Author Topic: Coulter Oscar predictions  (Read 5021 times)

Offline lazs2

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« Reply #180 on: March 13, 2006, 02:28:32 PM »
momus... no... I did not say 56,000 hits for "hollywood left"

I said 56 MILLION hits.   I just took a few off the first page.   Every one of em calims that hollywood is a leftist institution.   No one but you seems to deny it.

I am simply saying that if they hold that leftist view of life then it is quite logical to assume that it will permeate their work... espcially if they consider their work "art"  as hollywood does.  

most of us can simply observe the leftist leaning in all the hollywood works.  It seems extremely strange that you won't admit that there is at least a leaning towards it.... especially in tv and..

so far as the original thread.... brokebutt mountain is embarrassing in the amount of mindless agendized promotion it recieved.

Anyhow.... their are now 67,000,000 (million )hits for "hollywood left"  do your own research or... find anyhting in the 3  million hits for "hollywood conservative" that doesn't just say the same thing (that there are very few who aren't lefties)

Now... I have never seen a lefty who didn't let his agenda get in the way of doing anything and never seen one who felt the truth was as important as his agenda.... nothing I have seen hollywood lefties produce has changed my mind about that.... it permeates their films.

lazs

Offline Skuzzy

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« Reply #181 on: March 13, 2006, 03:06:49 PM »
This thread has reached the status of 'Midnght Plowboy'.  Completely berift of any entertainment value.
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Offline Shuckins

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« Reply #182 on: March 13, 2006, 04:25:18 PM »
Awww Skuzzy!   That HURTS! :)

MT, if you read it that's something at least.  I left that tidbit in there just for you.

I'm not against the principles of the First Amendment...I'm against hypocrites like some of the Ten who attempted to hide behind the protections inherent in those principles.  Several members of the Hollywood Ten denied those principles to their colleagues who fell out of favor with the Party and yet cried "rape" when having to testify before Congress.

One last blurb:
_____________________________ _______________

In 1945...Edward Dmytryk and Adrian Scott were expelled from the Party for refusing to accept the crude propaganda of lawson's hand-picked screenwriter, John Wexley, for their film "Cornered."  Robert Rossen faced a similar inquisition over "All the Kings' Men" in 1949.  The Hollywood Party objected to this classic film's them of "power corrupts" (too close to Stalin, apparently), and forced Rossen into an excruciating "criticism" session.  Rather than submit and recant his work, Rossen agrily resigned from the Party.  What is stunning is that the savage "jurors" in the Rossen inquisition were the Ten themselves.

Abraham Polonsky summed up the grim situation in a 1997interview:  "The Party style of Marxism didn't have a chance here {in Hollywood}, or in New York either, among intellectuals.  The leadership's behavior violated the whole intellectual life of Marxism."

Despite this fine statement on behalf of intellectual freedom, throughout the 1930s, 1940s, and 1950s, Polonsky went along faithfully with whatever the prevailing Party line happened to be, including the condemnation of Maltz.  Polonsky's personal predilections toward "liberalism" were suppressed in the Maltz case in the name of the Party.

Their studied stance of "martyrs" contrasts starkly with one of their lesser known traits...that of "stool pigeons."  When the political occasion demanded, these men were perfectly prepared to be "stool pigeons" themselves.  The most notorious case is that of Dalton Trumbo.  The Ten have derided those people who appeared before HUAC and "named names."  But in 1944, Trumbo personally invited the FBI to his house to turn over the names of people who had asked him for copies of his anti-war novel "Johnny Got His Gun."

This fiercly anti-war novel, published in 1939, had been a big hit with Communists during the period of the Hitler-Stalin Pact, but after June 22, 1941, it became a political embarrassment, and Pearl Harbor only added to the problem.  The novel dropped out of circulation, so people who opposed WWII despite Pearl Harbor wrote to Trumbo to find out where they could get copies.  Trumbo voluntarily denounced these people to the FBI as "defeatists, pacifists [!], and anti-Semites," and turned over names and correspondence.  Needless to say, he did not notify the people whose names he had named of what he had done.

Years later, when the Communists were under pressure, historian Arthur Schlesinger suggested in print that people such as Trumbo were so ruthless politically that they would never uphold the civil rights of those with whose politics they disagreed, such as Trotskyists on the left and Ku Klux Klansmen on the right.  Trumbo responded with a haughty public denial (filled with sneers at Schlesinger) that he would ever allow the government the right to investigate a person's political beliefs.  But of course we now know this printed rebuttal of Schlesinger was a lie.  Trumbo had already helped the FBI to do so, and at his own initiative.  

