Author Topic: Iraq and their women  (Read 897 times)

Offline Silat

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Iraq and their women
« on: August 15, 2005, 04:22:35 PM »
If the new Iraq constitution doesnt give women equal rights then this will all be for nought.
Bringing their women into the 21st century is just what the Islamic world needs. Without this it will continue to be a disaster and dangerous terrorist breeding ground.
+Silat
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Offline Raider179

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Re: Iraq and their women
« Reply #1 on: August 15, 2005, 04:29:46 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Silat
If the new Iraq constitution doesnt give women equal rights then this will all be for nought.
Bringing their women into the 21st century is just what the Islamic world needs. Without this it will continue to be a disaster and dangerous terrorist breeding ground.


One of the provisions of their preliminary "Bill of Rights"


8. The state shall provide for harmonization of the duties of the women towards their family and their work in the society. [It shall also provide for] their equality with men in all fields without
disturbing the provisions of the Islamic shari‘a.

Sounds like equality as long as its on par with the Qur'an. Thats the problem with Religion superceeding government, You have rights, as long as they dont conflict with a book from 1300 yrs ago. That is no democracy they are building. It's a theocracy.

Offline Toad

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Iraq and their women
« Reply #2 on: August 15, 2005, 04:53:03 PM »
You might want to wait until it is written before condemning it.

CNN:

Quote
"The issue of religion has been over-emphasized," al-Rubaie said. "We are not drafting a constitution for America. We are drafting a constitution for Iraq. And the majority of Iraqis are Muslims. And the majority of those are serious, practicing Muslims."

U.S. Ambassador to Iraq Zalmay Khalilzad, speaking Sunday on NBC's "Meet the Press," said he had "every expectation" the document would include equal rights for women "and that our efforts and the effort of many women here in Iraq and the international community will ultimately pay off on this score."




Anyway, predict disaster before it's even written or wait a bit and see what actually does happen.

Your call.
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Offline ChickenHawk

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Iraq and their women
« Reply #3 on: August 15, 2005, 06:22:56 PM »
The government can make any law it wants concerning equal rights.  Unfortunatly, tradition and religion trump government laws.

Just like the cast system in Indi is outlawed but if you go there, the cast system is alive and well.

It will take generations of honest effort for women to have equal rights in Iraq.  Only time will tell if the government has the stomach to keep pushing for it.
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Offline 1K3

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Iraq and their women
« Reply #4 on: August 15, 2005, 06:28:47 PM »
I recall that Saddam's regime guaranteed equal rights to women. Under Saddam, women...

*didnt have to wear taliban style veils (lol!)
*they wore western style clothes
*women are allowed to drive automobiles
*well educated and were in top positions (but just stay out of Saddamn's way ;))


but...

women are still violated... all because of Uday!:mad:


btw...

Sen. Clinton noted that while Saddam had been "an equal opportunity oppressor," women were at least assured certain constitutional guarantees.
« Last Edit: August 15, 2005, 06:34:32 PM by 1K3 »

Offline cpxxx

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Iraq and their women
« Reply #5 on: August 15, 2005, 08:43:13 PM »
Look lets get real and be cynical. We really don't care what they do to their women. Look at Saudia Arabia. All we want is a stable, vaguely democratic, western leaning country occupying a strategic position in the middle east.

Even in western countries Muslim women are restricted. No law can stop that.

Have no illusions. The Iraqi constitution is never going be a copy of the American constitution and Iraq is never going to be a democracy the way we experience it.

The best we can hope for is something like the usual Arab compromise.

Offline Hangtime

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Iraq and their women
« Reply #6 on: August 15, 2005, 09:19:39 PM »
^^^

pretty much nailed it..

That they've accomplished as much as they have to date is truly remarkable.. if it doesn't collapse into a bloody civil war will be a freakin miracle.

