Author Topic: Nickname of P38? (Read 6475 times)

Ack-Ack · « **Reply #75 on:** November 16, 2005, 01:34:10 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Crumpp
That's ok, Straffo. The Luftwaffe thought it was just a target.

It was mentioned as the most desirable USAAF fighter to encounter in air combat.

All the best,

Crumpp

And yet had a good combat record against LW planes during the war and in AH, no LW planes can match the P-38 in a fight.

Enjoy,

ack-ack

Ack-Ack · « **Reply #76 on:** November 16, 2005, 01:35:59 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Sable
Just out of curiosity, do you have a source to back that up? From what I've read, #1 and #2 for american aces were the F6F and P-51 respectively.

In the PTO, the majority of the USAAF aces were P-38 pilots, followed by P-40 pilots then P-47 pilots and finally P-51 pilots bringing up the rear.

ack-ack

Crumpp · « **Reply #77 on:** November 16, 2005, 04:19:49 AM »

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And yet had a good combat record against LW planes during the war and in AH, no LW planes can match the P-38 in a fight.

Hook set. I know I would get one Straffo.

All the best,

Crumpp

cempa · « **Reply #78 on:** November 16, 2005, 01:15:32 PM »

See Rule #5

Sable · « **Reply #79 on:** November 16, 2005, 01:32:48 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Ack-Ack
In the PTO, the majority of the USAAF aces were P-38 pilots, followed by P-40 pilots then P-47 pilots and finally P-51 pilots bringing up the rear.

ack-ack

Ahhhh ... you are just talking USAAF in the PTO ... gotcha.

Magoo · « **Reply #80 on:** November 16, 2005, 01:59:05 PM »

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In it the P38 is refered too as the "Großer Gewehrkugelschwamm". Not sure what that means.

Crumpp - I looked this up in a German to English dictionary on the web and apparently it translates loosely as "The big bullet sponge" (SCHEISS!) Maybe bullet magnet as read by a co-worker who took German in college.

Magoo

Murdr · « **Reply #81 on:** November 16, 2005, 02:20:46 PM »

cempa it is not a matter of 'good old boys'. The so called 'good old boys' have observed the BBS enough to know what will and wont be acceptable postings....even though they dont always abide by it. Often it isnt what you say, but the manner in which you say it.

I am also one of the '38 jockeys' and I disagreed with your original assessment of how not to fly the 38, but I stayed out of that aspect since it was already heavly covered.

Magoo · « **Reply #82 on:** November 16, 2005, 03:16:14 PM »

WTF DID I SAY? it wasnt called the "zippo" it was called the "Ronson". this is because the Ronson Lighter Company's slogan was (are you paying attention?) "ALWAYS LIGHTS UP THE FIRST TIME". friggin coffin stuffers!

Lighten up Smidsy

try some de-caf

He thought it was funny because I screwed it up so bad!

Oh, and thanks for correcting me

Magoo

Crumpp · « **Reply #83 on:** November 16, 2005, 04:02:47 PM »

Quote

Crumpp - I looked this up in a German to English dictionary on the web and apparently it translates loosely as "The big bullet sponge" (SCHEISS!) Maybe bullet magnet as read by a co-worker who took German in college.

Wonder if they could be refering to the P 38's toughness and ability to take damage?

All the best,

Crumpp

straffo · « **Reply #84 on:** November 16, 2005, 04:06:48 PM »

See Rule #16

Squire · « **Reply #85 on:** November 16, 2005, 04:18:12 PM »

According to Barret Tillmans book, the F6F was indeed the USAs top ace maker, 307 USN and USMC pilots scoring 5 or more.

The book also claims 275 Aces for the P-51 Mustang.

John Stanaways two books on the P-38 lists 157 USAAF P-38 aces in WW2.

Would be interesting to get the other totals, just to have a look at them. I think the P-51 is higher than one might think because although it was a late starter, so many FGs eventually flew it.

cempa · « **Reply #86 on:** November 16, 2005, 06:45:35 PM »

See Rule #4

Widewing · « **Reply #87 on:** November 16, 2005, 08:51:56 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Squire
According to Barret Tillmans book, the F6F was indeed the USAs top ace maker, 307 USN and USMC pilots scoring 5 or more.

If we look at fighters deployed to the Pacific, we find that the F6F was the biggest killer by a substantial margin.

PTO/SWPA kills by type.

F6F-3/5: 5,156 kills, 307 aces
F4U (all): 2,140 kills, 93 aces
P-38 (all): 1,717 kills, 90 aces
F4Fs/FMs: 1,514 kills, 84 aces
P-39 (all): 243 kills, 1 ace
P-40 (all): 706 kills, 28 aces
P-47 (all): 697 kills, 32 aces
P-51 (all): 296 kills, 5 aces
P-61: 63 kills, 1 ace

One huge advantage for the F6F, F4F-4 and later F4U pilots was that their carriers brought them to the fight. Most USAAF fighter pilots had to bring themselves to where the enemy was. This may not seem significant on the face of it, but it was critical in terms of opportunites to engage the enemy. P-39s were the shortest range fighters of the lot and not able to fly the long distances to reach Japanese air power. Navy fighters were delivered to a location where the enemy was, usually in large numbers. Ace George Welch logged well over 100 P-39 sorties and encountered Japanese aircraft just once (he made the most of it, shooting down 3).

USAAF pilots in the SWPA simply did not get the number of opportunities as Navy carrier pilots, and that is reflected in the total scoring.

Even with its long range, the P-38s usually had to fly hours to encounter the Japanese. Such was the nature of things in the Southwest Pacific.

My regards,

Widewing

Krusty · « **Reply #88 on:** November 16, 2005, 09:04:26 PM »

Boyington claimed 4-5 kills but the planes were on the ground, and the Navy didn't want to count them, as they did not count planes that were on the ground. So whether he beat Rickenbacker is up to debate.

Debonair · « **Reply #89 on:** November 16, 2005, 10:19:32 PM »

I remember reading some AVG pilot's book, Robert Goebel's I think, saying Boyington's claims with the AVG were overstated by about four. Read it a long time ago, though, so i'm likely inaccurate. Anyway, 19 is a major score also