Is such a man to be viewed as a hero of freedom of speech?

Regards, Shuckins

Offline midnight Target

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« Reply #183 on: March 13, 2006, 05:36:53 PM »
I knew about Trumbo and "Johnny Got His Gun". Dalton was a punk.

(BTW, if you've ever seen the movie you won't forget it. Very emotional, and scary.)

Condemning HUAC is not the same as holding the 10 up as heros of the 1st Amendment. Many of them were jerks and worse. But they deserved the same right to be a jerk as any other American.

Offline Thrawn

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« Reply #184 on: March 13, 2006, 06:09:41 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by lazs2
momus... no... I did not say 56,000 hits for "hollywood left"

I said 56 MILLION hits.   I just took a few off the first page.   Every one of em calims that hollywood is a leftist institution.   No one but you seems to deny it.



So.  What do you think that proves?


Noticed you searched "hollywood" "conservative", instead of "hollywood" "right".

I went ahead and did my own meaningless search on the latter and got...40,200,000 hits.  :eek:

Offline Holden McGroin

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« Reply #185 on: March 13, 2006, 06:29:33 PM »
56 to 40 hollywood left wins.
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Offline midnight Target

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« Reply #186 on: March 13, 2006, 09:36:27 PM »
Wait a minute.....

Hollywood leftist pinko commie bastards - 9,960!
Hollywood right wing conservative reactionary jerks - 68,200 woohoo!

I win the intardnet!!!

Offline Shuckins

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« Reply #187 on: March 13, 2006, 10:25:31 PM »
You only won because it was raining and the refs were blind!

Offline Holden McGroin

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« Reply #188 on: March 13, 2006, 11:59:11 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by midnight Target
Wait a minute.....

Hollywood leftist pinko commie bastards - 9,960!
Hollywood right wing conservative reactionary jerks - 68,200 woohoo!

I win the intardnet!!!


I get 64,600....  typical of you left wing commie bastards to try to inflate the votes.
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Offline Momus--

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« Reply #189 on: March 14, 2006, 04:15:33 AM »
Lazs, your problem is as follows:

You see a number of high profile "liberals" in Hollywood as representative of the entire industry, of all the investors, commissioning editors, scriptwriters, studio heads, producers, directors etc etc. This is a leap of faith in itself because other than a series of partisan Op-ed pieces coupled with what you "feel" is the truth, you have no data to back this argument up. You just assume that the characters to which you refer are representative of the majority, and more importantly, are the only ones that wield any real influence.

You then compound this initial error by assuming that, since you think that the industry as a whole leans to the left, that this leaning is inevitably translated into bias within the actual material produced. You again have no data to back this up other than a feeling that it just "must" be true.

Arguing on the basis of your intuition rather than on the basis of evidence is a very feminine trait; are you sure there's nothing else you'd like to share with us?

So there we have it; you're basing one faulty assumption on another.

The truth of the matter is that as in any industry, most influence resides with the money men who stand in the background, and ultimately these money men all represent the large media-owning conglomerates. When you accuse the industry of having a socialist agenda to promote, you are levelling this accusation at large capitalist organizations such as Viacom, News Corporation, General electric, Sony and Time Warner. That's how ridiculous the charge really is.

Offline lazs2

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« Reply #190 on: March 14, 2006, 08:31:36 AM »
momus... just for your own self... be honest... do the search for "hollywood left" and check the content at random... you will see that it is about left wing hollywood politics..

Do a search for "Hollywood right" and you will have to admit that it is mostly things like "Hollywood is right about blah blah blah" or "hollywood picks the right blah blah blah"

The few that use "right" politicaly seem to use it to deride the few hoolywood right wingers...  

I am asking you to look at the info honestly is all.

Look at all the books written about hollywood lefties... their is not one book that I could find that even comes close to saying that hollywood is run by the right or, even that it is not run by the left.

If you don't see left leaning in media, tv, movies and actors and comedians then you are dishones or blind...  watch TV...

High profile actors and hollywood typoes?   I offered to name 5 lefties for every right wing guy you could name.   Right wing actors and producers talk of being shunned in hollywood... ever hear a lefty complain that his politics hurt him with his peers?   maybe the public but not at hollywood.

