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Author Topic: And Now From Our What Were They Thinking Department  (Read 2348 times)

Offline rpm

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And Now From Our What Were They Thinking Department
« on: September 14, 2005, 11:41:48 PM »
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In the Wednesday decision, Judge Lawrence Karlton said: "The court concludes that it is bound by the Ninth Circuit's previous determination that the school district's policy with regard to the pledge is an unconstitutional violation of the children's right to be free from a coercive requirement to affirm God."

In effect, the decision reopens the way for Newdow and others to argue the merits of the case before higher courts. The Supreme Court did not decide on that when it ruled Newdow did not have standing to bring the case.

How can they say the pledge of alegance is unconstitutional? Isn't the pledge in it's self an affirmation of the constitution?
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Offline Nash

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« Reply #1 on: September 14, 2005, 11:49:49 PM »
I know nobody can relate... But I did all the book reports, homework assignments, and laps around the track that were assigned to me... but I never repeated a single thing anyone told me as if it were mantra. Let alone repeat it over and over every single day, day in and day out for twelve years.

And I love my country. Go figure.
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Offline Holden McGroin

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Re: And Now From Our What Were They Thinking Department
« Reply #2 on: September 14, 2005, 11:50:56 PM »
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Originally posted by rpm
How can they say the pledge of alegance is unconstitutional? Isn't the pledge in it's self an affirmation of the constitution?


(Paraphrasing) Congress shall make no law establishing religion or prohibiting the free excercise thereof...

There are some who believe that the "under God" phrase is establishing religion.

A more tolerant view is to see the phrase in a larger context and realise that many of the founding fathers did have a religious context to their thoughts and reciting "one nation under God" pays homage not to the God but to the concepts of those founders.
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Offline Pooh21

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« Reply #3 on: September 14, 2005, 11:51:10 PM »
Apparently according to that Newdow guy it is forcing God down his throat and his weak mind cant handle the stress.

Apparently when cogress added "Under God" to the pledge in 1954 they made a state religion.
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Offline DREDIOCK

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Re: Re: And Now From Our What Were They Thinking Department
« Reply #4 on: September 14, 2005, 11:58:32 PM »
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Originally posted by Holden McGroin
(Paraphrasing) Congress shall make no law establishing religion or prohibiting the free excercise thereof...

 


nope.

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion  , or prohibiting the free exercise thereof..."


The Myth of the separation of church and state
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Offline Nash

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« Reply #5 on: September 15, 2005, 12:03:17 AM »
an?
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Offline DREDIOCK

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« Reply #6 on: September 15, 2005, 12:05:19 AM »
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Originally posted by Pooh21
Apparently according to that Newdow guy it is forcing God down his throat and his weak mind cant handle the stress.

Apparently when cogress added "Under God" to the pledge in 1954 they made a state religion.


Which religion? Cristian, Jewish,Budda,Muslam,Hindu, American indian?

Seems to me by ruling it unconstitutional they are also violating the "Free exercise" portion of it too.

I remember when I was in school they didnt make you say it. It was a choice to recite the pledge. And if you didnt want to recite it you didnt have to. But you did have to sit quietly while everyone else did.

Seems the fairest way to me.
But of course that would never be good enough for Newdow.

Cant someone just put him out of his and our misery?
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Offline DREDIOCK

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« Reply #7 on: September 15, 2005, 12:06:36 AM »
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Originally posted by Nash
an?


Yes. AN
In other words we cant have a holy american empire based on one solitary religion
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Offline Sandman

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« Reply #8 on: September 15, 2005, 12:07:14 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Pooh21
Apparently according to that Newdow guy it is forcing God down his throat and his weak mind cant handle the stress.

Apparently when cogress added "Under God" to the pledge in 1954 they made a state religion.


Did the Congress also decide that this must be recited at public schools?
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Offline Pooh21

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« Reply #9 on: September 15, 2005, 12:10:36 AM »
I dont think so, they never FORCED us to say it. If you didnt want to say it you didnt have to. All you had to do was sit quiet for a minute(fascism rears its ugly head!!!!!1111one) Second if you feel that strongly about it. Then you could just as easily said. "Under: (insert your favorite diety,sports team,great pumpkin, krusty the clown, etc.
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Offline Sandman

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« Reply #10 on: September 15, 2005, 12:11:06 AM »
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Originally posted by DREDIOCK
Which religion? Cristian, Jewish,Budda,Muslam,Hindu, American indian?
 


Hmm... the Congress added "under God" to the pledge as a result of a campaign by the Knights of Columbus. As the KOC are Catholic, what "god" do you think they we're referring to?
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Offline Sandman

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« Reply #11 on: September 15, 2005, 12:14:36 AM »
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Originally posted by Pooh21
I dont think so, they never FORCED us to say it. If you didnt want to say it you didnt have to. All you had to do was sit quiet for a minute(fascism rears its ugly head!!!!!1111one) Second if you feel that strongly about it. Then you could just as easily said. "Under: (insert your favorite diety,sports team,great pumpkin, krusty the clown, etc.


True enough, but when it comes to stuff like this, most kids just do what the rest of the class is doing.

I've stated it before and I'll state it again... I think the Pledge of Allegience lacks any meaning at all. It's trite. Most people simply say the words and don't even pause to think about what they mean.
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Offline Gunslinger

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« Reply #12 on: September 15, 2005, 12:23:30 AM »
my only thoughts on this (well ok not my ONLY thoughts cause everyone here knows i'm opinionated) is that imagine what it's going to cost the federal govt when the ACLU wins this law suit and we have to reprint all our money.


In addition.....keep in mind this involves (somehow) the 9th circuit court of appeals.....the most overturned court in US history.
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Offline Vulcan

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« Reply #13 on: September 15, 2005, 12:28:59 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Pooh21
Apparently according to that Newdow guy it is forcing God down his throat and his weak mind cant handle the stress.

Apparently when cogress added "Under God" to the pledge in 1954 they made a state religion.


And how would you feel if it was changed to under Allah?
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Offline Toad

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« Reply #14 on: September 15, 2005, 12:38:34 AM »
He's a District Court judge. It'll go to the 9th again and then the SC if they push it that far.

As for the 9th.... what Guns said.
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