I hold out hope, but my expectations are not high.
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Offline Torque

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Iraq and their women
« Reply #7 on: August 15, 2005, 09:28:47 PM »
oddly enough, iraq’s system of laws that repressed the religious majority granted Iraqi women almost parity status with men. the old system did not adhere to the teachings of islam required by law, women living in iraq enjoyed many freedoms that their neighbors did not.

iraqi women held 20 per cent of the seats in the former iraqi parliament.

women hold roughly 14 percent of congressional seats in the united states.
« Last Edit: August 15, 2005, 09:33:53 PM by Torque »

Offline GRUNHERZ

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Iraq and their women
« Reply #8 on: August 15, 2005, 09:44:01 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Torque


iraqi women held 20 per cent of the seats in the former iraqi parliament.

women hold roughly 14 percent of congressional seats in the united states.


:rofl

You didnt just make that comparison did you?

Offline Ripsnort

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Iraq and their women
« Reply #9 on: August 16, 2005, 07:57:43 AM »
There are a lot of heavy weight issues yet to be determined. It will take an extraordinary amount of flexibility to reach a compromise on issues such as state religion’s role in law, the right for the Kurdish people to form their own country and woman’s rights.

My guess is that if the women retain the right to vote, they will be ok in the long run as politicians will court their vote. One week to tackle these issues is a challenge.

However I must point out (waves to Silat) that there are those out there in the world that will consider this whole affair in Iraq a failure if women don't get their rights restored to that of the previous murderous regrime. Mind you, we're talking a predominant Islamic culture in Iraq, where women typically don't carry such rights. Now, I'm not in agreement with that if thats the direction they choose, but we've given the Iraqi people the opportunity to decide these things without fear of reprisal from a tyrant. The leftists elites try to dig up anything to make it appear a failure, almost as though they do not want any success in Iraq in order to appear correct in their miscalculated presumptions.

Offline DREDIOCK

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Re: Iraq and their women
« Reply #10 on: August 16, 2005, 08:09:32 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Silat
If the new Iraq constitution doesnt give women equal rights then this will all be for nought.
Bringing their women into the 21st century is just what the Islamic world needs. Without this it will continue to be a disaster and dangerous terrorist breeding ground.


Why? Because we did?

How would women not having equal rights have anything to do with it being a terrorist breeding ground?

I fail to see what one has to do with the other.
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Offline lazs2

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Iraq and their women
« Reply #11 on: August 16, 2005, 08:21:00 AM »
I don't know if it is a matter of how many women have been given resposnsible positions but a matter of gurantees of personal freedom that counts.   If the sadman made it a law that ALL women could not be prevented from driveing cars then that was good... if he picked and chose what women could drive or just ignored it when some did... it was a worthless n"freedom"..

Same for veils.. if wearing or not was just ignored then it was a worthless freedom... it has to have the protection of law or... better yet... the protection of limiting governments rights to force women to wear veils...  

If the sadman hand picked maleable women to be under him in his pupet government then it was a worthless statistic how many women there were.

lazs

Offline jEEZY

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Re: Iraq and their women
« Reply #12 on: August 16, 2005, 10:03:17 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Silat
If the new Iraq constitution doesnt give women equal rights then this will all be for nought.
Bringing their women into the 21st century is just what the Islamic world needs. Without this it will continue to be a disaster and dangerous terrorist breeding ground.


Does that mean the US Constitution is fatally flawed since it has no gaurantee for "equal rights" for women?

Offline Ripsnort

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Re: Re: Iraq and their women
« Reply #13 on: August 16, 2005, 10:22:33 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by jEEZY
Does that mean the US Constitution is fatally flawed since it has no gaurantee for "equal rights" for women?


Or that Gay marriage is not recognized by the constitution? ;)

Offline Charon

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Iraq and their women
« Reply #14 on: August 16, 2005, 11:26:57 AM »
Quote
That they've accomplished as much as they have to date is truly remarkable.. if it doesn't collapse into a bloody civil war will be a freakin miracle.

I hold out hope, but my expectations are not high.



Nail on the head :aok

Charon