Who does hollywood raise money for?  last election I believe it was 10 to one for kerry as oppossed to Bush?   is that just "high profile"  does that not indicate a political preference?

How can you say that holding leftist views does not influence their work?  Are you saying that the despicable commies in the fifties did not taint their work with the commie infection?

lazs

Offline Momus--

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« Reply #191 on: March 14, 2006, 10:09:08 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by lazs2
momus... just for your own self... be honest... do the search for "hollywood left" and check the content at random... you will see that it is about left wing hollywood politics..

Do a search for "Hollywood right" and you will have to admit that it is mostly things like "Hollywood is right about blah blah blah" or "hollywood picks the right blah blah blah"

The few that use "right" politicaly seem to use it to deride the few hoolywood right wingers...  


I think you are being deliberately obtuse now. The onus is still on you to demonsrate how these biases described by you and the pundits to which you refer are being translated into actual movie output. You've been asked to do this time and time again; the articles you quote can't do it and you can't do it.

Quote
I am asking you to look at the info honestly is all.


The problem for you is that I have looked at it and none of it proves what you want it to prove. Some of it even contradicts your argument, for example one of the links you provided was an anonymous source bemoaning the supposed treatment of Bruce Willis by the so-called Hollywood liberal elite. Funnily enough, one of the films that is supposed to show liberal bias listed by Mighty1 (for which you thanked him at the time) is 16 Blocks, which stars......yes....Bruce Willis. So according to your case, Bruce Willis is both a victim of the liberal conspiracy and a participant in the same? This just about sums your ridiculous argument up.

Quote
Look at all the books written about hollywood lefties... their is not one book that I could find that even comes close to saying that hollywood is run by the right or, even that it is not run by the left.


Great, why don't you give us some quotes that support your argument from said books that we can discuss? Or is it just appeal to belief/argumentum ad populum again?

Quote
If you don't see left leaning in media, tv, movies and actors and comedians then you are dishones or blind...  watch TV...


Such as?

Quote
High profile actors and hollywood typoes?   I offered to name 5 lefties for every right wing guy you could name.   Right wing actors and producers talk of being shunned in hollywood... ever hear a lefty complain that his politics hurt him with his peers?   maybe the public but not at hollywood.


Marvellous. Even assuming what you say is perhaps partially true, you still haven't shown how it translates into bias within the movies made, which was your original assertion that you haven't managed to defend even once as yet over several pages of this thread. Do I need to remind you of your original and still unsubstantiated statements again?

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there is a huge gay and liberal population in the movie industry and, like anyone... they make what they like even if catering to the public would serve them better... they simply work a lot harder to get these gay projects out and to make them the best that they can and to promote them...to say that hollywood does not have a lot of liberal gay actors, producers and directors and writers... is pretty darn silly... to say that they don't have an agenda is going against the evidence.


Back to your last post anyway:

Quote
Who does hollywood raise money for?  last election I believe it was 10 to one for kerry as oppossed to Bush?   is that just "high profile"  does that not indicate a political preference?


As I said earlier, until you can demonstrate how this preference is being expressed in terms of any significant level of actual output then you are still no further on.

Quote
How can you say that holding leftist views does not influence their work?  Are you saying that the despicable commies in the fifties did not taint their work with the commie infection?


It is you making a case that this influence on their work exists; it is for you to prove it. It is really that simple. According to one of your previous posts, you've seen "thousands of movies". If this is true, and if your argument that liberal bias is so widespread within Hollywood's output is correct, you should have no trouble listing sufficient examples to demonstrate the amount of bias that you claim exists.

That is all you have to do.

Offline Mighty1

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« Reply #192 on: March 14, 2006, 10:19:35 AM »
See Rule #4
« Last Edit: March 14, 2006, 03:03:10 PM by Skuzzy »
I have been reborn a new man!

Notice I never said a better man.

Offline Urchin

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« Reply #193 on: March 14, 2006, 10:21:10 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Mighty1
Give up arguing with lazs2 he is either yanking your chain or a total nutjob. Either way there is no point throwing facts at him because he either choses to ignore them or his little mind is to delusional to see them.


fixed it for you.

Offline lazs2

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« Reply #194 on: March 14, 2006, 02:24:43 PM »
hmm... so you guys believe that the bias of the artist does not extend to his works?   Really?  I gave a link to top ten books on the hollywood left and they all seem to say differently.

I don't think that anyone here would say that lefty politics do not show themselves in the movies and TV..

lazs