Author Topic: Omg...could Bush Have Been Right All Along?  (Read 1237 times)

Offline Muckmaw1

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Omg...could Bush Have Been Right All Along?
« on: January 31, 2005, 08:31:28 PM »
Iraqi Election May Affect Middle East

Mon Jan 31, 4:08 PM ET   Middle East - AP
 

By SAM F. GHATTAS, Associated Press Writer

BEIRUT, Lebanon - Iraq (news - web sites)'s election, however imperfect, could increase pressure on other authoritarian Arab countries to begin political reforms and hold free balloting.


"The Americans were able to hold elections in Iraq and that made them much more comfortable in carrying on with their policies in the Middle East," said Lebanese political analyst Ali Hamadeh. "They showed everybody that you can carry on with an electoral process even when you have security problems."


Hamadeh said the message of the election is that if Iraq could carry out "an all-weather democratic process" there is no excuse for other countries not to reform.


Many are feeling the pressure at least to make a show of democratic reform, and 2005 is shaping up to be the year of Middle East elections, even if few of them are expected to threaten the established regimes.


The Palestinians held a poll — widely praised, despite a few irregularities — that brought Mahmoud Abbas to power earlier this month to replace the late Yasser Arafat (news - web sites).


Saudi Arabia, an absolute monarchy, will hold its first municipal elections in 45 years beginning Feb. 10 — a vote postponed from September.


A parliamentary election in Lebanon, expected by May, will test Syria's grip on the country as the West pushes Damascus to withdraw its army. Three previous elections were influenced deeply by Syria, which will face pressure to back off.


Egypt, the Arab world's most populous country, holds presidential and parliamentary elections later this year, although the presidential vote is essentially a referendum on one candidate approved by a parliament dominated by President Hosni Mubarak (news - web sites)'s party. Mubarak, 76 and in power since 1981, is seeking a fifth six-year term despite calls to retire.


Jordan's King Abdullah II announced plans last week to introduce limited democratic reforms by establishing elected councils to oversee development. In a CNN interview shown Monday, he said the Iraqi elections set a positive tone for the region.


"Once you open the door of reform and it's allowed to be discussed in society, as it is throughout the Middle East, it's very difficult to close again. So I think that people are waking up, leaders are understanding that they have to push reform forward and I don't think there's any looking back," he said.


Others were more hesitant, saying the regional impact of the elections remained to be seen.


"The United States considers that just holding an election is a triumph by itself. This is hollow talk," said Hassan Nafaa, a political science professor at Cairo University. "The core of the issue is whether the elections are the beginning of a solution to the Iraq crisis or whether they are part of an escalation."


After toppling Saddam Hussein (news - web sites) in 2003, the United States promised Iraq would become a model for Arab democracy, and it pushed regimes in the region to yield to some local demands for change. Reform, Washington says, will make Muslim and Arab societies less fertile ground for extremists.


That policy was broadly reinforced in President Bush (news - web sites)'s second inaugural speech.


"It is the policy of the United States to seek and support the growth of democratic movements and institutions in every nation and culture, with the ultimate goal of ending tyranny in our world," Bush said.


With the Iraq elections over, Saudi Arabia could feel the pressure to proceed with reforms and Syria to seal off its border with Iraq and to stop interfering in Lebanon. There may also be the opportunity for an American dialogue with Iran, Hamadeh said.


Despite the praise for Iraq's vote, some Arab media questioned its legitimacy, notably because of the minimal turnout by Sunni Arabs, many of whom boycotted. Other Arab opinion-makers deplored the U.S. role in the elections.

   



In the Jordanian newspaper Ad-Dustour, columnist Oraib al Rintawi wrote: "The election in Iraq was dictated by American arrogance against the will of most of its people."

Critics of American policy in the region say the U.S. push for democracy is only another effort to further the U.S. agenda.

Fahmi Howeidi, a liberal Islamic writer in Egypt, viewed the Iraqi balloting as "a moment that served American interests and not the interests of the Iraqi people."

"It will have no bearing on the Middle East, except Iraq," he said.

Offline JB88

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Omg...could Bush Have Been Right All Along?
« Reply #1 on: January 31, 2005, 08:57:22 PM »
you are talking about the weapons of mass destruction right?

i seem to remember him saying that is why we should do it.

hmmmm.  

if anything, monroe would be right in this case.
this thread is doomed.
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Offline oboe

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Omg...could Bush Have Been Right All Along?
« Reply #2 on: January 31, 2005, 09:04:57 PM »
Quote
"It is the policy of the United States to seek and support the growth of democratic movements and institutions in every nation and culture, with the ultimate goal of ending tyranny in our world," Bush said.


