Author Topic: How do you guys do it? (Read 2299 times)

MaddogJoe · « **on:** October 11, 2004, 06:29:38 AM »

Nomak was kind enough to post that he was willing to help anyone with some training...and I'm still planning on hooking up with ya Nomak.... but it got me thinking of what I was looking to find in a training session. Going over what I feel are my weaknesses... and there are many to choose from

I figured out what my biggest problem is, targeting!

Now before ya'll jump on the "targeting in harder in AH2/ no it isn't" train ride a couple of things from my point of view. When AH1 was phazed out I was in the 10% range of hit as a fighter, and was pretty happy with that. All during the beta time I flew in AH2 I was still hitting pretty much in that area.... well I seemed to be getting the hits about as often seeing as there are no "stats" for AH2 beta. However it seems to me my aim has gone south and just won't come back ! If I get into the 2% range now I'm on fire !!

So the question is, does anyone have any tips on how to aim? Yes I know I can spend hours shooting drones from every angle I can think of but I just don't have that kind of time to play. Some of you guys seem to have a "feel" for when to shoot. Watching some of these films amaze me on how many kills you get, by having to fire only short bursts.

So any training tips I could use? Visuale clues as to when to fire? Timing marks? Lazer guided systems I could DL? OK HTC may frown on that last one

but the big question is "How do you guys do it?"

JB73 · « **Reply #1 on:** October 11, 2004, 09:06:10 AM »

i went from 10's and 11's hit % in AH 1 down to low 3% in AHII...

and i have NO clue what i am doing different,

all i know is at D200 (icon says 200 meaning 200-400 yards according to HTC) with my conv set to 350, flying flat and level i can NOT hit a bomber dead 6.

the other night i was D400 (no + or -) chasing a 190 in my 190... fired 295 cannons, and MG bursts each time too (probably 400+ rounds), never got a single hit sprite.

i too would like to know WTF i am doing "wrong" or what i havent found out about the new AHII dispersion, whatever.

Dead Man Flying · « **Reply #2 on:** October 11, 2004, 09:13:50 AM »

The biggest difference is damage model granularity. In AH1, near misses were scored as hits whereas in AH2 they are scored as misses. This seems to be the biggest problem area for people, and I'm not sure it's possible to ever completely make up the difference through fixing convergence or practicing aim.

The best advice I can give is to bring your convergence in close -- I have mine set to 225 yards for all guns -- and then only fire when in close. This lowers the probability of missing with rounds that would have once hit the enemy.

-- Todd/Leviathn

Murdr · « **Reply #3 on:** October 11, 2004, 09:41:57 AM »

Im no crack shot myself, but I did down a nik last night firing a total of 5 20mm rnds, and a spit with 2 20mm rnds a few weeks ago. In both cases I had at least a 5 second window with them in front of me before I fired. I was paitent and waited for the right site picture.
How I adjusted was by turning tracers off for a few flights, which really makes you concentrate on the site picture. After seeing what types of shots I was missing, I would turn them back on and look for those same type of shots to see how far off I was missing, and then repeat the process. Some shots are just alot harder in AH2, but usually if you're patient you can maneuver your way into the site picture that you're good at connecting with. I think if you look at films, good shots either maneuver into a shot they cant miss, or are patient and just follow their target until they see the perfect site picture.

Urchin · « **Reply #4 on:** October 11, 2004, 10:36:55 AM »

Well, I'm flying a lot of US planes since the release of AH2, so my hit % isn't exactly comparable to my AH1 hit% (where I flew mostly LW).. but I don't have all that hard a time hitting shots.

I've always had my convergence set pretty close, and I fire around convergence range. Mostly though, you just get a feel for when to fire and where to aim when you do fire.

Flying a plane that doesn't have a whole lot of firepower but has the same kind of guns as the plane you want to improve your aim in is helpful to (ex P-51B for .50s, 109F for LW). That way you get used to actually aiming, and making every round count. Then you can hop back in your favorite ride and make use of your new found careful aim. When you start getting lazy again, jump back into your weakgunned plane for a few sorties to refresh your memory.

MOSQ · « **Reply #5 on:** October 11, 2004, 12:26:54 PM »

I've found the plane form shots (a plane crossing in front of you usually during a scissors) are about the same. It's the dead 6 shots which are much more difficult. Many times I have been 200 to 600 behind a dead 6 plane and landed almost no hits. Sometimes I think the safest thing to do if you have an enemy plane on your six is just fly straight and level until he runs out of ammo! If you try to turn he'll catch you in a crossing shot or deflection shot which seem to have much higher hit probabilities.

I know a couple of enemies have broke off after unloading a whole clip on my 6. And I've run through an entire ammo load in a Typhie at D 200-400 right on a P-38's 6. The situation then reversed when I went to RTB no ammo, and he unloaded all his ammo on my Tiffie. He pinged me, but no kill hits and I made it back.

BigMax · « **Reply #6 on:** October 11, 2004, 12:50:38 PM »

I wish we had a WWII ace to ask....

