Author Topic: This Prof. needs to be fired (Read 1075 times)

Charon · « **Reply #15 on:** February 01, 2005, 08:25:08 PM »

The problem is his arguments, on the surface, seem rather weak and his comparisons are extreme and inappropriate (not morally, academically). Comparing a trader to a nazi camp guard just doesn't hold water. He apparently doesn't have the chops or the interest in doing quality academic work to support his anti-globalization/ ant-corporate agenda. I’m not a huge fan myself anymore of corporate run globalization (given the near monopolistic state of many industries and their extreme degree of political and journalistic influence) but the issue is extremely complicated. If there are Eichmanns, in a truer sense, the average trader would come up short. He's just looking for attention and playing to an academically shallow niche audience that doesn't possess critical thought. He cant cut it legitimately, would be my guess, and he’s angling for the next best thing (niche appeal and hippie coeds) and may even believe what he types. But so what. Ignore him. Who cares what he thinks?

Charon

Wolfala · « **Reply #16 on:** February 01, 2005, 08:27:54 PM »

All I can say is give me 10 minutes with him in Washington Heights, and 'foget about it'....

Wolf

Sandman · « **Reply #17 on:** February 01, 2005, 08:28:12 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Shuckins
I respectfully disagree Sandman. Freshmen are still very impressionable.

I've seen quite a few who would, to appear intellectual, swallow anything a professor threw at them hook, line, and sinker.

A recent scientific study showed that the brain's ability to make rational decisions isn't fully developed until the age of 25.

So, yeah, I believe that these "instructors" know exactly what they're doing.

Nevertheless, they're adults. They don't need protection from left or right wing nutjobs.

Tarmac · « **Reply #18 on:** February 01, 2005, 08:28:50 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Shuckins
I respectfully disagree Sandman. Freshmen are still very impressionable.

I've seen quite a few who would, to appear intellectual, swallow anything a professor threw at them hook, line, and sinker.

I agree as well. College is a place to develop your views, although I think that your morals are already pretty well set.

Professors have biases. But if all your professors lean one way, that's the only view that you have available to fit into your existing moral code. That's why I think it's important to have a wide range of views in a faculty - so you can develop your views based on how you and others see the world. The wide range of views even includes people who are extreme, inflammatory, or off the wall, because who am I to judge for everyone else what is so crazy that it shouldn't be taught?

Shuckins · « **Reply #19 on:** February 01, 2005, 08:31:59 PM »

But Tarmac...do you REALLY believe that the statements made by this man that the victims of 9/11 had it coming should carry NO consequences. His were not just the ramblings of an idiotic private citizen, they were made in an official capacity as a representative of a faculty in a major university.

If I, as a teacher, were to conduct a lecture in which I tried to convince my students that the Jews got what they deserved in the Holocaust I have no doubt whatsoever what my fate would be.

Do you really believe that, in the name of intellectual diversity, he should be allowed to remain in his position, where he can continue to make statements that insinuate that "capitalistic exploiters" deserve to die?

Is he really any different from the fabled idiot who yelled "Fire!" in a crowded theater.

Hate speech is considered to be a crime...isn't it? If he were making these statements about gays he would be fired outright...wouldn't he?

Freedom of speech is not absolute...as many Supreme Court rulings throughout our history have demonstrated.

Sandman · « **Reply #20 on:** February 01, 2005, 08:31:59 PM »

Hmmm... do values and morals change with perspective?

Lizking · « **Reply #21 on:** February 01, 2005, 08:38:41 PM »

He can say anything he wants. The question is, does the University wantt him representing THEM. I think the answer they have given is a firm NO, but they can not just ****can him like a normal company.

Tarmac · « **Reply #22 on:** February 01, 2005, 08:51:00 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Shuckins
But Tarmac...do you REALLY believe that the statements made by this man that the victims of 9/11 had it coming should carry NO consequences. His were not just the ramblings of an idiotic private citizen, they were made in an official capacity as a representative of a faculty in a major university.

If I, as a teacher, were to conduct a lecture in which I tried to convince my students that the Jews got what they deserved in the Holocaust I have no doubt whatsoever what my fate would be.

Do you really believe that, in the name of intellectual diversity, he should be allowed to remain in his position, where he can continue to make statements that insinuate that "capitalistic exploiters" deserve to die?

Is he really any different from the fabled idiot who yelled "Fire!" in a crowded theater.

Hate speech is considered to be a crime...isn't it? If he were making these statements about gays he would be fired outright...wouldn't he?

Freedom of speech is not absolute...as many Supreme Court rulings throughout our history have demonstrated.

No consequences? Of course not. I think the consequence should be that he is ignored, or maybe even laughed at and then ignored. But someone else might think that what he says is worthwhile in some way. Don't shut him up for my sake and deny that someone the opportunity to hear what he's saying.