This might've been something worthwhile to mention while he was running for 2nd term.    I think he spends money like he is never ever going to have to pay it back.   Come to think of it, he never is going to have to pay it back.   Your kids are.

Offline Delirium

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Omg...could Bush Have Been Right All Along?
« Reply #3 on: January 31, 2005, 09:07:31 PM »
I think the biggest win was allowing the population of Iraq to hear and see the 'insurgents' targeting them instead of the occupying Americans.

It made them lose more credibility and encouraged national pride. If the Iraqi people don't get motivated now, it will never happen...
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Offline JB88

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Omg...could Bush Have Been Right All Along?
« Reply #4 on: January 31, 2005, 09:09:02 PM »
good point delerium.
this thread is doomed.
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To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield. -Ulysses.

word.

Offline TalonX

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even the radical left can't find fault in the election
« Reply #5 on: January 31, 2005, 09:26:58 PM »
Can they?

Surely, 50 to 70% turn out for a vote (where 99% used to vote for Sadam ) displays an inate love of freedom.

WMD?  They had them, we know that.  If they disposed or hid them, it's moot.   I frankly don't care what populist reason was given, I am happy we took down Sadam.  I hope we don't stop until we eliminate the threats to America.

Was 9-11 so long ago............?
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Offline lasersailor184

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Omg...could Bush Have Been Right All Along?
« Reply #6 on: January 31, 2005, 09:29:13 PM »
Didn't even think about that...
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Offline Eagler

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Omg...could Bush Have Been Right All Along?
« Reply #7 on: January 31, 2005, 09:35:32 PM »
WTG BUSH!

WTG PPL of IRAQ!
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Offline JB88

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Omg...could Bush Have Been Right All Along?
« Reply #8 on: January 31, 2005, 09:54:09 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Eagler
WTG BUSH!

WTG PPL of IRAQ!


^^^^^^^^^



this thread is doomed.
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To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield. -Ulysses.

word.

Offline Raider179

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Omg...could Bush Have Been Right All Along?
« Reply #9 on: January 31, 2005, 10:40:46 PM »
To have been right all along He would have had to say from the get go that this was why he was going in.

Offline Raider179

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Omg...could Bush Have Been Right All Along?
« Reply #10 on: January 31, 2005, 10:42:53 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Delirium
I think the biggest win was allowing the population of Iraq to hear and see the 'insurgents' targeting them instead of the occupying Americans.

It made them lose more credibility and encouraged national pride. If the Iraqi people don't get motivated now, it will never happen...


You got it right on the head with this one. The moment the "insurgents/terrorists" started targeting Iraqi's instead of us they lost the fight. After all you can't really call yourself an insurgent if you are killing off the citizens of the country you are fighting for.

Offline Gunslinger

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Omg...could Bush Have Been Right All Along?
« Reply #11 on: January 31, 2005, 10:43:50 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by JB88
you are talking about the weapons of mass destruction right?

i seem to remember him saying that is why we should do it.

hmmmm.  

if anything, monroe would be right in this case.


you know every time one of you pipes in here with WMDs I'm going to remind you that it has been US policy to enact regim change in Iraq since Clinton.

Offline Raider179

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Omg...could Bush Have Been Right All Along?
« Reply #12 on: January 31, 2005, 10:52:40 PM »
I believe that term used was support regime change. Not enact it.
But if I am wrong I am sure you will show me.

Offline rpm

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Omg...could Bush Have Been Right All Along?
« Reply #13 on: January 31, 2005, 11:47:05 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Gunslinger
you know every time one of you pipes in here with WMDs I'm going to remind you that it has been US policy to enact regim change in Iraq since Clinton.
Hate to rain on your parade Guns (I really do) but which President was it that pulled out early and left Saddam in power which set up this whole mess? You know, the one that called for the Iraqi people to rise up against Saddam and we would help them, but didn't do it. He had some famous saying about "read my lips".
« Last Edit: January 31, 2005, 11:49:06 PM by rpm »
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Offline JB88

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Omg...could Bush Have Been Right All Along?
« Reply #14 on: February 01, 2005, 12:09:32 AM »
i'm stumped.

perhaps another clue....:(
this thread is doomed.
www.augustbach.com  

To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield. -Ulysses.

word.