Author Topic: spit cockpit  (Read 1248 times)

Offline Elyeh

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« on: November 12, 2005, 04:27:43 AM »
Please put the ammo counter back up in the top left corner.

(Or get rid of the moving stick) the damn handle is always blocking the cannon/ord counter

And raise up the gas gage. If you fly more up into the cockpit, (as the pilot would in Real world) you cant see the gas gage.

Offline Kurfürst

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« Reply #1 on: November 15, 2005, 08:15:10 AM »
It thought there was no ammo counter in any of Spitfires - and most WW2 planes, for the matter, only the Luftwaffe seem to be keen on the habit to put such counters in for the pilots.
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Offline cav58d

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« Reply #2 on: November 15, 2005, 01:40:58 PM »
How exactly did the Luftwaffe do an ammo counter in their aircraft?  I have heard about Allied Aircraft changing the color of tracer rounds when down to the last 200 or so...But how did the luft have an actualy counter in the plane?
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Offline Pooface

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« Reply #3 on: November 15, 2005, 01:42:36 PM »
i think it was weight calibrated. im probably wrong though:lol

Offline Tails

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« Reply #4 on: November 15, 2005, 01:47:19 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Pooface
i think it was weight calibrated. im probably wrong though:lol


An easier method would be a synchro-type indicator, like cars have for a fuel guage. But, instead of a float, you would have a follower laying ontop of the ammo in the box.
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Offline Karnak

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« Reply #5 on: November 15, 2005, 02:04:23 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Kurfürst
It thought there was no ammo counter in any of Spitfires - and most WW2 planes, for the matter, only the Luftwaffe seem to be keen on the habit to put such counters in for the pilots.

Agreed.  I wish they'd get rid of the ammo counters in all aircraft that didn't have them and put in the proper analog counters for those Luftwaffe aircraft that did have them.
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Offline Debonair

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Re: spit cockpit
« Reply #6 on: November 15, 2005, 03:42:23 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Elyeh
...If you fly more up into the cockpit, (as the pilot would in Real world) you cant see the gas gage.


I've read a lot about/by guys who liked lower in the 'pit for better armour protection while in combat.
Anyone else think a guy sitting up too high should be more likely to be shot than someone hunched down behind his armour?

Offline Krusty

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« Reply #7 on: November 15, 2005, 03:52:16 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Karnak
Agreed.  I wish they'd get rid of the ammo counters in all aircraft that didn't have them and put in the proper analog counters for those Luftwaffe aircraft that did have them.


I disagree wholeheartedly, and I will tell you why.

AH is not a real life mission with real life issues. Those folks were lucky if they saw a target in front of them. They had to fly in wings, with the lead getting the kill most of the time. When they got a target they would saddle up, and fire until their guns went dry or their enemy was dead. THEN they would run for home as fast as possible.

In AH its SO different its not funny. The reason we need ammo counters is because we have infinite targets to attack. We can ourselves be attacked by infinite enemy on our way from point A to B. At any given moment our actions need to be dictated by our knowledge of our plane. If we don't have gas, we run instead of fighting. If we don't have ammo, we do the same. If we're damaged badly we run for home like a bat outta hell.

Well we have a fuel gague. That lets us know the state of our aircraft. With this info we can decide what to do. The ammo counter does the same. The damage screen does the same.

How would you like to go into a fight thinking you're okay, but you fird out when you fire your gun that you only have 1x7mm, all your other guns were damaged but you didn't know because you had no damage screen. Real pilots wouldn't know.

How would you like to go into a fight, saddle up, get that PERFECT shot, then only fire 2 rounds from all your guns before they run dry?

AH is not a combat simulator. It's a flight simulator. Because the gameplay and dynamics are totally and completely different from real WW2 combat, we need ammo counters otherwise the system doesn't work too well.

Offline Karnak

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« Reply #8 on: November 15, 2005, 03:59:51 PM »
Krusty,

In all the off line sims I have played I did not have an ammo counter and yet due to the limitations of AI I was always playing "hero" to complete the mission.  Even in the massive dogfights of EAW I did not have any trouble mentally tracking, roughly, the amount of ammo I had left.  It isn't a hard skill to learn.

