Author Topic: Crime Drops 99%! (Read 2356 times)

Curval · « **Reply #90 on:** February 24, 2005, 12:59:02 PM »

You are drawing a completely meaningless correlation there Toad. The %age figure is mighty impressive though.

Here's what Alex in the UK had to say about Malcolm's stats:

The stats tell the real story: there are more legal guns in the US and there are more murders. That's all we need to know.
Alex, UK

Keep your guns. Have fun. Kill each other all you like. Just don't try and tell me, or anyone living in a country that does not allow guns, that I'd be much better off, safer, whatever...if we had more guns.

I don't buy it.

Curval · « **Reply #91 on:** February 24, 2005, 01:03:50 PM »

Nuke,

Even when your stats show gun crime going down after bring in a legal concealment law does not take away the fact that you guys have WAAAAAAAY more gun crime. It dropped a bit, but it was a "drop in the bucket".

NUKE · « **Reply #92 on:** February 24, 2005, 01:25:22 PM »

Curval, again you are using the term "gun crime". That's where you are getting tripped up.

Curval · « **Reply #93 on:** February 24, 2005, 01:31:02 PM »

That is what we are discussing Nuke. Crimes in which guns are used.

NUKE · « **Reply #94 on:** February 24, 2005, 01:39:07 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Curval
That is what we are discussing Nuke. Crimes in which guns are used.

Well, if that is the case, I will concede hands down that the US has more crimes in which guns are used than any country who has a gun ban. That's just logical. We have guns, the UK basically does not. Simple.

That does not translate into guns=more crime though.

Toad · « **Reply #95 on:** February 24, 2005, 01:39:28 PM »

Meaningless correlation? They pass a law banning handguns and their handgun offences go way up? From Home Office stats?

Meaningless to you, I guess.

Way more gun crime.. which the Office of Econmic Health attributes primarily to cultural differences, NOT gun availability. But feel free to ignore that too.

I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it.

In fact, I'd even say that those who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.

Plenty of guns around my house, my neighborhood, my city, my state, my nation. I've never felt "unsafe" due to firearms. To the contrary, "safety" is a given around here.

I guess you may need the absence of guns to feel safe? Whatever floats your boat.

Curval · « **Reply #96 on:** February 24, 2005, 01:53:35 PM »

Some might say "it would have been worse". There's absolutely no proof of that. - Toad

LOL...but your stats prove that it was the gun ban that RESULTED in an increase of gun crime Toad? Please.

There was, I am sure, a number of factors that caused that increase. I doubt very much if ANY of it RESULTED from the ban.

That's just crazy. What, did the British crimminals suddenly say to themselves "Cool, guns are now banned...so we are gonna use 'em."?

No.

Toad · « **Reply #97 on:** February 24, 2005, 01:56:43 PM »

No, like Beet you miss the point. Deliberately?

The ban did not accomplish anything[/u][/i] with respect to reducing handgun crime.

It was pointless. It merely denied law-abiding handgun owners of their guns.

Yet it's viewed as some sort of triumph.

And handgun crime trends up.

Bravo.

NUKE · « **Reply #98 on:** February 24, 2005, 01:58:51 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Curval
Some might say "it would have been worse". There's absolutely no proof of that. - Toad

There was, I am sure, a number of factors that caused that increase. I doubt very much if ANY of it RESULTED from the ban.

So what did the gun ban accomplish then?

The funny thing about the whole gun ban in the UK is that it was never needed and, once in place did nothing to slow down or stop crime or even "gun crime"

Even Beetle has said the there has never been more than around 100 gun related deaths in the UK, pre-ban or post ban.

It was pointless to ban handguns in the UK.

Curval · « **Reply #99 on:** February 24, 2005, 03:11:52 PM »

You do not know that it did nothing. As you have already said it may have, it just can't be proven.

I don't have a crystal ball....and I don't live in the UK.

Guns were banned here since 1971. I know of ONE death by firearms since that time.

Are you suggesting that in my island's case the gun ban didn't work? I assure you that it has...very effectively.

NUKE · « **Reply #100 on:** February 24, 2005, 03:21:48 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Curval
.

Are you suggesting that in my island's case the gun ban didn't work? I assure you that it has...very effectively.

Did your homicide rate drop after the gun ban?

Toad · « **Reply #101 on:** February 24, 2005, 03:50:25 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Curval

Guns were banned here since 1971. I know of ONE death by firearms since that time.

How many deaths by firearms in the previous 35 years?

If it's around 1, I'd say your ban did nothing as well as England's did nothing.

Curval · « **Reply #102 on:** February 24, 2005, 03:50:52 PM »

Yup, just before the ban our governor, his aide-de-cap and his dog were all shot and killed.

Dunno how many before that...but just take those figures...Bermuda experienced a 75% drop in gun related death as a direct result of the gun ban in the way Toad views his statistics.

Impressive huh?

NUKE · « **Reply #103 on:** February 24, 2005, 03:52:40 PM »

Curval, is your nation any more safe now that guns are banned? Did homicides and crime go down as a result of the gun ban?

Curval · « **Reply #104 on:** February 24, 2005, 03:56:41 PM »

I just showed you that we had a 75% drop in gun related deaths from just prior to 1971 to date.

Don't now try and muddy the waters. Those are the numbers.