I'm thinking the model from the dead six is better, Levi's description seems very accurate to me. The hit bubble is smaller so you simply have to be more accurate - couple that with the fact that the distance markers are no longer in feet, but in hundreds... It completely changes your lead and projectile drop.

Your comments have been very helpful to me guys... I have suffered the same "decline" in accuracy since the switch. But having read your posts, I think I'll now get back to where I was. Thanks!

One last thought, I read that in WW2 the gunsights' width were such that pilots would use them, outter and inner rings, to gage distances. Perhaps it's time to return to the "old" methods...?

Murdr · « **Reply #7 on:** October 11, 2004, 04:54:25 PM »

Just to add one more point on the "site picture" concept. If you are spraying away 200-400 behind an nmy and get a few hit sprites, you really have no idea where your aiming point was when those couple hits were fired. OTOH if you burst, pause, burst, pause, and one of those bursts yeild hits, you know what that site picture looked like when you fired.

Now if you look at a film of somebody like DMF you will notice he usually fires short bursts very effectively. He seems to have a library of site pictures in his head that yeild hits, and doesnt often fire until seeing one of those site pictures.

So I think in some ways the key is not going for every possible shot you see, but instead looking for shots that you are good at to develop. Dead 6 shots are hard. I usually fire very short burst at that site picture for 2 reasons. One I may get lucky and find the right aim point, but more importantly I am looking to force some maneuvering on their part to give me a site picture that is better for me to hit. Part of gunnery is setting up the shot.

MaddogJoe · « **Reply #8 on:** October 11, 2004, 05:33:58 PM »

so Murdr, you use tracers more often than not then right? How do you find your site picture? I have the hardest time seeing if I hit anything with a burst with all that smoke in the way. Maybe my bursts are too long....hmmm So film, view films, memorise "site pictures" and only go for shoots that your good at.

I pride myself at getting in close for the shot. Once on someones six I think I'm very hard to shake. I'll follow and lay a burst out at where the next move the enemy makes is likley to be. This is one of the things that makes me a terrible furballer! Some people call me "target fixated", but I do use my SA while waiting for my shot. Most times however 3 other guys get him before my shot showes up

Ok back to the wars !! Thanks for the tips !!!

for those of you with films

Murdr · « **Reply #9 on:** October 11, 2004, 05:54:42 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by MaddogJoe
so Murdr, you use tracers more often than not then right? How do you find your site picture? I have the hardest time seeing if I hit anything with a burst with all that smoke in the way. Maybe my bursts are too long....hmmm So film, view films, memorise "site pictures" and only go for shoots that your good at.

For more than a year prior to AH2 I didnt use tracers at all. Now I use them about 1/2 the time, mostly cuz i forget to switch it after an osti sortie.

Like I said, if you make a few flights without tracers you will find yourself quickly being more picky with the shots you take because you dont have them as a reference. It kind of forces you to conciously only look for shots that you can hit. Another way to do that is fly something with a low bullet count like a la5. If you make yourself fly every once in awhile being very picky with shots, you start to naturally get an instinct on what is and isnt a good site picture.

pellik · « **Reply #10 on:** October 21, 2004, 01:56:19 AM »

It's been my opinion that the biggest difference in gunnery between AH1 and AH2 is feedback. In AH1 you could see those hit sprites no matter what. Target below your nose? Hit sprites still visable. But now in AH2 you don't necessarily even get hit sprites when you land a shot. I've fired at someone, seen no reaction, and turned off only to notice the guy is now missing his tail. I think the reason your gunnery has been in decline since the release is due to this. When you can't tell that something works, you won't know to do it again the next time around.

-pellik

Nomak · « **Reply #11 on:** October 21, 2004, 06:01:55 PM »

Hey MD..... Sorry I havnt been around the last couple weeks. I will be up tonight and ill be lookin for yas!

Dave

MaddogJoe · « **Reply #12 on:** October 23, 2004, 11:25:15 AM »

Thanks Nomak, got squad night tonight, but if I can get on early maybe we can hook up

~~Pellik, got to watch your film 2vs1 a few times, if I could shoot like that I'd be ok ! LOL!! Those guys weren't too aggresive, but they did keep ya busy, nice flying! and thanks for posting it !~~

Marco · « **Reply #13 on:** October 23, 2004, 12:02:16 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Dead Man Flying
The biggest difference is damage model granularity. In AH1, near misses were scored as hits whereas in AH2 they are scored as misses. This seems to be the biggest problem area for people, and I'm not sure it's possible to ever completely make up the difference through fixing convergence or practicing aim.
Quote

---------------------------------------------
Rgr, i have the prob alot.

It gets almost, Indecent, cant think of any other way to say or dumb. People try and try to shoot cons down but now its a miss, not near miss as in AH1 - a hit was a kill, Not a miss.

Nomak · « **Reply #14 on:** October 23, 2004, 07:55:30 PM »

I was wondering how you were feeling after our first "Session" MD? I thought it went very well and I felt like I was able to lay alot of info on the table for ya.

Im just wondering. Thx MD

Dave