 mb)


Etats-Unis
1- Chaker Khafaji (7 mb) 2- Samir Vest. (10,5 mb)


Tchad
1- Ministre des Affaires étrangères (3 mb)


Thaïlande
1- Exportateur du riz Gaïborn (9,5 mb)


Panama
1- Monsieur Sifane (11,5 mb)


Hongrie
1- Parti de l'Intérêt hongrois (4,7 mb)


Afrique du Sud
1- Envium Manangment (Sandi Majali) (9 mb) 2- Tokyo Sixweel (4 mb) 3- Montica (4 mb) 4- Omni Adil (4 mb)

Philippines
1- Consortium des producteurs philippins (3 mb)


Pays-Bas
1- Say Polt (3 mb)


France
1- Adax (3 / 8 mb) 2- Traficora (Patrick Mougin) (25 mb) 3- Michel Grimard (1 / 17 mb) 4- Association d'amitié franco-arabe (15,1 mb) 5- X (47,2 mb) 6- Charles Pasqua (12 mb) 7- Elias Ferzli (14,6 mb) 8- A Lotus (Claude Caspar) (4 mb) 9- Bernard Miramé (3 mb) 10- Bernard Miramé (8 mb) 11- Di Suza (11 mb)


Chine
1- Monsieur Juan (39,1 mb) 2- Noresco (17,5 mb) 3- Zyng Rong (13 mb) 4- Byourg (13,5 mb) 5- Thouth Holken (1 mb)


Jordanie
1- Leïth Chbaïlate (15,5 mb) 2- Fakhri Kaouar (6 mb) 3- Grands Ressources (2 mb) 4- Al-Rachid International (Ahmed Al Bachir) (9 mb) 5- Fawwaz Zreikate (6 mb) 6- Salem Naass (6 mb) 7- Ziyad Ragheb (7 mb) 8- Machhour Hadissa (4 mb) 9- Chaker Bin Zaïd (6,5 mb) 10- Mohammed Saleh Hourani (4 mb) 11- Toujane Al Fayçal (3 mb) 12- Ministère de l'Energie (5 mb) 13- Ziyad Yaghmour (2 mb) 14- Wamid Hussein (1 mb)


Palestine
1- Abou Abbas (11,5 mb) 2- Abdallah Hourani (8 mb) 3- Wafa Toufik Sayegh (3,5 mb) 4- OLP (4 mb) 5- FPLP (5 mb) 6- Département politique de l'OLP (5 mb)


Égypte
1- Incom (Mohammed Chattate) (14 mb) 2- Abdelazim Manaf (6 mb) 3- Khaled Gamal Abdel Nacer (16,5 mb) 4- Imad Jelda (14 mb) 5- Mohammed Salah (7 mb) 6- Mohammed Helmi (4,5 mb) 7- Entreprises arabes unies (6 mb) 8- Entreprise Nil-Euphrate (3 mb) 9- Mahmoud Majdi Maasraoui (7 mb) 10- Entreprise Alhami Bachandi (2 mb) 11- Entreprise Moultaka al Daouli (2 mb)


Liban
1- BP Energy (2 mb) 2- Fadi Almieh (2 mb) 3- Haïtham Sidani (2 mb) 4- Planet Petrolium (1 mb) 5- Georges Tarkhanian (7 mb) 6- Le fils du président Lahoud (4,5 mb) 7- Ali Tohmé (1 mb) 8- Entreprise Al Hilal (Adnan Janabi) (1 mb) 9- Entreprise internationale pour le commerce et l'investissement (3 mb) 10- Fayçal Dernaïka (3 mb) 11- FIM Oil (1 mb) 12- Najah Wakim (3 mb) 13- Oussama Maarouf (3 mb) 14- Zouhair Al Khatib (3,5 mb)


Bahreïn
1- Entreprise Kazem Darrazi (2 mb) 2- Ent. Ali Al Mouslem (3 mb) 3- Ent. Concret pour constructions (2 mb)


Arabie Saoudite
1 - Entreprise Naja (3 mb) 2 - ASSIS entreprise (2 mb)


Qatar
1- Hamas Ali Al Thani (14 mb) 2- Dalimi Group (4 mb) 3- Gulf Petrolium (2 mb) 4- Petrolina Oil (2 mb) 5- Entreprise d'entretien des puits pétroliers (2 mb)


Libye
1- Choukri Ghanem (1 mb)


Brésil
1- Fouad Sarhane (10 mb) 2- Mouvement du 8 octobre (Chaviez) (4,5 mb)


Irlande
1- Riad Taher (11 mb) 2- Afro Eastern (2 mb)


Nigeria
1- Haisson (7,2 mb) 2- Entreprise ZAZ (7,5 mb) 3- Entreprise IEG (ambassadeur du Nigeria) (1 mb) 4- Campaq (4 mb)


Kenya
1- Mohammed Othman Saïd (10,5 mb)


Bulgarie
1- Parti socialiste bulgare (12 mb) 2- Arak Pol (2 mb)


Autriche
1- Hunz Kolger (3 mb) 2- Association arabo-autrichienne (1 mb)


