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Author Topic: The new generation of fighters  (Read 1238 times)

Offline Toad

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The new generation of fighters
« Reply #15 on: March 02, 2006, 03:58:35 PM »
I wouldn't assume that they are publishing it's true capabilities with regards to range, speed, etc. just yet either.
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Offline gnubee

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The new generation of fighters
« Reply #16 on: March 02, 2006, 03:58:36 PM »
The F-15 and F-14 already pwn everything in existance... I'll grant that Europe, China, and Russia are putting out amazing aircraft, but they still don't match the Eagle or Tomcat yet...so if you ask me the F-22 is a waste.

The Raptor began it's development when the Soviet Union was a threat... and with the USSR out of the picture, I really don't see why the Raptor needs to exist...  

If you ask me, continued development of the Eagle and Tomcat would have had us covered for the next 20 to 30 years (at least)... but that's just my opinion.

The Super-Cruise of the Raptor is pretty sweet though.

:aok
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Offline Nilsen

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The new generation of fighters
« Reply #17 on: March 02, 2006, 04:03:23 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by LePaul
You never know.  Could be China, could be North Korea...Kosovo had some pretty extension radar/SAM systems that took down an F-16 way back when


China? never.. Not even if they go for Taiwan.
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Offline StarOfAfrica2

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The new generation of fighters
« Reply #18 on: March 02, 2006, 04:11:19 PM »
Dont get me wrong, I'm happy to see the new birds coming.  I mean, 18 F-22's is like, 10% of their operational birds I think.  Plus we just got the C-17's last month, so thats alot of big money rolling into the bases here.  Add to that another sub in our pens, and promises of a new carrier strike force sometime in the next decade, thats making alot of people here happy.  There's alot of details to work out before that last one can happen, but the rest is already here or on its way.  Financially I'm glad to see it.  And I'm not above being jazzed at seeing one fly overhead and thinking about all the cool gadgets and gizmos in one of those things.  I'm gonna miss seeing those F-15's flying over though.  I still think one of my favorite memories is standing in Lambert Airport in St Louis back in the late 70's or early 80's and watching an F-15 roll out of the McDonnell Douglas facility and take off straight up from the runway standing on its tail like a rocket launching.  

Its a good point though, just because I'm reading published data on the F-22, who's to say its right?  These guys just publish what the military issues them.

I am curious though, what the maintenance costs would be of a brand new F-15 or F-14 vs a F-22?
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Offline Nilsen

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The new generation of fighters
« Reply #19 on: March 02, 2006, 04:25:14 PM »
I belive the maintenance cost of the F22 and the F35 are alot lower than those of the previous generation. Cant quote anyone on it but i recall it beeing said on Discovery something (not that those programs are accurate) and various other places
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Offline Gunslinger

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The new generation of fighters
« Reply #20 on: March 02, 2006, 04:28:32 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by StarOfAfrica2


I am curious though, what the maintenance costs would be of a brand new F-15 or F-14 vs a F-22?


ALOT less.  Even more so the older the 14 or 15 is.  The more hours you put on an Air Frame, especially out at sea, the more inspections are required, the more fatigue you get.  

The Raptor has a bunch of interesting mait. features that I don't want to get into but with that said I know the F15 is a pretty mait. friendly bird as well.  The more you fly them though the more you have to fix them.  

Then you also have availablity of parts.  There were only so many parts made for the air frame and eventually you are going to have shortages.

That's just my take anyways.  I stand by my conviction that the F22 and F25 are going to be the last "manned" combat fighter aircraft procured in my lifetime.
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Offline Toad

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The new generation of fighters
« Reply #21 on: March 02, 2006, 05:07:26 PM »
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Originally posted by gnubee
The F-15 and F-14 already pwn everything in existance...

...The Raptor began it's development when the Soviet Union was a threat... and with the USSR out of the picture, I really don't see why the Raptor needs to exist...  


Ya know, there were folks that said pretty much that same thing when we were developing the F-14 and F-15.

Sometimes it's nice to have an airplane already flying that can meet any anticipated adversary BEFORE that adversary makes its first takeoff.

In short, when the competition has caught up, it's time to deploy something new.

I submit to you that the competition has essentially "caught up" to the F-14 and F-15.
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Offline FUNKED1

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Re: The new generation of fighters
« Reply #22 on: March 02, 2006, 05:25:30 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by StarOfAfrica2
What am I missing?


F-22 has way better maneuvarability than F-15 or F-16.
Way better accleration and climb.
Way better endurance in supersonic flight.
Way better radar, fire control, avionics.
And oh yeah, it's basically invisible to radar.
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Offline ClevMan

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The new generation of fighters
« Reply #23 on: March 02, 2006, 06:12:30 PM »
<------  Big Tomcat fan here...  I was reading a couple of threads down about the trap of the last Tomcat in a combat mission...  Someone said that the maintenence time for a Tomcat is like 8 times longer than for the Super Hornet.

I still think that a kickin fighter like the T-cat is worth the maintenence time, but in a world that is so hell-bent on preserving the almighty dollar, the only logical thing would be to make the Tomcat everybody's favorite static display...  Sad times...
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Offline ChickenHawk

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The new generation of fighters
« Reply #24 on: March 02, 2006, 06:29:42 PM »
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Originally posted by Gunslinger

That's just my take anyways.  I stand by my conviction that the F22 and F25 are going to be the last "manned" combat fighter aircraft procured in my lifetime.


I agree.  UAV's are the future and I think the next fighter will be unmanned.
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Offline LePaul

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The new generation of fighters
« Reply #25 on: March 02, 2006, 08:09:51 PM »
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Originally posted by Toad
Ya know, there were folks that said pretty much that same thing when we were developing the F-14 and F-15.

Sometimes it's nice to have an airplane already flying that can meet any anticipated adversary BEFORE that adversary makes its first takeoff.

 


What he said.

Considering how long it takes to develop a new aircraft, I'd rather be ahead of the game than playing catch up.  We sure didnt foresee needing all the high tech planes and smart bombs after Russia crumbled.  But they sure made fast work of Saddam in the Gulf War in 90-91, 15 years ago
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Offline Hoarach

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The new generation of fighters
« Reply #26 on: March 02, 2006, 08:18:40 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by StarOfAfrica2
Add to that another sub in our pens


Only thing we have in CT is the Groton sub base and E-Boat which has been threatened several times to being closed.  Least we have the 1st nuclear sub located here.
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Offline Pongo

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The new generation of fighters
« Reply #27 on: March 02, 2006, 08:53:23 PM »
You go to war with what you have.
The US isnt interested in tech parity with other world powers so they have invested in a fighter that is signifigantly better then the Eagle or any SU27 variant in the air to air role.
Its radar is far more agile, its tactical speed is far greater, its radar cross section is far lower. You wouldnt want to get into dog fights with it but it is better at that too.
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Offline Morpheus

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The new generation of fighters
« Reply #28 on: March 02, 2006, 11:23:27 PM »
The F-14B is the ****ing ****. The eagle is the ****ing ****. One is gone. When both die, so does fighter spirit.
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Offline Hangtime

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Re: Re: The new generation of fighters
« Reply #29 on: March 03, 2006, 12:25:20 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Sandman
Pork.


republicracts can't tell it's not bacon.

the airframe jigs, the wing box fixtures, the 20 million dollar milling machine that cut the titanium for the TomCat...

destroyed.

The amazing company that built it..

devoured.

*sigh*

no way than can build a TomCat again. the men that designed it and the machines that made it... history.

Same for the Eagle.

*sigh*
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