Now, saying that "the Jews got what they deserved" is going one step farther than what this professor said. He didn't say that the Sept 11 victims got what they deserved, he said they were not innocent. He's arguing that they had some contributory role in what happened on September 11 (or as much role as any other American). If I inadvertantly step on a snake while searching for a lost child and get bit and die, did I deserve what I got? That's debateable. I deserved it because I stepped on the snake. I didn't deserve it because at the time I stepped on it I was doing something noble and the violence against the snake was accidental, or at least the consequences weren't considered beforehand. I think this professor is making the same argument. This is not the same as saying that everyone who searches for a lost child (or attempts to make a good living for his family in business, like the WTC victims) should die.

I didn't want to get drawn into an argument about the merits of what he said... just about his right to say it and not lose his government job.

Airhead · « **Reply #23 on:** February 01, 2005, 08:51:20 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Shuckins
Well...I'm a defender of the Constitutional right of free speech and all...but...I mean...DAM...the conclusions he reaches and the inflammatory statements are just too STUPID for words!

What a bunch of sanctimonius, pseudo-intellectual, anti-capitalistic, pro-and-apologetically socialistic, I can't change my own car's oil so I despise all "doers" clap-trap.

This is the same type of thinking old-style communists used to justify their purges.

If he were making these same types of statements about an ethnic group he would be accused of a hate crime and summarily fired. Yet he can hide his bigotry behind the mask of intellectual freedom and avoid any consequences.

Unbelievable.

Oh yea, his comments are too stupid for words...likewise Angela Davis' comments when she was a college professor at Berzerkly were oftimes too stupid for words.

But we need stupid educators too, to teach the stupid peoples' kids.

And no, you're never over the top...unless Skuzzy e-mails you.

TweetyBird · « **Reply #24 on:** February 01, 2005, 09:25:50 PM »

Well IMO he's just another mass produced writer who regrets he missed the 60's.

But do you wonder about the insane logic of the people that made the death threats? Its really scary when you realize there are murderers in this world that have no clue they are muderers, tyrants who have no clue they are tyrants, and Americans who have no clue they are unAmerican. Death threats to dissent - now thats a striking blow for democracy. Who breeds such people?

Gunslinger · « **Reply #25 on:** February 01, 2005, 10:49:27 PM »

Sorry airhead your not my type so no long walks on the beach with me for you

as I stated I am all about free speech....BUT....Free speech doesnt mean you can say what ever you want and get away with it IE not lose your job.

I speak my mind all the time at work and it gets me in trouble all the time BUT my supervisers my not like what I have to say about the squadrons concern for my troops safety it does get heard and I know (not allways) when to draw the line.

This guy is a state employee and he's advocated hate speech against the government.....a not so perfect govt. I'll agree....but none the less.

I visit this site weekly http://tonguetied.us/ yes it's a little conservative slanted but all its doing is quoting actual newspaper articles about the exact same thing.

here's the college section:

http://tonguetied.us/archives/cat_college_life.php

Its filled with example after example of people getting fired or what not for doing the exact same thing this guy is doing but the difference is this guy is lauded and these people are hate mongerers. Where's the equality. Is he not insuating that the entire business dept at the college is producing future Nazis?

This guy may be an excelent teacher but even excelent teachers cross the line. I dont think students are all grown up once they go to college. They are still very impressionable and only the smart ones shy away from the left (OK that was a jabb and a joke had to throw that in there)

tweaty I whole heartedly agree with you about the death threats. I dont consider this guys writing "political dissent" its hate speech any way you look at it. Since when are hijackers heros?

anyhow this guy just really pissed me off today and I had to share this.

Shuckins · « **Reply #26 on:** February 01, 2005, 10:59:30 PM »

Sorry guys, I just can't agree. When he said that those who died in the twin towers were not innocent he implied that they were legitimate targets. What other conclusion are rational people to draw from that statement?

There is a double-standard at work here. Had he said that the discrimination against African-Americans during our country's history was justified because of some perceived cultural failing he would have been tossed out on his keester.

And rightly so.

Masherbrum · « **Reply #27 on:** February 02, 2005, 12:10:28 AM »

Why is it when "Free Speech" is mentioned, people always forget "as long as it does not infringe on the rights of others"?

He has just as much right to do that, as you or I.

Karaya

Wolfala · « **Reply #28 on:** February 02, 2005, 01:53:06 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Masherbrum
Why is it when "Free Speech" is mentioned, people always forget "as long as it does not infringe on the rights of others"?

He has just as much right to do that, as you or I.

Karaya

OK,

So i'm sure he won't mind when I see him walking down Flatbush Ave and a group approaches him with some burlap bags and black jacks - it'll just be business as usual with free speech.

I hardly think after his comments anyone from NY would miss his rosey presence.

Wolf

SunTracker · « **Reply #29 on:** February 02, 2005, 03:21:22 AM »

As punishment, they should make that professor join the army and go fight in Iraq. It would be ironic and funny.