Originally posted by ShortyDoowap
Neither say anything substantial. Both say the Fw-190 influenced the Bearcat, but neither say how.
There is not a single aspect of the Bearcat's design that was miraculously revealed to them by an inspection of an Fw-190. The Bearcat, despite superlative performance, was an extraordinarily conventional design.
If you can come up with something meaningful, I'd like to hear it. So far that hasn't happened. The "I've talked to the people at Garber..." isn't sufficient. I could say the same thing. And I have obtained substantial records and documents on the both the F7F and F8F from the GHC and none it supports an Fw-190 relationship.
The burden of proof is on the one that makes the claim. Internet sources and other unsubstantiated claims that perpetuate internet rumor just don't cut it.
So far, the only influence on the design of the Bearcat was need. Rene Francillon sums it up nicely:
If the Fw-190 had been any sort of a major influence, you'd think the likes of Francillon would have mentioned it.
A few points. I disagree with any claim that the XF8F-1 was a copy of the Fw 190A-4, which is what Hall and Gillies flew while at Farnborough. Hall has readily admitted that design decisions were made based upon their testing of the 190. However, that's a long way from copying the 190... Light years away. It is no closer to reality than claiming that the Japanese aviation industry copied the Vought (nee Northrop) V-143. Japanese designers examined the Vought very closely and borrowed ideas and even layouts. But their designs were unique to the needs of Japan in the middle-late 1930s. One Vought engineer who had an opportunity to inspect a captured Zero stated that the entire accessory section and cooler layout was taken directly from the V-143. However, being smart enough to not re-invent the wheel does not constitute copying the design of the aircraft.
This same concept applies to all aircraft designers. These people do not work in a vaccum. Each designer is influenced by the work of those who came before him, and even his contemporaries. Kurt Tank has stated several times that one of the greatest influences for the Fw 190 was the work of American designer Richard Palmer. Palmer's design of Howard Hughes' H-1 racer very much impressed Tank. No one would argue that Tank copied the H-1. He was, however, very much influenced by that highly advanced racer. And why not, it was able to set a world speed record for landplanes in 1935 on just 1,000 horsepower.
As to the XF8F-1. Shortly after deciding to design the new fighter, Roy Grumman took Hall and Gillies and went to Farnborough in September 1943, where they examined and flew a captured Fw 190. In Corky Meyer's words, "all three were enamored with the Focke Wulf 190A-4 after Bud and Bob flew it". Meyer (who was Grumman's first full-time Experimental Test Pilot and worked directly for Hall) states that the Fw 190 was an important catalyst to the design of the Bearcat. Meyer was a close friend of Hall and presumably has considerable insight into the whys and hows of the F8F's design evolution. Meyer has written about this over the past 5 years. See his biography of Hall in the October 2000 edition of Flight Journal.
My opinion is that Grumman borrowed ideas from the Focke Wulf. They took the basic design premise, improved and expanded upon that concept producing what is probably the most extraordinary prop driven fighter ever to see mass production. However, to claim that the Bearcat is a copy of the Fw 190 is going far beyond mere influence and assigns credit where it is not due.
Grumman copied Tank no more than Tank copied Palmer, who borrowed from.... etc...
If it's copies you are looking for, you need look no further than the Bell X-5.
My regards,
Widewing
