Author Topic: Crime Drops 99%! (Read 2763 times)

bustr · « **Reply #120 on:** February 24, 2005, 04:54:39 PM »

I beleive the point is, if crime statistics are on the rise in the face of an all out gun ban, then the gun ban accomplished very little than to remove guns as an accidental source of death amongst the law abiding. Do the current crime statistics for Curval's island show criminal vs criminal crime is on the increase, or is it an increase of criminal victimizing the law abiding?

Toad what is being ignored that you set in motion is the overall increase in "CRIME" since firearms were banned or given up in the UK. You are being played for the wording of your question. You specified "GUNS" and in the UK deaths by "GUNS" has always been almost non-existant. So Curval and Co. have been correct in their assurtions as long as they stick to the rules of your original question. Kinda purial, but you stepped into it.

Crime has increased in the UK, Canada and Australia since their enactments of total or near total banning of gun ownership of the law abiding public. I do not know if this is because the criminal elements in each country are emboldend by the disarmement of the public or not. But they seem to be going hand in hand. The UK public are not being assaulted by firearms because it's a small island and easy to control the flow of goods in and out by the police. But the public is seeing an increase in violent crime by other methods.

Our american argument is that we are seeing a decrease in violent crime against the law abiding especially in those states that have shall issue laws, CCW laws and or do not infringe on the 2nd amendmant or state level constitutional right to keep and bare arms.

So from these differences one might suggest allowing the law abiding UK public to bare arms again or the UK become a super police state so that criminal activity can be responded to by a greater number of boots on the ground.

Toad · « **Reply #121 on:** February 24, 2005, 05:00:46 PM »

Well, with all the slaughter on your roads... and Bermuda stats are right up there.. I'd think that of course you'd want to ban the evil inanimate motor vehicles too.

Trouble in Paradise?

Unsolved Murders

Those are just the unsolved ones. Big on the stabbing with sharp instruments over there I guess. Surely the plan to ban butterknives can't be far off.

Isn't it interesting that Bermuda doesn't participate in the UN's International Crime Victims Survey.

I have found references that say Bermuda's murder rate per 100k is about the same as the US rate.

Shuckins · « **Reply #122 on:** February 24, 2005, 05:09:59 PM »

As I've said before, crime rates for individual countries are culturally based.

For instance, if the Japanese government suddenly passed a law allowing unrestricted ownership of firearms, and many Japanese citizens availed themselves of the new-found right, would they begin slaughtering their neighbors willy-nilly? I think not. They are too disciplined and respectful a people to do that.

On the other hand, they might invade Manchuria.

Sorry, I couldn't resist.

Curval · « **Reply #123 on:** February 24, 2005, 05:33:53 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Toad
I have found references that say Bermuda's murder rate per 100k is about the same as the US rate.

lol

Really?

Considering our population is about 65,000 I'd question the source.

Toad · « **Reply #124 on:** February 24, 2005, 05:48:40 PM »

C'mon, yer a bean counter. They give your rates per 20k but you can still compare apples to apples. It's only math.

bustr · « **Reply #125 on:** February 24, 2005, 06:14:08 PM »

Toad I took a look at your links and some other research. Looks like Curval's island is experiencing the same demographics for crime that is common for much of the western world. Increases in violence by the minority populations for drugs, cultural and economic differences. I guess we caucasians are a bunch of wimps. We seem to be a tad squeemish about rending each others epidermis during social disputes.

Curval · « **Reply #126 on:** February 24, 2005, 07:45:15 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Toad
C'mon, yer a bean counter. They give your rates per 20k but you can still compare apples to apples. It's only math.

Yea yea, I know. Just busting your chops.

Curval · « **Reply #127 on:** February 24, 2005, 07:47:33 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by bustr
Toad I took a look at your links and some other research. Looks like Curval's island is experiencing the same demographics for crime that is common for much of the western world. Increases in violence by the minority populations for drugs, cultural and economic differences. I guess we caucasians are a bunch of wimps. We seem to be a tad squeemish about rending each others epidermis during social disputes.

Correctamundo.

Are you suggesting we should arm ourselves here as a result? My opinion is that it would simply make matters worse...much worse.

(btw the population of Bermuda is about 70% black...it isn't just a caucasian thing)

bustr · « **Reply #128 on:** February 24, 2005, 08:03:01 PM »

Would it reduce the violent crime rate? Would it have saved any of the victems of these violent crimes from being victemised? In my personal case the one time I needed a conceled firearm, I had it and the perp and I both lived.

So what do you do for the victems of violence on your island who needed an equalizer before they attained victem status on the official island report? I know it's always easier to talk about social governmental sollutions. But what about that poor lower class woman living in one of the crime areas who could have defended herself but for the lack of a firearm? Or are they all criminals and deserve what they do to each other? Kind of a prevailing social class attitiude in the west about these things.

Curval · « **Reply #129 on:** February 24, 2005, 08:30:38 PM »

Ahhh...but balance those same women living alone in a poor neighborhood against all the accidental and "bystander" victims in a natural increase in gun-play from the moment you were to legalise guns here.

What about all of them?

What about the inevitable prevalence of stolen weapons being used in future crimes? Most crimes are committed with stolen blackmarket weapons and not with lawfully owned guns in the US right?

We have had an alarming increase in violent crime in recent years, it's true. But we don't need to cross the line into "arming" our population quite yet and I hope we never do.

If you want to play with guns though you can join a club...or the Regiment.

Toad · « **Reply #130 on:** February 25, 2005, 12:02:56 AM »

A Bermudan Colt.

NUKE · « **Reply #131 on:** February 25, 2005, 12:26:29 AM »

lol Toad.

lazs2 · « **Reply #132 on:** February 25, 2005, 08:30:19 AM »

curval... yu realize that if you ban something to prevent homicides and crime and then homicides and crime do not go down... you have banned something for no reason?

Like dogs more than most people? why then are you worried about homicide rates at all? Fraid the peasants might get around to the "good" humans like yourself?

lazs

bustr · « **Reply #133 on:** February 25, 2005, 12:21:33 PM »

Ok Curval, then you leave these low income people disarmed. Violent crime is increasing. They are actualy dieing and not a statistical bystander like yourself. Are you advocating they just grin and bare it and contiue dieing?

Curval · « **Reply #134 on:** February 25, 2005, 12:31:39 PM »

So now I'm an evil rich conservative standing by while the poor get preyed on by the crimminals.

LOL

Just a page or two ago I was a typical liberal.

You and lazs need to get together.

I'm as much of a potential victim as low income people bustr...more so in fact. I actually HAVE something to steal.