Author Topic: Beginers guide to F4U-C VS Spitfires  (Read 1525 times)

Offline Mugzeee

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« Reply #15 on: December 18, 2005, 06:51:01 PM »
Thats right.. Gear=Brakes...Flaps =Turning aid
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Offline Morpheus

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« Reply #16 on: December 18, 2005, 06:55:01 PM »
I never said that. I just made sure I mentioned that the gear doesnt help you to turn because there might be others that dont.

That's all.
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Offline Mugzeee

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« Reply #17 on: December 18, 2005, 07:31:56 PM »
Correct. you didnt say it here. So since this is a seperate thread...Im not the uneducated brick layer here...but i am over there? ;)  
« Last Edit: December 18, 2005, 08:50:05 PM by Mugzeee »

Offline stantond

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« Reply #18 on: December 18, 2005, 08:47:18 PM »
Just to make a comment, all three films with F4u's show the dive brakes dropping at some time (except mine of course).  Batfink's, Yucca's, and Bluekitty's planes all drop dive brakes, if only momentarily to control speed.  Batfink was (in my understanding) describing and demonstrating the use of speed and how controlling your energy can create a negative energy advantage guns solution.  The ability to lose energy (in a controlled manner) is sometimes more important than having excess.   Being able to judge energy states is a valuable skill in AH.



Regards,

Malta

Offline mechanic

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« Reply #19 on: December 18, 2005, 08:57:51 PM »
excelent post stantond. you know i always considered the lowest flap setting to be just that. is it intended as a dive brake?


thanks also mugz, some good films and some good follow up info morph.
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Offline stantond

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« Reply #20 on: December 18, 2005, 10:45:02 PM »
Whoops my bad,

I reviewed your film and noticed the dive brakes (i.e. landing gear) were not extended during the fights.  But yes, to answer your question, dropping flaps will slow the aircraft much like dropping gear but dropping gear works up to 400 ias speeds.  I noticed Yucca and BlueKitty both extended gear (although Yucca only briefly) and I though you did also based on Morpheus's comment.

I am even more impressed with the speed control without using dive brakes!  That's a good film.


Regards,

Malta

Offline TequilaChaser

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« Reply #21 on: December 18, 2005, 11:59:07 PM »
Malta1, reviewed your film, that was a quickie, had to slow it down 3 times :)

call it luck of the draw on that one.......


Mugz,  not withstanding you was flying against BluKitty, you was neck n neck with him , he ( or are u sure it isn't she?) was just better controlling the slow fight....this just takes practice, then the rest is pilot ability......

Your 2nd posted film, if you have read/memorized what planes accelerate fast verses the plane you are in, will tell you when and when not to scrub off speed. all be it with flaps or gear. In this Too Much-film you are in a C-Hog and flying against two very fast accelerating planes the Tiffy and the Spit16. Both initially out accelerate the F4U, so you need no more than a few notches of flaps and some rudder, as your gear is out you see the Tiffy accelerating away from you, if worse case chop or work throttle to remain behind the 3/9 line.......

as for you saying you don't know when and when not to do this, it all depends on what your flying verses your opponents plane's strengths/weaknesses

The hog is a HOG and if it isn't dipping its nose or diving it is slow as hell to accelerate/gain speed.....

there is a good amount of others who drop that gear, as we see here, SirLoin is another that comes to mind, I myself save it for landing most times, all them notches of flaps, even the last notch are plenty enough to scrub of speed when needed..............

very good thread, everyone  ~S~
« Last Edit: December 19, 2005, 12:02:26 AM by TequilaChaser »
"When one considers just what they should say to a new pilot who is logging in Aces High, the mind becomes confused in the complex maze of info it is necessary for the new player to know. All of it is important; most of it vital; and all of it just too much for one brain to absorb in 1-2 lessons" TC

Offline mechanic

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« Reply #22 on: December 18, 2005, 11:59:22 PM »
ah thats more clear stantond, but you had me confused, and thanks :)


I try to preapre for the move in advance with some slid-slip and power decrease, i find dropping the gear can get you in trouble as the enemy notices what you're doing. with out gear, and slightly more preparation, you have more chance of fooling your opponent at a time when spit seconds count for your life.

im not sure if the manifold gauge records correctly but if it does it could be usefull to notice when and where throttle is being cut, if anyone still finds the practical sides of the negative energy fighting tough to grasp.

both yucca and jish would beat me 5 out of 5 times even if they had their gear out the whole time and only used their .45 pistol though, so 'm not damning the idea of gear brakes, i just try not to give my game away untill its inevitable that im going to win, as a preference. much like the argument of not using tracers to allow you to miss without warning the enemy. I do use tracers though, strangely.
And I don't know much, but I do know this. With a golden heart comes a rebel fist.

