Author Topic: Spoke to Pyro re Spits (Read 6062 times)

Bronk · « **Reply #150 on:** August 04, 2005, 04:35:42 PM »

Krusty ,
Ok topic is we might get holes filled in plane set. So once again . Show me the brit counterpart for the D9 thats unperked.

Bronk

Wotan · « **Reply #151 on:** August 04, 2005, 04:39:49 PM »

I don't have time right now to read most of the newer post but I just want to point something out...

I don't care about the 'boost' in so far as the boost chosen gives the greatest range of usage possible...

What I mean is I think an 18 lbs Spit XVI would have more use over a larger date range then one at 25lbs...

Kev seems to think the if it doesn't have 25lbs then it doesn't matter at all.

If Pyro models it with 25lbs and is swayed by the arguements of some of the Spit guys here that would be fine.. I would not think twice about it...

Things like this should be debated before hand.

Pyro has said:

Quote

There has been some advocacy for a +25lb boost clipped wing Mk XVI. I really don't see what hole that fills. It would pretty much fall into the same category as the XIV. I have no qualms with that plane, but I think going with a 2000+hp version of it would be a waste as it would end up perked and CM's wouldn't use it much either.

And I agree with him...

I don't agree with removing a 16lb Spit V for the same reason. A 16 lb Spit V would give us a greater range. We lack the LW planes to reallly match well with a 12lbs Spit V.

But these points are just minor and any new plane is a good plane...

If the list as suggested ends up as follows:

Spitfire Mk Ia
Spitfire Mk Vb
Spitfire F.Mk IX
Spitfire LF.Mk VIII
Seafire L.Mk III
Spitfire LF.Mk XVIe
Spitfire F.Mk XIV

Regardless of the boost settings adding the above Spits will be a good thing over all.

Kev367th · « **Reply #152 on:** August 04, 2005, 04:41:37 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Krusty
You understand nothing, apparently. I will not explain the quote in my sig, nor will I explain off-topic things to you, after I just posted to everyone that we should keep on-topic posts only, in here.

Hear , Hear,
Krusty has been one of the few LW who are willing to at least discuss the 25lbs Spit XVI and not immediately come out with "YOU CAN'T HAVE THAT".

Like we have said Wotan, yes it is a good list, but in the long run the boost settings are very important.
The Mk VIII at 18lbs boost will have an almost identical perfomance to the Mk XVI at 18lbs boost, in that case we don't need both, and probably won't get both, it almost duplication and a waste of effort.
There were more reasons to selecitng a 25lbs boost XVI than the extra performance, one of them was to avoid duplicaiton, the other was to allow the Spit LF VIII to stand in for the LF IX in scenarios.

Wotan · « **Reply #153 on:** August 04, 2005, 04:44:09 PM »

Quote

Just show me the brit counterpart for the D9 thats unperked.

The D-9 was not developed as a counter part or in response to any Spitfire...

It was there to basically deal with P-51s, What P-51 is perked?

Karnak · « **Reply #154 on:** August 04, 2005, 04:49:09 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Wotan
The D-9 was not developed as a counter part or in response to any Spitfire...

It was there to basically deal with P-51s, What P-51 is perked?

True, but more to the point is that perked status isn't done that way and it is irrelevant in the MA in the first place.

Bring in the Spits as:

Spitfire Mk Ia - 12lbs boost
Spitfire Mk Vb - 12lbs boost
Spitfire F.Mk IX - 15lbs boost
Spitfire LF.Mk VIII - 18lbs boost
Seafire L.Mk III - 18lbs boost
Spitfire LF.Mk XVIe - 18lbs boost
Spitfire F.Mk XIV - 21lbs boost (perked)

That will work for AH2, ToD Scenarios and the CT.

Kev367th · « **Reply #155 on:** August 04, 2005, 04:55:27 PM »

No point 'duplicating' the 8 and 16, will get one or the other - not both.
Almost no differnece in performance, very little difference if layout.

May 1944 - 1st use of 150 grade fuel/25lbs boost (Spit LF IX).
Oct 1944 - Spit XVI delivered.
Nov 1944 - 2TAF cleared to use 150 grade unit wide.

I wonder if there would have been same fuss if we'd asked for a 1944 Spit LF IX with 25lbs boost?

Karnak · « **Reply #156 on:** August 04, 2005, 05:03:56 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Kev367th
No point 'duplicating' the 8 and 16, will get one or the other - not both.
Almost no differnece in performance, very little difference if layout.