Suisse
1- Media (2 mb) 2- Delta Service (2 mb) 3- Iblom (1 mb) 4- Sepool (2 mb) 5- Klinko (12 mb) 6- Lakia (2 mb) 7- Alkon (23 mb) 8- Toros (8 mb) 9- Petrogas (5 mb) 10- Finar (21 mb) 11- Napkes (3 mb)


Slovaquie
1- Parti communiste slovaque (4 mb)


Ukraine
1- Parti démocrate social (8,5 mb) 2- Parti communiste ukrainien (6 mb) 3- Energy Ressources (2 mb) 4- Naphto Gas (8 mb) 5- Vasmach Imbex (2 mb) 6- Hu (Sokolov) (5 mb) 7- Orchatski (4,5 mb) 8- Fider Alti Torkomvki (1 mb) 9- Trans Esco (1 mb) 10- Maison Ukrainienne (10 mb) 11- FTD (2 mb) 12- Parti socialiste ukrainien (2 mb)


Russie
Les documents concernant la Russie font ressortir des dons de l'ordre de 1,336 milliard de barils. Cette précision concerne seulement les dons à l'Etat de Russie. Quant aux particuliers, organisations et partis : la liste s'établie comme suit :

1. Ent. Zarabachkand (176,5 mb) 2- Russ Napht Embex (Azakof du cabiet présidentiel) (86,9 mb, dont 1 mb qui revient à l'ambassadeur russe à Bagdad). 3- Les entreprise du Parti communiste russe (137 mb) 4- Amercom (ministère des situations d'urgences) (57 mb) 5- Entreprise M-chino-import (83,5 mb) 6- Alpha Eco (ministère des Affaires étrangères) (128,8 mb) 7- Petromin (Ministère des Affaires étrangères) (30,1 mb) 8- Slav Naphte (Gotisrev 25,5 mb) 9- Zan Gas (49,1 mb) 10- Russ Napht (35,5 mb) 11- Kazine Invest (8,5 mb) 12- Kalm Napht-Gas (7,5 mb) 13- Gasprom (26 mb) 14- Tat Napht (Tatarestan) (64,5 mb) 15- Bach Napht (12 mb) 16- Louk Oil (64 mb) 17- Sergot Napht(-Gas (4 mb) 18- Siberia Napht-Gas (1 mb) 19- Naphta Moscou (25,1 mb) 20- Onaco (22,2 mb) 21- Sidanco (21,2 mb) 22- Sibnapht (8,1 mb) 23- Trans Napht (9 mb) 24- Yokos (2 mb) 25- Entreprises du parti libéral démocrate (Jérinovski) (79,8 mb) 26- Entreprises du parti de la paix et de l'unité (34 mb) 27- Comité russe de solidarité avec l'Irak (6,5 mb) 28- Association russe de solidarité avec l'Irak (12,5 mb) 29- Russ Napht-Gas export (12,5 mb) 30- Oral Invest (8,5 mb) 31- Académie moscovite des sciences (3,5 mb) 32- Raoumine (fils de l'ancien ambassadeur à Bagdad 19,7 mb) 33- Université Gopken (3,5 mb) 34- Group Northwest (2 mb) 35- Gas Prom (Monsieur Hassan 3 mb dont 1 million livré) 36- Nicolas Rijkov (13 mb) 37- Story Napht & Gas (6 mb) 38- Akht Napht (4,5 mpb) 39- Administration tchétchène (2 mb) 40- Adel Hilaoui (A.N.M aviation) (5 mb) 41- Khrouzelt (5 mb) 42- Trans Naphta (3 mb) 43- Directeur du cabinet présidentiel (5 mb) 44- Eglise orthodoxe de Russie (5 mb) 45- Parti nationaliste russe (2 mb)

[Lazerus]

Originally posted by deSelys
Because, my friend, all this so-called proofs of the french treachery seem to be as volatile as the WMDs which were the main reason to inva....oops sorry

....oops, sorry.

WMD class weapons have been found in Iraq, since the war started, that have the potential to kill 500,000 people. Iraq had an active nuclear program, some of the hardware that they payed for to promote this program has been found, and displayed to the major media.

The contacts with al-quaida have been substantiated.

The attempts to purchase yellowcake from  African nations have been substantiated.

The fact that the evidence of these findings have been ignored by the major news outlets is telling. They could have reported them without drawing conclusions, just reported what has been found out.

[Ripsnort]

Originally posted by deSelys
Ripsnort, a quote without a source is hot air.

And IF it is true, why don't you go after Russia first? Too big for you?

ABC news.  This was all over the world news a year ago, where were you?

The thread is about the French, not the Russians.

[deSelys]

Lazerus, good boy...

All check!



Don't you think that if significant WMDs had been found, GWB would use the findings to support his re-election campaign?? The silence is deafening.


Ripsnort: yes, I've already heard about that. I don't say that it is false, but the proofs are weak and unconclusive at best.


And about the arm sales in violation of the UN sanctions taken after the 1st Gulf War, according to Amnesty international the culprits are Russia, China & Portugal.

France sold Mirages F1, Gazelle helicopters and missiles to Iraq before  1991. While USA, UK and Germany supported the Iraq WMD chemical program.

The arm sales after 1991 have been done by Eastern Europe countries.

Source and source