Author Topic: Can you say.....  (Read 792 times)

Offline stegor

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Can you say.....
« on: September 22, 2004, 05:38:19 AM »
I came upon this somewhere:

Quote
"The magical four steps were: 'See - Decide - Attack - Reverse, or Coffee Break.' In lay terms, spot the enemy, decide if he can be attacked or surprised, attack him, and break away immediately after striking; or if he spots you before you strike, take a 'coffee break' -- wait -- pull off the enemy and don't get into a turning battle with a foe who knows you are there."


Erich Hartmann
The World's Leading Ace
352 victories, WWII




Can you say this guy was a "timid fighter"??
Why if someone act like this in AH he is called runner, cherry picker, timid and so on ........

Leavin out  the  "I am a furballer, I like to kill and combat only, I'm a gamer, I'm a lamer,  I'm a whiner, this is not a simulation, there is no fun, this is not real life, I want others fight and die my way ,and so on ...." things ......   it  seems perfect to me, what's your opinion??

Ehehe, come on whiners;)
Nibbio
4° Stormo C.T. "F. Baracca"


Offline Redd

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Re: Can you say.....
« Reply #1 on: September 22, 2004, 05:59:04 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by stegor
I came upon this somewhere:

 


Can you say this guy was a "timid fighter"??
Why if someone act like this in AH he is called runner, cherry picker, timid and so on ........

Leavin out  the  "I am a furballer, I like to kill and combat only, I'm a gamer, I'm a lamer,  I'm a whiner, this is not a simulation, there is no fun, this is not real life, I want others fight and die my way ,and so on ...." things ......   it  seems perfect to me, what's your opinion??

Ehehe, come on whiners;)



If you want to play the game  that way , that's fine , whatever floats your boat.  I don't tell you how to spend your $15.


I wouldn't play that way , I'd find it really boring , but if my life really depended on it , well that's another thing, you betcha , I reckon he had the formula down pretty good.

Not sure what your looking for, I think this discussion has been done to death over the years hasn't it.
I come from a land downunder

Offline beet1e

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Can you say.....
« Reply #2 on: September 22, 2004, 07:05:06 AM »
Stegor - I agree, but such RL tactics are frowned upon by certain segments of the AH community, who believe you are doing it all wrong unless every engagement is an angles fight on the deck.

I personally played AH to see how various aircraft would perform in different conditions - different altitudes etc. For example, a P47D25 or D30 is very good at high altitude (15K+) so that's how I'd use it. One of the main strengths was the dive performance, and recovery using the paddle prop - described at length in Francis Gabreski's autobiography. In no way were those variants turn fiters or "weed wackers™".  But if you fly a plane like that in the MA the way Gabreski flew it in RL, you're likely to be castigated as an "alt monkey".

I recently watched a documentary about Von Richtofen (Red Baron) and the technique used by him and other aces was to stay on the edge of a fight and "cherrypick", leaving the mere mortals to do the meat grinding. The RB once made the fatal mistake of getting out of position, swooping too low, and was killed by ground fire - an Australian .303 round.

Offline Delirium

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Can you say.....
« Reply #3 on: September 22, 2004, 07:21:54 AM »
Again, this is a game, this is not war nor is it real life.

If it was, we would ALL be flying differently.

Comparing real life hunters to virtual ones is akin to comparing apples to oranges.

Edit: Flying the 'safe' way is ok for scenarios imho, but if you do that daily in the MA, you are never going to learn.
Delirium
80th "Headhunters"
Retired AH Trainer (but still teach the P38 selectively)

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Offline VOR

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Can you say.....
« Reply #4 on: September 22, 2004, 07:34:11 AM »
Realism has no place in this sim. :D

Offline Westy

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Can you say.....
« Reply #5 on: September 22, 2004, 07:35:39 AM »
To be quite fair none of the air combat found in the MA is a reflection of RL (WWII) at all.   The ACM done can be but certainly not the combat as the environment is more applicable to fighting on Mars than in WWII.

Offline beet1e

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Can you say.....
« Reply #6 on: September 22, 2004, 08:08:11 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Delirium
Again, this is a game, this is not war nor is it real life.

If it was, we would ALL be flying differently.

Comparing real life hunters to virtual ones is akin to comparing apples to oranges.
Del, we are all at liberty to play this game and interpret it how we want. I was neither a gamer nor a pure simmer, but something in between - preferring WW2 re-enactments to the somewhat hypothetical weed wacking Spit V duels, and the quest to land more kills in a couple of hours than some accomplished pilots achieved in two wars spanning ten years.
Quote
Edit: Flying the 'safe' way is ok for scenarios imho, but if you do that daily in the MA, you are never going to learn.
In RL WW2, it was all scenarios. They had only one life. Did that mean that they were never going to learn? Learn WHAT?