How many times does it need to be explained to you? I have told you over and over why it is a good thing to have both and yet you insist on pouting.

If we have only the XVI we will never have a chance to get it at +25lbs because of the big gaping hole that would open. Further there would be endless whines about using it in any scenario where a universal wing Spit should be used or a non-clipped Spit should be used. If you don't think that would be used to justify keeping Spits out of scenarios you haven't watched the CT for the last year.

In order to keep all options open we need both the VIII and XVI.

Kev367th · « **Reply #157 on:** August 04, 2005, 05:07:45 PM »

I'd be very surprised.

Wotan · « **Reply #158 on:** August 04, 2005, 05:09:58 PM »

Quote

That will work for AH2, ToD Scenarios and the CT.

As I pointed out I have no interest in the main so my points are always based on ToD.

Quote

No point 'duplicating' the 8 and 16, will get one or the other - not both.
Almost no differnece in performance, very little difference if layout.

A CW SpitXVI will be a different plane then a standard VIII. It's roll rate for one will improve, it wont turn as well etc...

They will be differences and players jumping from one to the other will have to learn those differences even if they are subtle. A lot complaints that come from folks about the Spit XIV is that they try to fly it like the Spit IX or V.

Any way why does there need to be such a huge difference in performance to justify both? Look at the G-2 and G-6 in AH...

The G-6 is a bit draggier but other then that they perform real close to each other...

Kev367th · « **Reply #159 on:** August 04, 2005, 05:16:29 PM »

The difference is so minimal.
The full span 8 with turn better, roll worse and vice vesa.
Performance wise you are talking so close as to not be a factor, same engine, same boost.

Still think the gem of the bunch is the Seafire III, people complained about the current Spit V, they're gonna love this little beauty.
Within a tad of being as fast as a Spit VIII and XVI under 10k, but much more nimbler.
Can carry a drop tank so gets rid of our current V's main drawback - range.
Same ammo loadout as current V.
Carries 1 1000lb or 500lb
Boost up from +16 to +18

.

Guppy35 · « **Reply #160 on:** August 04, 2005, 05:37:07 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Kev367th
The difference is so minimal.
The full span 8 with turn better, roll worse and vice vesa.
Performance wise you are talking so close as to not be a factor, same engine, same boost.

Still think the gem of the bunch is the Seafire III, people complained about the current Spit V, they're gonna love this little beauty.
Within a tad of being as fast as a Spit VIII and XVI under 10k, but much more nimbler.
Can carry a drop tank so gets rid of our current V's main drawback - range.
Same ammo loadout as current V.
Carries 1 1000lb or 500lb
Boost up from +16 to +18 .

Gonna disagree with you on the minimal differences between the VIII and XVI.

Two different birds used for different things in different theaters of the war. I'd give up the FIX before I'd want to lose the VIII. Too many options outside of the MA for the VIII, Barney Newman's 79 Squadron Spit 8 for one

The MTO and SEAC birds would be well represented by the correct Spit variant then, not with a bastardized FIX. And of course the USAAF flew their share of VIIIs in the MTO too.

Better off going with a clipped LFIXe if there needs to be a specific IX in the mix.

Then again lets get all three, FIX, LFVIII and LFXVIe

Dan/CorkyJr

Kev367th · « **Reply #161 on:** August 04, 2005, 05:38:40 PM »

Don't get me wrong, it would be nice to see all of them, just got a nagging doubt, after all I did actually talk to Pyro.
From his point of view its easier to go the other route.

By not too different I meant performance wise, and in a scenario a clipped wing XVI masquerading as a clipped VIII probably wouldn't be noticed if it wasn't for the tag by a lot of people.

But you never know.

lasersailor184 · « **Reply #162 on:** August 04, 2005, 05:44:54 PM »

You're asking for the Spit 1 at +12 boost with wep?

It already goes to +12 with wep.

Kev367th · « **Reply #163 on:** August 04, 2005, 05:47:07 PM »

Even Pyro has said our current Spit I only runs to 6 on 87 grade fuel.
I dunno.

Thats what he is going to change on it, its not asking, he is changing it.

lasersailor184 · « **Reply #164 on:** August 04, 2005, 06:01:16 PM »

You said that the Boost ratings everyone is talking about is the boost for Wep.

The current Spit 1 has +6 on full power and +12 on WEP.