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Author Topic: Havent we been here before?  (Read 926 times)

Offline StarOfAfrica2

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Havent we been here before?
« on: June 21, 2005, 07:02:58 PM »
Over the weekend our shooting club participated in an island-wide shooting sports fair.  Had a blast teaching people to shoot and trying out other folks' guns.  During some of the downtime, I had a chance to get to know some of the older guys better.  One of them at my end that also shoots black powder was talking history and shared some stories from his time as an "advisor" in the early 60s in Vietnam.  This caught my eye from the article describing the visit of the Vietnamese leader here with Mr. Bush, describing one of the things they hope to increase with better relations between our countries.

Quote
After his discussions with Bush, Khai planned to meet with Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld. Military ties between the two countries have included periodic docking of U.S. warships in Vietnam and plans for U.S. military training of Vietnamese officers. Intelligence sharing and cooperation on counterterrorism activities also are part of the mix.
 
Khai told the Washington Post in an interview before leaving Hanoi that the two countries will announce Vietnam’s modest new participation in the Pentagon’s International Military Education and Training program.


Aint that a kicker?  lol
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Offline Boroda

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Re: Havent we been here before?
« Reply #1 on: June 21, 2005, 07:30:19 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by StarOfAfrica2
Aint that a kicker?  lol


Especially after USSR... Sorry, RF, withdrew and refused to use a naval base at Kamrang, a harbor first used by frigate "Pallada" in 1850-s, then by the Second Pacific Task Force in 1905, and then, built on Soviet money - a base for our Pacific Fleet.

Sailors from Pallada and then from "2nd Pacific" battleships said that Vietnam is a paradise on Earth.

Hangtime and other Vietnam vets - don't you think so?...

Sorry for a provocational question ;)
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Offline Gunslinger

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Havent we been here before?
« Reply #2 on: June 21, 2005, 08:28:52 PM »
Star that did catch my eye.  I also read that the US is Vietnam's biggest trading parting, somehting like 9.6 billion a year both ways.

This is interesting that former enemys open up this way.  I can't speak for vets or anything but to me it may look like a bright partnership.  I know alot of vets would talk about old wounds and such but like I said I can't speak for them.

Port call in NAM, bet the navy/USMC would have a good time with that!  :aok
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Offline Sandman

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« Reply #3 on: June 21, 2005, 09:21:29 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Gunslinger

Port call in NAM, bet the navy/USMC would have a good time with that!  :aok


...and then, three days later, they'll be standing in the sick call line. ;)
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Offline AdmRose

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Havent we been here before?
« Reply #4 on: June 21, 2005, 09:28:27 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Gunslinger
This is interesting that former enemys open up this way.  I can't speak for vets or anything but to me it may look like a bright partnership.  I know alot of vets would talk about old wounds and such but like I said I can't speak for them.


Japanese electronics and cars, German cars, Vietnamese everything...
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Offline Gunslinger

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« Reply #5 on: June 21, 2005, 10:54:21 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Sandman
...and then, three days later, they'll be standing in the sick call line. ;)


"doc it hurts when I pee"

Marines call this "getting your bore punched"

For those that don't get it, when you clean a rifle you run a rod attached to a cloth down the bore of the rifle.  It's usually really hard to pull through

sorry for the hijack, carry on!
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Offline Yeager

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« Reply #6 on: June 21, 2005, 11:53:40 PM »
borada, did you guys land any men on the moon?

Ok then, we get nam ;)
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Offline StarOfAfrica2

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Havent we been here before?
« Reply #7 on: June 22, 2005, 01:34:12 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Gunslinger
Star that did catch my eye.  I also read that the US is Vietnam's biggest trading parting, somehting like 9.6 billion a year both ways.

This is interesting that former enemys open up this way.  I can't speak for vets or anything but to me it may look like a bright partnership.  I know alot of vets would talk about old wounds and such but like I said I can't speak for them.

Port call in NAM, bet the navy/USMC would have a good time with that!  :aok


Apparently they want alot more than 9.6 billion a year.  They want a spot in the WTO (and Bush is willing to sponsor them) and have agreed to relax rules on religious freedoms in Vietnam in exchange.  They are also stepping up efforts to track down records for all those still MIA (I'm sure some of them will be "doctored", but maybe we will at least get the remains and close the files).

I have to say, ever since Clinton opened things up 10 years ago with the Vietnamese, they have really softened up.  The days of hardcore Communism apparently didnt pay off for them economically, and they want a piece of the pie.  And they figured out that becoming more "democratic" and brown-nosing the US is a good way to get rich quick.  I still dont think I'd trust any of them.  Friends you have to pay for dont stay friends long when things get tough.
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Offline rpm

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« Reply #8 on: June 22, 2005, 01:54:35 AM »
I'm sure the VC hold no grudges. I bet they would welcome uniformed American sailors and Marines on liberty with open arms.

WTF does Vietnam have that we want?
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Offline Excel1

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« Reply #9 on: June 22, 2005, 02:40:34 AM »
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Originally posted by rpm
WTF does Vietnam have that we want?


A border with China.

The US wants to put the brakes on China's growing influence in the region, hence the sucking-up to Vietnam.

Excel
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Offline MrCoffee

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« Reply #10 on: June 22, 2005, 05:43:27 AM »
deleted - rule #5
« Last Edit: June 22, 2005, 03:28:06 PM by MP6 »
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Offline cpxxx

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« Reply #11 on: June 22, 2005, 07:28:54 AM »
Mr Coffee, nurse is looking for you, your meds are due. There's a good boy.;)

I was in Vietnam in April. Talking to people there. I got the definite impression that they fear China and it's ambitions. China is in fact their traditional enemy going back many generations. Several people mentioned opening up Camh Ranh Bay naval base to the US Navy.  I was amazed.  The US Navy already visits so US sailors and presumably Marines have already had shore leave in Vietnam.

There was no detectable anti Americanism there that I could find. Quite the opposite in fact.

It's a country on the way up. As you drive through the countryside you see lots of poverty for sure. But you see lots of signs of people improving their lives. New houses being built, factories going up. There's still a lack of freedom though.

It is definitely a beautiful country and as I'm sure any vet will tell you so are the women.  As Boroda says some of it is a paradise on Earth. It would definitely a popular port of call for the US Navy.
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Offline lazs2

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« Reply #12 on: June 22, 2005, 07:43:24 AM »
why would they fear china?  Isn't china a commie country and didn't it help the north fight us and then defeat the south when we abandoned them?

lazs
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Offline detch01

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« Reply #13 on: June 22, 2005, 10:16:50 AM »
Lazs, China has been invading Vietnam since its early dynasties. There's a couple thousand years of experience of that happening.


asw
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Offline GtoRA2

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« Reply #14 on: June 22, 2005, 10:26:54 AM »
Didnt China invade in the late 70s and get their rears kicked?
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