Author Topic: Oil companies have big quarter  (Read 1200 times)

Offline Sixpence

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Oil companies have big quarter
« on: November 09, 2005, 11:56:38 AM »
Wow, taking advantage of a hurricane to pork the people, even the republicans are pissed. When asked by a republican if they would give 10% of those record profits to poor Americans to heat their homes this winter? "We shouldn't fund government programs"

Well Golly-geen, if you didn't rape the American public after the hurricanes, maybe there wouldn't be a need fund a program to heat homes of poor Americans.

Refineries? Why would they want refineries? They are getting filthy rich without them
"My grandaddy always told me, "There are three things that'll put a good man down: Losin' a good woman, eatin' bad possum, or eatin' good possum."" - Holden McGroin

(and I still say he wasn't trying to spell possum!)

Offline ygsmilo

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Oil companies have big quarter
« Reply #1 on: November 09, 2005, 12:43:56 PM »
I, as a stock holder in various energy companies am satisfied in their performance.  That is why I own the stock.......

Hit a fricking home run on some tanker stocks though.

Offline eagl

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Oil companies have big quarter
« Reply #2 on: November 09, 2005, 01:00:34 PM »
As a stockholder, I thank every SUV owner for helping put a little extra coin in my bank accounts.

Thank you very much.  Your contributions are appreciated.
Everyone I know, goes away, in the end.

Offline J_A_B

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Oil companies have big quarter
« Reply #3 on: November 09, 2005, 01:11:20 PM »
The recent performance of the oil companies is just more proof of why essentially laissez-faire capitalism isn't ideal for essential products.   What's good for the oil companies isn't what's good for the country as a whole.

While communism isn't the answer, stuff like this makes it easy to see how communism got started.


J_A_B

Offline SirLoin

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« Reply #4 on: November 09, 2005, 02:02:26 PM »
"Greed is good."..Gord Gekko.
**JOKER'S JOKERS**

Offline Charon

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Oil companies have big quarter
« Reply #5 on: November 09, 2005, 02:48:02 PM »
Quote
Wow, taking advantage of a hurricane to pork the people, even the republicans are pissed.


They are pissed because ignorant constituents who don't know how commodities markets work or understand supply, geography and hurricane damage are pissed and they are politicians whose business is to be outraged, as appropriate.

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Well Golly-geen, if you didn't rape the American public after the hurricanes, maybe there wouldn't be a need fund a program to heat homes of poor Americans.


You don't know an awful lot about our petroleum infrastructure, do you? Don’t know supply, demand and what happens when two hurricanes shut out 10 percent of gasoline supply with a 3 percent leeway. Without those prices there would have been dry tanks. $3.00 gas for a week or no gas frequently or 3 hour waits in line -- you make the call. Don't worry, there are plenty of politicians with the same level of ignorance working to pass laws that may **** the consumer back to regulated 1970s gas prices and supply shortages :aok  If consumers want even lower prices then they should think conservation (****can the SUV and 250+hp “sedan”) and stop buying all those Chinese made Wal-Mart products and outsourcing tech work to Indian that is contributing to energy growth in those countries.

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Refineries? Why would they want refineries? They are getting filthy rich without them


What has been the average return on refining and how does that compare to the S&P? How much reinvestment takes place in refining for no ROI (think ULSD regs or mobile point). Why have the majors worked so hard to sell off their refining interests? I have a great idea though. Let's pass laws so that refineries can't make a profit once in a while (compared to 5 percent average). Just think of all the investment that would flow in to help build new refineries or keep the existing ones open or expanding capacity if you cant' expect to ever make any money on that investment.

Oil is $60 + bbl. The demand is so high and growing that production can't keep up. Selling lots of oil at super high stock market set prices = tremendous profits. Oil prices are set by the Nymex. There were traders bragging that they didn't have to pull a ticket until the New Year after Katrina -- where's their contribution to heating fuel costs?

Even at $3.00/gallon gas was still cheaper, adjusted for inflation and growth, than gas was in 1981. In 1981 you couldn't buy a car that had a V8 engine with any power or had a speedometer that registered over 85-mph on the speedometer. We all had to "Drive 55!" Now, you get a guy *****ing at the price of gas during Katrina while taking a 5000 mi a round trip in his Hummer to drop his daughter off at collage (true story). What has changed? The reality is we're not going to see oil price below $40 - $50 again, short of a major demand killing recession. 1973 wasn't the exception, it represented the rule to come. The 1990s were an exception -- that time is passing.

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The recent performance of the oil companies is just more proof of why essentially laissez-faire capitalism isn't ideal for essential products. What's good for the oil companies isn't what's good for the country as a whole.


We already tried the alternative from 1973 to 1981 -- it didn't work. Don't worry though, we may all get a chance to revist exactly why it didn't work here and why it doesn't work elsewhere with our 15 minute attention span and "do something" Congress. There is simply too little oil being produced (though the Saudis and others are ramping up) and too much, and growing international demand with most of that coming from America.