Offline mechanic

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« Reply #23 on: December 19, 2005, 12:18:16 AM »
I just found a little video i made a few months back.


only 60 seconds long but well worth a look. Its two kills joined into one .ahf clip.


The first shows perfectly how losing all your speed instead of trying to conserve it will make you surprise and outturn a light more nimble aircraft.



The second 30 seconds shows another clip from the recent malta scenario.

It is a text book example of this move --->>>>>





FILM LInk ->>>>> http://www.freeroleentertainment.com/2_good_moves.ahf





hopes this is helpfull, it should download in seconds.
And I don't know much, but I do know this. With a golden heart comes a rebel fist.

Offline mechanic

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« Reply #24 on: December 19, 2005, 06:06:21 AM »
bump, and i'd also like to take this chance to mention that all the credit for my knoledge of this BnZ defence goes to fighting wildthng and watching dead man flying's films. I wish i could say its all my ideas, but clearly it not.

this theory of negative energy come mainly for observasion of other better than me and dying, alot.
And I don't know much, but I do know this. With a golden heart comes a rebel fist.

Offline YUCCA

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« Reply #25 on: December 19, 2005, 03:22:50 PM »
I'm a movie starr.  Shortly my dream of starring in a porno with paris hilton will be fully realized... MUAHAHAHA

Offline mechanic

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« Reply #26 on: December 19, 2005, 04:37:23 PM »
there goes any interest i might have had in paris hilton vids, thanks yucsta! :(
And I don't know much, but I do know this. With a golden heart comes a rebel fist.

Offline Morpheus

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« Reply #27 on: December 19, 2005, 04:49:20 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Mugzeee
Correct. you didnt say it here. So since this is a seperate thread...Im not the uneducated brick layer here...but i am over there? ;)  


i didnt say that either.
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Offline Pooface

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« Reply #28 on: December 19, 2005, 05:04:50 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by mechanic
I just found a little video i made a few months back.


only 60 seconds long but well worth a look. Its two kills joined into one .ahf clip.


The first shows perfectly how losing all your speed instead of trying to conserve it will make you surprise and outturn a light more nimble aircraft.



The second 30 seconds shows another clip from the recent malta scenario.

It is a text book example of this move --->>>>>





FILM LInk ->>>>> http://www.freeroleentertainment.com/2_good_moves.ahf





hopes this is helpfull, it should download in seconds.


lol @ me in the background. 'damn, that was a nice one!' rofl.

you should have put a few more secs of the lead-in with that clip tho bat, because its hard to see how you set the shot up. still got the original .ahf??

that was the Bn'Z reversal right? was very nice i gotta say, looked really sweet from my cockpit:aok

Offline Mugzeee

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« Reply #29 on: December 19, 2005, 05:09:29 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by TequilaChaser


Mugz,  not withstanding you was flying against BluKitty, you was neck n neck with him , he ( or are u sure it isn't she?) was just better controlling the slow fight....this just takes practice, then the rest is pilot ability......

Typically...would the Ponys nose fall below the horizon due to stall at a higher speed than the HOG? Yes i do realize that BluKty simply is better than i am.
Quote
Originally posted by TequilaChaser

Your 2nd posted film, if you have read/memorized what planes accelerate fast verses the plane you are in, will tell you when and when not to scrub off speed. all be it with flaps or gear. In this Too Much-film you are in a C-Hog and flying against two very fast accelerating planes the Tiffy and the Spit16. Both initially out accelerate the F4U, so you need no more than a few notches of flaps and some rudder, as your gear is out you see the Tiffy accelerating away from you, if worse case chop or work throttle to remain behind the 3/9 line.......
 

Thanks for the input TC. It is much appreciated.
As far as letting the Tiffy slip away? I was pretty sure this was going to happen. My poor gunnery doesnt make it any easier for me either :rofl I have an old AH1 film of me causing HISPD to overshoot the same way as Batfink was doing. I let him slip away as well. This was some time ago now. But the acceleration of the Typhoon was as clear then as it was in this film. But i have grown fond of giving up a kill as apposed to overshooting and giving one away while learning a new plane or maneuver. This does happen to me from time to time it that situation, but i have learned to live with it. I don’t fly the Hog much at all, but i will get better with it in time. That is if I don’t get tired of it first. LOL
This second film was posted to demonstrate what happens if you scrub too much speed with excessive flap and air braking. Good demo eh? :D
Thanks again for your help/