P-51D vs Fw-190D

[Quah!]

Bwahahahha Dorka SUCKS  wurst plane in da set hahah running vulching Dorka dies hahahha wooooo11!!111one1!!!  

PFifty1 PWN!

[Mustaine]

as many of you know i have been a AVID dora pilot for almost 3.5 years....

flying the pony just for the past few weeks, i find absolutly no fear of a 190, even comming from above. i did have a great engagement with i think NORD, though i may be mistaken on who... i got him. that was the toughest fight i have seen. other than that, i think  i have been killed maybe 2 or 3 times by 190's that got a shot off because i flew stupid.

conversely, back in my dora, i had quite a few engagements with some the the "better" pony pilots, and mostly we came out even, with a slight advantage to them because i am not a good pilot in the first place. i can remember some specific 1-1's that we went over and over again, i think it was grmrpr. there were others, but mainly it was about even.

it is hard to say, and i still love my dora, but i might hae to give an edge to the p51 by maybe 55% to 45% for the dora. in the end pure pilot skill, AND knowledge of both planes abilities is the deciding factor i think.

just my 2¢

[Sp4de]

Originally posted by Quah!
Bwahahahha Dorka SUCKS  wurst plane in da set hahah running vulching Dorka dies hahahha wooooo11!!111one1!!!  

PFifty1 PWN!

[ghi]

i think the P51 with 4 x .50cals not 6,have better firepower than 2x 20mm MG151, on D9
I read about the german 20mm maingeschose shell, could bring down a fighter with 1 shell, and mostly 1 out of 3 were maingeschose,  but here the german 20mm are the most useless

[Urchin]

Originally posted by Kweassa
Since planes are being compared, basing the outcome on the pilot factor would be a moot point - both very green pilots and masterfully exceptional aces.

 Having said that, IMO both planes are roughly equal in almost every aspect, and the relative situation would decide everything.

They aren't roughly equal, the P-51 is much better.  The D-9 has an advantage in acceleration and sustained climb rate, but it can't fight its way out of a wet paper bag.  

If the two planes meet co-E, the P-51 will be all over the D-9 like stink on ****, the only thing the D-9 can do is flop and pray.

[dedalos]

Originally posted by Urchin
P-51 hands down.  Better guns, tougher plane, turns better, handles much better.

The D-9 is about worthless, the only people who fly it are people who would rather be in the La-7 but are to "proud".

[dedalos]

However, a smart D9 should win.  Slow down the fight so that the 51 thinks its going to be a turn fight.  Than the D9 can go nose down while stick stirring like a mad man to avoid getting hit.  It will pick up speed faster than the 51 and eventually, the D9 will be able to convert teh fight to an endless BnZ on the 51.  If the D9 gets in troble, stick stiring and diving to the deck is always an option.

There is a reason D9 drivers want the lala perked but not the 51

[LePaul]

Im not the greatest fighter guy out there but while the P-51 can maintain E and turn better, the Dora has that cannon...reach out and tap someone with a well placed cannon round and its game over.  For me, you really have to chew them up with those 50 cals a bit longer.

Like someone previously stated...depends on the pilot.  In the right hands, an Ace in a Ju88 could down a newb in either

[SMIDSY]

i would like to adress the issue of toughness. the pony was notoriously poor in terms of toughness. this is because of a number of things, chief among these is its water-cooled engine. also it was a larger plane than the 190 which made it a larger target. i am a huge fan of the 190's astounding roll rate. if this advantage is properly exploited by a competent pilot it will blast the crap out of a pony any day of the week.

and dare i say it: nuff said:cool:

[Krusty]

Historically they may have been a match. In AH2 the dora is at a disadvantage. If it slows below 170mph it stalls horrible (tip stalls, the plane snaps horribly in the direction of the stall), and it can only zoom so high, and can't loop over as well as the pony with its uberflappen(TM). So it can't turn. It can't outloop (maybe at first). It can't out dive, as the pony dives well, and would keep pace, so the field would be the same as before the dive. It might climb better but it's still not going to help it win a fight against a p51d. It really doesn't fair too well unless it has a slight advantage (starts in the p51ds rear quarter, has a little alt, has a lot of speed already, that type of thing).

I don't fly the dora too much. But when I do I find it hard to fight p47s let alone p51Ds (yeah, I've fought both many a time).

[Kweassa]

They aren't roughly equal, the P-51 is much better. The D-9 has an advantage in acceleration and sustained climb rate, but it can't fight its way out of a wet paper bag.

If the two planes meet co-E, the P-51 will be all over the D-9 like stink on ****, the only thing the D-9 can do is flop and pray.

 Well, not if the D-9 pilot takes the fight long, and sticks to long, fast passes and extensions.

 Sure, he'd be laughed at for being timid and passive and unaggressive... but if that's what it takes to kill a co-alt P-51 with a good pilot in it... yeah, I'd fly like that - to survive, and to win.

[FalconSix]

In a "dueling ladder" type 1-on-1 the 51 holds the best cards since the 190 isnt allowed to extend (i.e. run) and can only try to rope the 51.

However in the MA it is more of an equal match. The 51 has the advantage of better performance above 20k, and thus can (if the pilot cares for long climbs) gain an initial alt and speed advantage on the 190. The 190 otoh holds all the big E cards below 20k: speed, acceleration and climb. Basically if the 51 is to win it needs to win using its initial advantage. If the 190 manages to equalize E and bring the fight below 20k the 51 can only win if the 190 driver makes a mistake. The 190 can escape at will and deny the 51 the same. Speed and climb controls the fight.

[Urchin]

Originally posted by Kweassa
Well, not if the D-9 pilot takes the fight long, and sticks to long, fast passes and extensions.

 Sure, he'd be laughed at for being timid and passive and unaggressive... but if that's what it takes to kill a co-alt P-51 with a good pilot in it... yeah, I'd fly like that - to survive, and to win.

Even then, it would come down to a toss-up, were I in the P-51 the D-9 would never get a shot, unless it was a MAD type HO shot.  If the D-9 tries angles, it might get one shot thanks to quicker speed bleed-off, but after that the P-51 would control the fight.  If the D-9 tries "energy" fighting, the P-51 just has to force him up without enough speed to outrun the .50s.. even with the "new & improved" hit modelling that is still a very dicey proposition given the ballistics.  

So basically the D-9s only shot would be a timid bore n zoom type fight and the only hope of "winning" would be coming out of the joust crippled instead of dead.

[Kweassa]

So basically the D-9s only shot would be a timid bore n zoom type fight and the only hope of "winning" would be coming out of the joust crippled instead of dead.

 Right, but it's still better than dead

 Ttimid and bore-n-zoom it is, but still, against planes that are as fast as yours and yet still maneuvers much better.. there's basically no other choice than but to try and maximize whatever advantage there is.

 I'm just saying that if the D-9 pilot would deem it so important to really stick around and kill the P-51, instead of just run away, then there are still few advantages on its side which can turn the tables decisively - although it'd take a lot of time.

 Lure the 51 as low as possible, dance around but never commit.. and with each vertcical or extension, climb more and more until the vertical separation cumulates enough to give out a totally onesided BnZ opportunity.

 I know - it's boring, but it's still possible.

 
 At least, you can use this method against a P-51. Against a La-7... no chance at all..

[SirLoin]

Originally posted by FalconSix
In a "dueling ladder" type 1-on-1 the 51 holds the best cards since the 190 isnt allowed to extend (i.e. run) and can only try to rope the 51.

Extending is not running..and yes it is allowed.

Once the 190 runs the pony outta WEP...the stang is on the pure defensive.

Boring?..Yes..if you are the p51 dude.