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Author Topic: God and the US of A  (Read 2046 times)

Offline Swager

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God and the US of A
« Reply #90 on: April 18, 2005, 07:49:53 PM »
Is there something about religion in our Constitution?  Huh?
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Offline bustr

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« Reply #91 on: April 18, 2005, 08:06:41 PM »
Amendment I

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.


Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech,

The manner in which these parts are structured is to protect religion from the governemnt by the government establishing a one true religion. Then it protects all of the people to practice their religion, and then protects the right to free speech which protects the right to freely speak your religious feelings in public, private or civic office................

The constitution does not have an amendment that states when you take Federal office you give up your rights as a citizen as outlined by the constitution you have sworn to uphold and protect. You are still a constitutionaly protected citizen in office..
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This is like the old joke that voters are harsher to their beer brewer if he has an outage, than their politicians after raising their taxes. Death and taxes are certain but, fun and sex is only now.

Offline Lizking

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« Reply #92 on: April 18, 2005, 08:11:28 PM »
Specifically it states that the United States Congress may make no law.  It is a local issue that the state constitution must address, not the Federal Government.  If a state allows it, a school district can require prayer, if you believe in the actual intention and compass of the US Constitution.
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Offline bustr

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« Reply #93 on: April 18, 2005, 08:19:19 PM »
Actually that was Jeffersons intent on religion that it should be an issue for each state. Not an issue overseen by the Federal umbrella. In submitting his Freedom of Religion Bill for Viginia he also expressed his beleif that all men have the right to express their beleilfs, anti, neutral, or pro religion without retrobution...........freedom of speech and moral conviction go hand in hand.
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bustr - POTW 1st Wing


This is like the old joke that voters are harsher to their beer brewer if he has an outage, than their politicians after raising their taxes. Death and taxes are certain but, fun and sex is only now.

Offline StarOfAfrica2

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« Reply #94 on: April 18, 2005, 09:01:51 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Lizking
Specifically it states that the United States Congress may make no law.  It is a local issue that the state constitution must address, not the Federal Government.  If a state allows it, a school district can require prayer, if you believe in the actual intention and compass of the US Constitution.


Actually Jefferson addressed just that issue in the previously quoted letter to the Danbury Baptist Association, and he agreed that govt. (whether state or federal) had no place telling people what religion they should favor.  Its not an issue for the state to decide.  Its an issue for each individual American to decide in their own hearts and minds.  There should never be legislation (as there was in that instance) that favors one branch of Christianity over another, or favors one religion over another.  Period.  Just as our freedom to express ourselves is protected, so is our freedom to worship how we choose.  In any state.
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Offline Lizking

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« Reply #95 on: April 18, 2005, 09:13:56 PM »
Jefferson can wish in one hand and **** in the other-the law of the land is what was ratified by the people, not TJ.
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Offline Lizking

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« Reply #96 on: April 18, 2005, 09:15:53 PM »
Star, the basic human right, one which TJ and others agreed on was the right to self determination.  The right for people to band together into political and social units and decide what was right for them.  This is why Federalism was so limited when the judiciary was not allowed to create law.
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Offline Lizking

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« Reply #97 on: April 18, 2005, 09:17:42 PM »
One we gave power to the courts to create and enforce law, our form of government was fatally wounded.  It is only a matter of time before the proper state and local powers are restored, or the United States as a political unit will fail.
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Offline midnight Target

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« Reply #98 on: April 18, 2005, 09:19:49 PM »
Nash needs help....

Quote
James Madison said  The civil Government, though bereft of everything like an associated hierarchy, possesses the requisite stability, and performs its functions with complete success, whilst the number, the industry, and the morality of the priesthood, and the devotion of the people, have been manifestly increased by the total separation of the church from the State (Letter to Robert Walsh, Mar. 2, 1819).


Quote
James Madison also wrote  Strongly guarded as is the separation between religion and & Gov't in the Constitution of the United States the danger of encroachment by Ecclesiastical Bodies, may be illustrated by precedents already furnished in their short history (Detached Memoranda, circa 1820).


Now I could go on and on, but if we are gonna use contextual proof to show what the Founding Fathers meant when they wrote the second amendment, we can certainly do the same with the first.
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Offline Toad

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« Reply #99 on: April 18, 2005, 10:04:34 PM »
Cripes, you call that help?

First of all, Nash ran away. You're way late.

Second, once again it says what it says. The guys that wrote it were not 21st Century spin meisters.

What is says... and what you quote... are REAL simple.

Quote
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof


That's IT, that's ALL. Anyone with a half-decent education can read and understand it.

Now, what are you trying to spin it into?
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If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!

Offline Silat

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« Reply #100 on: April 18, 2005, 10:13:59 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by GtoRA2
What specific laws are you talking about?

Did they ban being gay?

Did the murder of unborn children get banned?


I thought I would have seen it on Cnn or something.


Weaselsan said:"Name one religious value that anyone wants to legislate as law?"

I say:
Unborn children being murdered? You would think I would have seen that on CNN.
I was asked for 2 religious items that an attempt was being made to legislate. I mentioned them.
« Last Edit: April 19, 2005, 12:26:48 AM by Silat »
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Offline GtoRA2

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« Reply #101 on: April 18, 2005, 10:27:39 PM »
Being agaist abortion is not just a christian thing.


I was asking for links to these laws you say are trying to be passed.
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Offline Vulcan

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« Reply #102 on: April 18, 2005, 10:43:20 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by GtoRA2
Being agaist abortion is not just a christian thing.


I was asking for links to these laws you say are trying to be passed.


Ummm how about Sodomy then? :D
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Offline GtoRA2

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« Reply #103 on: April 18, 2005, 10:49:56 PM »
Is bush passing anti sodomy laws??

Old laws don't count in this one Vulky
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Offline Toad

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« Reply #104 on: April 18, 2005, 10:52:03 PM »
I'd bet sodomy laws go clear back to the time of the Founders.  ;)
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If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!
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