But it is a moot point really as HTC is highly unlikely to change this aspect and it is hardly one that my account rides on.
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Offline Krusty

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« Reply #9 on: November 15, 2005, 04:00:59 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Karnak
But it is a moot point really as HTC is highly unlikely to change this aspect and it is hardly one that my account rides on.


ditto

Offline Kweassa

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« Reply #10 on: November 15, 2005, 06:20:30 PM »
Quote
AH is not a real life mission with real life issues. Those folks were lucky if they saw a target in front of them. They had to fly in wings, with the lead getting the kill most of the time. When they got a target they would saddle up, and fire until their guns went dry or their enemy was dead. THEN they would run for home as fast as possible.


 Nope.


Quote
In AH its SO different its not funny. The reason we need ammo counters is because we have infinite targets to attack. We can ourselves be attacked by infinite enemy on our way from point A to B. At any given moment our actions need to be dictated by our knowledge of our plane. If we don't have gas, we run instead of fighting. If we don't have ammo, we do the same. If we're damaged badly we run for home like a bat outta hell.


 Irrelevant.
 
 The amount of enemies met enroute is not a given factor, but a matter of choice. Careless people will find out that he is out of ammo the moment he pulls the trigger, more obsevant people will have plenty of methods to keep general track of his ammo situation.


Quote
Well we have a fuel gague. That lets us know the state of our aircraft. With this info we can decide what to do. The ammo counter does the same. The damage screen does the same.


 Nope.

 Neither the fuel guage nor the damage screen directly dictates the conditions of the fight. Ammo counters do. For onething, its very existence is one of the reasons behind why game gunnery distances is so much longer than it is in real life.


Quote
How would you like to go into a fight thinking you're okay, but you fird out when you fire your gun that you only have 1x7mm, all your other guns were damaged but you didn't know because you had no damage screen. Real pilots wouldn't know.

How would you like to go into a fight, saddle up, get that PERFECT shot, then only fire 2 rounds from all your guns before they run dry?


 Careless flying should come with consequences. If I find out that my perfect opportunity is ruined because I have no ammo, then I deserve such rude surprise - since I'm the one who had been so stupid as to be so ignorant of how many shots I've taken against how many planes for how long.


Quote
AH is not a combat simulator. It's a flight simulator. Because the gameplay and dynamics are totally and completely different from real WW2 combat, we need ammo counters otherwise the system doesn't work too well.


 Nope. Your definition of AH2 is wrong.



Quote
In all the off line sims I have played I did not have an ammo counter and yet due to the limitations of AI I was always playing "hero" to complete the mission. Even in the massive dogfights of EAW I did not have any trouble mentally tracking, roughly, the amount of ammo I had left. It isn't a hard skill to learn.


 Karnak's right. There are games with no ammo counters. People fly (as do I) with no problems at all. The only people who have problems with such crutches, are people who take them for granted.


Quote
But it is a moot point really as HTC is highly unlikely to change this aspect and it is hardly one that my account rides on.


 Things change, Karnak.

 Let's not exactly hold our breaths, but just keep it inside the wishlist. There are lot of changes with AH over the years, and many of them I remember to be "can't be done" or "will not be done".

 The changes with icons, distance counters, historical looking cockpits and distinct guages/features, lowering perk points on some planes, fixing up the long-range gunnery problems, working slats, visual tailhooks... etc etc..  Every single one of these and more, in the old AH1 days as you'd remember, when under suggestion and discussion were always treated as "moot points" and " will never happen"s.

 And yet, here we are - all of it did happen.
« Last Edit: November 15, 2005, 06:28:08 PM by Kweassa »

Offline Elyeh

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« Reply #11 on: November 15, 2005, 07:22:51 PM »
we can argue all day about other sims not having them or real world not having them but the fact is we do have them in AHII

The point is we have the counters so please put them where they can be seen. Plain and simple

So please put it back up in the top left corner where it was.... Please

Offline 1K3

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« Reply #12 on: November 15, 2005, 08:50:43 PM »
no

:)

keeping the ammo counters the way they are right now makes AH plane cockpits semi-realistic

Offline Kweassa

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« Reply #13 on: November 16, 2005, 01:57:50 AM »
Quote
We can argue all day about other sims not having them or real world not having them but the fact is we do have them in AHII


 ...just like how we can argue the ammo counters can be placed here or there, but the fact is they are placed at that spot in AH2?

Offline Elyeh

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« Reply #14 on: November 16, 2005, 07:04:50 AM »
They were in the top left originally