Author Topic: Kerry's Dishonorable Discharge? Prosecution for Treason? (Read 789 times)

Dago · « **Reply #15 on:** October 28, 2004, 11:19:43 AM »

LOL, he can't hear any alarm bells in his head because of the voices, the voices whispering "Bush bad, Kerry good, Bush bad, Kerry good"

dago

Sikboy · « **Reply #16 on:** October 28, 2004, 11:34:40 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Flit
DD 214 is not a form-it's your entire record of service, which is what Kerry refuses to release

That's odd, my DD 214 is a form.

-Sik

Flit · « **Reply #17 on:** October 28, 2004, 12:01:08 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Sikboy
That's odd, my DD 214 is a form.

-Sik

I stand corrected
Got it mixed up with 201 file maybe?

MOSQ · « **Reply #18 on:** October 28, 2004, 12:17:41 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Phaser11
Hey all.
I just went on the Kerry web site. His DD-214 is there and says he did get an honorable discharge. Why don't you guys do a little more reaserach FIRST!
I'm voting for Bush and you're making us look bad.
Thanks for nothing.

Phaser, if you had read the article closely you would have seen that Kerry now has an Honorable Discharge. The question is did he originally have a Dishonorable Discharge and loss of his medals, then much later after Carter signed the executive order, petitioned to have his discharge reviewed and subsequently changed to Honorable and have his medals reinstated.

If he would sign the form 180 either the Federalist will look like a fool, or Kerry will be disgraced.

Why won't he sign the form 180? Bush did.

And the larger issue:
Constitution's Fourteenth Amendment, Section 3.

The pertinent language states: "No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice-President ... having previously taken an oath ... to support the Constitution of the United States, [who has] engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof."

I can see a constitutional crisis looming. The right wing will press this issue to the hilt. How would this be resolved? Are we looking at another impeachment process?

Toad · « **Reply #19 on:** October 28, 2004, 12:30:08 PM »

Check the dates on the DD214 on Kerry's website.

The "Transfer or Discharge Data" block shows the date as 15 Dec 66. It's his discharge from U.S. Naval Officer Candidate School, not his final discharge from the USN.

You guys need to read this stuff a little closer.

It does say that "No Discharge Certificate Issued at time of Separation" and "Continuing on Active Duty as Ensign, USNR".

So, Kerry posted what is, IMO, a very misleading DD214. I think he should just sign the form for the FULL RELEASE of his records.

There IS, however, a DD215 that corrects his date of separation from active duty to 03-01-70. It also corrects some awards. Interestingly, this DD215 is dated 2001/03/12. Makes me wonder WHY anyone would bother correcting his Reserve separation date 30 years later. If anything stinks of dead fish in all this... this is the first whiff.

But his records ALSO show a letter of Honorable Discharge from the Reserves on Feb 16, 1978. I'd think it would be hard to get an Honorable from the Reserves without getting about the same from active duty.

slimm50 · « **Reply #20 on:** October 28, 2004, 12:59:10 PM »

I don't give a rat's bellybutton about Kerry's or Bush's war record(s). Kerry's Congressional voting record, alone, is enough for me to vote for Bush.

Phaser11 · « **Reply #21 on:** October 28, 2004, 01:30:42 PM »

OH!

Does that meen he will go away now?

Mini D · « **Reply #22 on:** October 29, 2004, 12:18:49 AM »

Your DD214 shows your last discharge status. "Other than honorable" can be changed to "honorable" over time and it will not show up on a DD214. That is... you can be discharged under "other than honorable" and have that status changed some time down the road to "honorable" by filing a request... which is almost automatically granted. The "honorable" status doesn't really mean squat unless it was granted at the separation date.

LePaul · « **Reply #23 on:** October 29, 2004, 01:31:52 AM »

But...but!

See the press *demanded* Bush documents and got em. He's also released his financial data too.

Kerry hasnt opened up his "proud" military history nor has he fully released his financial data, nor his sugar momma, err, wife

I've also heard that thanks to the Carter administration, Kerry probably got his medals and such back due to the pardon. Im not certain but some of the articles Ive read would *indicate* his short tenure may not have been quite as gallant as he paints the picture.

Im just curious who put him in for those Purple Hearts. Himself? If he opened his records, we'd know and could put that issue to rest

Silat · « **Reply #24 on:** October 29, 2004, 01:36:27 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by slimm50
I don't give a rat's bellybutton about Kerry's or Bush's war record(s). Kerry's Congressional voting record, alone, is enough for me to vote for Bush.

Im guessing you have never really read the congressional records pertaining to Kerry and say, Cheneys voting records?And I dont mean the cherry picking version from Sean Hannity

WhiteHawk · « **Reply #25 on:** October 29, 2004, 06:34:13 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Phaser11
Hey all.
I just went on the Kerry web site. His DD-214 is there and says he did get an honorable discharge. Why don't you guys do a little more reaserach FIRST!
I'm voting for Bush and you're making us look bad.
Thanks for nothing.

damm good point.

SunTracker · « **Reply #26 on:** October 29, 2004, 06:52:35 AM »

Quote

Kerry also admitted he that he commited war atrocities himself.

Yes, using .50 cal weapons, engaging in the free fire zone, and calling artillery in on a village. If these are war crimes, about 500,000 other vietnam vets are guilty too.

Toad · « **Reply #27 on:** October 29, 2004, 07:34:58 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by WhiteHawk
damm good point.

No, it's a foolish point.

Again:

Check the dates on the DD214 on Kerry's website.

The "Transfer or Discharge Data" block shows the date as 15 Dec 66. It's his discharge from U.S. Naval Officer Candidate School, not his final discharge from the USN.

You guys need to read this stuff a little closer.

It does say that "No Discharge Certificate Issued at time of Separation" and "Continuing on Active Duty as Ensign, USNR".

It's his discharge from "90 day wonder" officer's school, not his discharge from the Navy after VietNam.

Flit · « **Reply #28 on:** October 29, 2004, 09:56:38 AM »

Either way, if he went to Paris and talked to the NVA, He's guilty of treason and aiding the enemy
He should'nt even be holding public office

MOSQ · « **Reply #29 on:** October 29, 2004, 01:39:06 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Flit
Either way, if he went to Paris and talked to the NVA, He's guilty of treason and aiding the enemy
He should'nt even be holding public office

That's my biggest concern. This is not going away. If Kerry loses, it will be a minor tiff in history as it gets worked out as to whether he can continue in the Senate.

If he wins the presidential election and this issue continues, it will cause a Constitutional Crisis.

Article XIV: Section 3. No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any State, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any State legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any State, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.

You may interpret this clause a couple of different ways. It would seem that for a Senator to be in violation you would have to have sworn to support the Constitution, ("having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress") then later given aid and comfort to the enemy.

So Kerry could be OK there, no one claims he's done that since winning any elections.

However, "or as an officer of the United States" I have to assume includes officers in the US Navy. Or does it? If it does, then we could be looking at a trial? Note the 2/3 vote in Congress is not to impeach the "suspect", but to remove the "disability" of not being able to hold public office. So then who decides if Kerry can hold public office, a Federal court, with a right to a jury trial? Could a President be removed by a Federal Court, without ever having been impeached and tried in Congress?

What a mess this could be. I hope it's just an academic exercise, otherwise the country will be bogged down for months or years on it.