Author Topic: about Lancasters (Read 2878 times)

MiloMorai · « **Reply #30 on:** December 03, 2005, 05:01:53 PM »

What is never mentioned is the area hit by those rounds, gatt.

Hornet33 · « **Reply #31 on:** December 03, 2005, 10:49:52 PM »

Also remember that in the real planes you had such things as oxygen bottles, hydralic lines and many other explosive and flamable items. A couple of hits with a 20mm or 30mm in the body of the real plane could produce some very bad problems for the plane and crew. Not so in AH.

gatt · « **Reply #32 on:** December 04, 2005, 01:57:44 AM »

Back on topic, I've encountered many times Lancs at 28K+ flying and above all maneuvering so well (before dropping bombs on the HQ) that I had problems to chase them with the C.205. It could probably be due to the fact that at normal operational heights the Lancs would be quite easy to shoot down. So the choice of the type with 12,7mm in the tail and the (maybe) softened FM.

Off topic again, I dont know how the buff DM model works. From what I see after many attacks againts buffs, the 20mm and 30mm hits in the fuselage dont seem to produce those (sometimes deadly) damages and fires as in the RL. Would be interesting to know how the whole thing works. We could avoid to waste too much ammo in the fat body .....

Furball · « **Reply #33 on:** December 04, 2005, 05:26:41 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by gatt
the 20mm and 30mm hits in the fuselage dont seem to produce those (sometimes deadly) damages and fires as in the RL. Would be interesting to know how the whole thing works. We could avoid to waste too much ammo in the fat body .....

in RL the 30mm didnt have such a big effect on bomber fuselages. The open space within the fuselage acted to dissapate the explosive force, the 30mm really had a major impact on the wings and other tightly packed areas.

frank3 · « **Reply #34 on:** December 04, 2005, 08:32:03 AM »

I don't know how the shells were triggered though, maybe, when it impacts, the explosive is triggered, or a trigger on top of the shell?

In any case, the shells would come clean trough a lancaster, not inflicting much damage (although all those holes might give the crew a flew!)

HoHun · « **Reply #35 on:** December 04, 2005, 09:29:11 AM »

Hi Frank,

>I don't know how the shells were triggered though, maybe, when it impacts, the explosive is triggered, or a trigger on top of the shell?

The 30 mm mine shells had a chemical fuse that did not need to strike with any defined point. Its sensitivity made duds unlikely except at very shallow striking angles.

The amount of explosive carried by a 30 mm mine shell is about half of that of a hand grenade.

How many hand grenades do you think you can safely detonate inside a Lancaster fuselage? ;-)

Regards,

Henning (HoHun)

gatt · « **Reply #36 on:** December 04, 2005, 09:31:54 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Furball
in RL the 30mm didnt have such a big effect on bomber fuselages. The open space within the fuselage acted to dissapate the explosive force, the 30mm really had a major impact on the wings and other tightly packed areas.

Well, theoretically speaking yes. That rule is good for every kind of explosive, not only for the german 30mm HE shell. I guess that in RL many pilots aimed at the main body as wings are pretty thin to hit, especially from 6 o'clock. And in the body there are oxygen and oil lines, wires, crew-men, many things. Luftwaffe gun cameras are very interesting to look at, as fires spreaded very well from fuselages as well as from engines. Many crew accounts about 20mm and 30mm hits in the fuselages are quite interesting to read as well.

frank3 · « **Reply #37 on:** December 04, 2005, 09:40:15 AM »

Thanks for the information HoHun,

But would the shells even explode at a soft target like aluminium skin of an aircraft?

HoHun · « **Reply #38 on:** December 04, 2005, 09:52:18 AM »

Hi Frank,

>But would the shells even explode at a soft target like aluminium skin of an aircraft?

Yes. That's exactly what they were built for :-)

Regards,

Henning (HoHun)

Furball · « **Reply #39 on:** December 04, 2005, 09:58:30 AM »

sorry... maybe i should have been a little more clear...

Quote

Originally posted by gatt
the 20mm and 30mm hits in the fuselage dont seem to produce those (sometimes deadly) damages and fires as in the RL.

i replied in response: -

Quote

Originally posted by Furball
in RL the 30mm didnt have such a big effect on bomber fuselages.

key word being such. you were asking why they do not have such a big effect, i was saying why!

Quote

Originally posted by HoHun
How many hand grenades do you think you can safely detonate inside a Lancaster fuselage? ;-)

That is not what i was implying at all.

What 30mm does to an enclosed space: -

Angus · « **Reply #40 on:** December 04, 2005, 10:29:27 AM »

My point on the Lancaster is this: If the weight is levelled with a B17 for instance, which one has a higher ceiling, speed and ordnance.
The Lannie sports a merlin which is a good engine at high altitde. Or?

MiloMorai · « **Reply #41 on:** December 04, 2005, 10:44:50 AM »

Angus, the Lanc used 20 series motors which were not that great at altitude while the Wrights of the B-17 were still putting out the ~power they were at SL when over 20kft.

Angus · « **Reply #42 on:** December 04, 2005, 12:40:52 PM »

Oh TY didn't know that.
Anyway if it had been seen as needed the Lancie could have mounted any Merlin right?
BTW, a lightly loaded Lancaster (little fuel and no ordnance) could apparently LOOP. It could also turn very well. And corkscrew...

Furball · « **Reply #43 on:** December 04, 2005, 01:06:40 PM »

Alex Henshaw rolled a Lancaster

Angus · « **Reply #44 on:** December 04, 2005, 01:09:05 PM »

TELL ME MORE!!!!!