Charon
« Last Edit: November 09, 2005, 02:59:05 PM by Charon »

Offline Vipermann

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Oil companies have big quarter
« Reply #6 on: November 09, 2005, 02:59:32 PM »
I'll have to agree with eagl and milo. I've made much more in petro related stocks than I've spent in increases at the pump.

Right now I'm hoping that the increases in natural gas that are being forcasted come true as I've been increasing my position in related companies.


Milo which tanker stocks were you in?
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Offline Debonair

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« Reply #7 on: November 09, 2005, 03:09:48 PM »
You know who has some fat quarters?
Ryan.
Get your quarters from that dude

Offline indy007

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Oil companies have big quarter
« Reply #8 on: November 09, 2005, 03:17:38 PM »
I'm hoping to hear more about a large scale deployment of oil shale in-situ processing. Thanks to Shell research it's now competitive with drilling. We just happen to have some of the largest deposits of oil shale in the world in the U.S.

Hopefully good things to come with that.

Offline J_A_B

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Oil companies have big quarter
« Reply #9 on: November 09, 2005, 03:30:38 PM »
"We already tried the alternative from 1973 to 1981 -- it didn't work. "

What about the 1920's-1970's when it DID work?  Conveniently forgotten, it seems.  You sound like a poster child for the oil companies.  

A hurricane damage some refineries?  Well boo-hoo.  If they built more in the first place and maintained useful excess capacity it wouldn't be a problem...but they don't want to build more because excess capacity isn't "good economic sense".  Refineries running at less than peak capacity generates less than maximum potential revenue.   Also, artificially bottlenecked supply allows the companies to sell their product for several times what the market would otherwise pay for it.  

Your line of laissez-faire thinking would return us to the bad old days of the 1890's with corporations doing whatever they wanted.  The shareholders made out, and tough luck for everyone else.  Unfortunately that's the direction this country is gradually headed, at least until the pendulum once again swings back in the other direction.

I view industries vital to national well-being (telephone, electric, fuel, etc) as being more important than the pocketbooks of shareholders.  Sevice and accessibility should NOT be sacrificed in the name of higher profits (witness blackout problems thanks to electric utility cost-cutting in the name of profitability since deregulation).  If the oil companies operated in such a manner as to focus on maximum output while maintaining some level of profitability--development of oil shale resources, etc--our fuel prices would never reach half of what they peaked at recently.  The companies won't do that on their own though since it would lower overall earnings per share.   Note that they'd still remain profitable, just not so profitable as they currently are.   But that isn't good enough in a purely greed-driven economy.


"Without those prices there would have been dry tanks. $3.00 gas for a week or no gas frequently or 3 hour waits in line -- you make the call."

Again, shortages are a short-term problem which demonstrate that supply is lower than demand.  The solutions are to either increase production to meet demand, or increase prices until demand falls.  Increasing production involves expenses which will result in lower overall earnings per share than simply raising prices.  Oil companies therefore like shortages which are otherwise bad for the country.  It's an obvious conflict of interest.

J_A_B
« Last Edit: November 09, 2005, 03:39:16 PM by J_A_B »

Offline Krusher

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Oil companies have big quarter
« Reply #10 on: November 09, 2005, 03:40:30 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by eagl
As a stockholder, I thank every SUV owner for helping put a little extra coin in my bank accounts.

Thank you very much.  Your contributions are appreciated.



I own a car that gets 35+ MPG and Exxon stock that I bought at 48 or so.

SUV owners are like money in the bank :)
« Last Edit: November 09, 2005, 03:48:13 PM by Krusher »

Offline ygsmilo

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Oil companies have big quarter
« Reply #11 on: November 09, 2005, 03:44:01 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Vipermann

Milo which tanker stocks were you in?


FRO:

The candlesticks gave a good buy sign at 38 in June, sold against a double top hammer at 46 in Sept.  Its pretty doggy now but I will reown it when there is another confirmed buy sign. It was a good rate of return for no longer than we held it.  One other thing for a long term investment look at the dividends that they have been paying.
« Last Edit: November 09, 2005, 03:55:57 PM by ygsmilo »

Offline Ripsnort

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« Reply #12 on: November 09, 2005, 03:45:17 PM »
Though I don't own any direct stock the mutual funds that have oil companies as part of their portfolio are doing rather well!

Those to the right take advantage of good market situations, those on the left sit and cry.....

Offline Vipermann

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Oil companies have big quarter
« Reply #13 on: November 09, 2005, 03:59:13 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by ygsmilo
FRO:

The candlesticks gave a good buy sign at 38 in June, sold against a double top hammer at 46 in Sept.  Its pretty doggy now but I will reown it when there is another confirmed buy sign. It was a good rate of return for no longer than we held it.



Thanks. I've been in and out of NAT and VLCCF several times this year. I'm going to add FRO to my watch list as well.
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Offline Curval

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Oil companies have big quarter
« Reply #14 on: November 09, 2005, 04:01:22 PM »
Capitalism at its finest.

Hell, I just invested in a tent making operation.  They start shipping to Pakistan next week.  :aok
Some will fall in love with life and drink it from a fountain that is pouring like an avalanche coming down the mountain