Online Shane

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Can you say.....
« Reply #7 on: September 22, 2004, 08:17:53 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by beet1e
In RL WW2, it was all scenarios. They had only one life. Did that mean that they were never going to learn? Learn WHAT?


apples and oranges beet1e.  i thought you were more intelligent than this.  guess i was wrong - what a first!
Surrounded by suck and underwhelmed with mediocrity.
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Offline Zanth

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Re: Can you say.....
« Reply #8 on: September 22, 2004, 08:21:14 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by stegor
I came upon this somewhere:

 


Can you say this guy was a "timid fighter"??
Why if someone act like this in AH he is called runner, cherry picker, timid and so on ........

Leavin out  the  "I am a furballer, I like to kill and combat only, I'm a gamer, I'm a lamer,  I'm a whiner, this is not a simulation, there is no fun, this is not real life, I want others fight and die my way ,and so on ...." things ......   it  seems perfect to me, what's your opinion??

Ehehe, come on whiners;)



Germans in 1944 had the disadvantage of really dieing when they got shot.

Offline DipStick

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Re: Can you say.....
« Reply #9 on: September 22, 2004, 09:14:41 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by stegor
Can you say this guy was a "timid fighter"??

Yes and with good reason. It was real life not a game. Make no mistake, I have no doubt I and everybody else, would've flown the same way.

This however is a game. A game we pay to play. Most of us only have an hour or 2 to play when we can. I don't want to fly 45 mins to b-n-z 1 or 2 planes in that hour. To me that is just boring AND stupid. Fly that way if you like.

On the other hand upping almost any plane, meeting somebody 1/2 way between bases at 5-8k and duking it out IS fun. I can do this a few times in my hour, have fun and log off with a smile. Win or lose it's fun and gets the blood pumping. That's why I pay for it.

My $.02

Offline Mugzeee

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Can you say.....
« Reply #10 on: September 22, 2004, 10:06:27 AM »
Fly anyway you wish. Pay no attention to the man behind the curtian spewing insults. Squelch ch200 squelch the CPID. and be done with it. The difference from RL vs AH2 is the ability communicate with the Foe.
It matters not what others say or think if you want to fly a certian way. You may be called a runner a picker an alt dweeb ect.
Think of it this way...every last one of us could be called any of the above in the MA environment for we are all guily of it. In fact its hard to avoid given nearly every scenario will afford such an outcome. If its Duels you want the go to the DA and prove you are a good 1v1er.
If it the MA title you seek the do what ever it takes to acheive your goal. Pay no attention to the Mouths. :aok
Look at Fester for example. Every single time he has killed me it has been from Alt and a snap shot to boot. Hes very good at it.
I have never ever found Fester lower than me. Im sure others have but i havent. Do i call him an Alt monkey? No.
He has a style. If i want to compete with his style then i will have to change mine. :aok

Offline Delirium

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Can you say.....
« Reply #11 on: September 22, 2004, 06:25:12 PM »
Basket weaving, what else?

Quote
Originally posted by beet1e
Did that mean that they were never going to learn? Learn WHAT?
Delirium
80th "Headhunters"
Retired AH Trainer (but still teach the P38 selectively)

I found an air leak in my inflatable sheep and plugged the hole! Honest!

Offline anton

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Can you say.....
« Reply #12 on: September 22, 2004, 08:13:50 PM »
If every AH player played that way, we would have an incredibley boring game.

Thankfully only about half our current player base plays this way, so the game doesn't completely duck sick, yet.


I immagine that for every 5-10 new players entering the game, a veteran leaves. Eventually, no one will even remember when you could actually find Air Combat in AH.:rolleyes:


Anton

Offline Morpheus

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Can you say.....
« Reply #13 on: September 22, 2004, 09:37:07 PM »
Quote
it seems perfect to me, what's your opinion??


Indeed it is... A wonderful troll you have gotten yourself here. :)

You've even gotten some biting already. ;)
If you don't receive Jesus Christ, you don't receive the gift of righteousness.

Be A WARRIOR NOT A WORRIER!

Offline beet1e

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Can you say.....
« Reply #14 on: September 23, 2004, 05:38:29 AM »
Hey Anton, are you =Ant== from WB - the P39 ace in the music business from NY who moved to CA?