A well regulated militia...

[Jigster]

Society has lost it's fear. That's the problem.

I suppose you could interchange that with respect but that's whats happened. But in this respect it's basically fear when you come right down to it.

No fear of authority figures, religous figures, laws, taboos, parents, etc etc.

[Mk10 225th]

Y'all don't need to worry about a thing.  We've got Dubya and Johnny Ashcroft runnin' this ship now, and we're going to put respect and family values back in the hearts and minds of our citizens faster'n you can say "One Nation Under God."

In just a little bit, the only ones being shot will be limp-wristed little liberal pansies that are trying to take away guns from good, honest, decent, God-fearing folk as they watch Big Business solve all the country's problems, and create a never-ending Nirvana for us all.

"...and I'd like to thank Mk10 for being here this evening.  He's a good man...an honest man...and I'm proud to be in his company tonight.  Hey, Mk, put down the beer when I'm talkin' to ya...and that girl sittin' on your lap...looks a little young to be your wife doesn't she?"

Seriously though, we all know how to solve this problem.  Start talking to your damn kids, and stop alienating them so they start thinking like a bunch of damn Goths with a suicide complex.  

If you've got guns and children in the same house, use a gun safe, gun locks, etc.

If you have to sleep with a loaded handgun under your pillow, or in your side table drawer, then you're going to have to live with the consequences.

If it's in a locked gun safe, or has a trigger blocking lock mechanism, the only way someone can be hurt with it is if they throw it at them.

Mk

[Toad]

"I won't be wronged. I won't be insulted, and I won't be laid a hand on. I don't do these things to other people, and I require the same from them." Am I a "Wayne-ist"?  

My children have grown up around guns. The only time they've had one in their hands they've either been target shooting or hunting.

They know exactly what happens when you pull a trigger...and they know absolutely that once discharged, the shot can never be called back.

Haven't had a single problem with my sons and guns. Not at home and not in the field.
Doubt that I ever will. I suspect that their sons and daughters never will have problems either.

It didn't just happen that way by accident though. They're my sons and I'm accountable and responsible for how they were raised. Their mother didn't work so that someone would always be there when they got home.

It's neat and easy to blame the inanimate object though, isn't it?

Good thing we banned all the rocks after Cain whacked Abel.  

[Dowding]

 

I won't be wronged. I won't be insulted, and I won't be laid a hand on. I don't do these things to other people, and I require the same from them.

[/b]

While these might seem comfortably absolute, they are on closer inspection anything but.

I'm sure there are plenty of people around who if you so even looked at them, they'd spit in your face. Or if you stood on their foot accidently, they'd give you a good kicking. They would still be adhering to Wayne's code of conduct in their eyes, wouldn't they?  

[Toad]

Dowding,

No.

[Dowding]

It's a matter of perspective and personal values. So of course it is.

[Toad]

Only in your perspective.    

You need to watch more JW movies.  

[PC]

Ammo, I am sure we could argue who really controls the National Guard all day, I will decline, as recent history speaks for its’ self.

PC gets on soapbox:

The right to keep and bear arms in the USA has absolutely nothing to do with sport shooting, hunting or even protecting ones home. You have to keep in mind what the writers of our wonderful constitution had been through and what they had on there minds.

There was a battle over whether to create a strong Federal government or not, even before our revolution. We nearly did not prevail and as a result, they decided that a government stronger than a confederation was needed. Fortunately, for all of us, they worked out the government that we used to have. These guys, even then, were not sure that they had done the right thing. That they had created something that one day might turn on and oppress its citizens, hence we have the Bill of Rights. . In reading our US Constitution, as Toad obviously has, you see many checks on power. This has come to be known as “Checks and Balances” and from this you can see that they were concerned about the possibility that this government would turn out like all the others had before.

Now, the people that wrote this had just risked their very lives to over throw what was a legitimate government and understood what it took them to win. So being afraid of what they created and knowing how to get rid of it just in case, they wrote the first two amendments. These two amendments have every thing to do with throwing off what Thomas Jefferson called a “foreign power”.  

If the government starts oppressing its’ people, it takes the press to tell them that them are being oppressed. Their job is really to keep that from happening in the first place.

The right to bare arms means, and I know that this is not practical today, that citizens should be armed well enough to meet a federal army.

Jeez, I hope they do not burn my house down around me…wait Janet is gone…. Whew.

I will step down now.

PC

[Tac]

"The right to bare arms means, and I know that this is not practical today, that citizens should be armed well enough to meet a federal army"

Or any army for that matter.

[PC]

Tac, you miss the point.. It is the LAW dude,do you have any respect for our constitution at all?

[Dowding]

Hey I'm not some sociopathic nutter - but there are people who are, and are insulted by the slightest thing.

I've seen 'The Shootist', it's a good film. But the only quote I can remember from any JW film is "Get off your horse and drink your milk."  

[Sandman_SBM]

 

The right to bare arms means, and I know that this is not practical today, that citizens should be armed well enough to meet a federal army.

No kidding. The government has much bigger guns.

Now... if the founding fathers truly meant that we should have an armed populace as one more piece of the checks and balances and that this armed populace would be expected to oppose the government if necessary, we need armor, field artillery, jet fighters, high explosives, etc.

[This message has been edited by Sandman_SBM (edited 03-25-2001).]

[Lephturn]

psssst.  The English aren't coming.  They cancelled that whole invasion thing a while back.

Lephturn

[Tac]

Yes, it is a law passed in a time when the nation literally depended on militia as its only armed forces. I respect your constitution very much, I just dislike people that hide behind it and abuse it. Like Lepth said, the brits aint invading anymore, you are the only superpower... the reason why that law was passed is so outdated its outright irrelevant today.

[Toad]

Nope, Tac, you miss the point.

The reason why that law was written was to ensure that the OTHER laws remain in effect.

It's as true now as it was then.

But this is a circular argument that has been made many times in other threads.


Dowding,

"but there are people who are, and are insulted by the slightest thing."

I'm sure there are. However, these examples would NOT be following JW's code. A guy steps on your foot (from your previous example) and apologizes, no problemo. A guy steps on your foot, stomps on it again and then says "What are ya going to do about it?", that's different.

People who get all cross-eyed over nothing are just looking for trouble.

The key is in the second part. It's simple respect for others. "I don't do these things to other people, and I require the same from them."

Minding your own business, respecting other folks as they mind theirs.

"R-E-S-P-E-C-T! Find out what it means to me!"  

Real, real simple.