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Author Topic: On the F-22  (Read 1048 times)

Offline Choocha

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On the F-22
« on: March 14, 2006, 08:10:29 AM »
Hello community of friends and foes,


I work in a office that sits on final approach to Tyndal, Afb here in sunny Florida.  Being in such a location I can look up and see all kinds of aircraft landing there.  I've seen B-1's, F-15's, F-16's, even Mig-29's and an occasional Osprey zipping around.

Tyndal is home to the first operational sqaud. of F-22's.  Now I see F-22's queuing up to land all of the time.  A funny thing about them, they sound different than any other airplane I've ever heard.  They making a very, very loud and strange howling noise that is very distinct.


I've read from declassified journals that the engine is one of the great leaps foward in technology.  I've also read that the thrust vectoring is not for dogfighting but for operating at very, very high altitudes.  I also read (I can site the journal if anybody wants) the following:

SUPER CRUISE NON-AFTER BURNER

60,000 ft - Mach 2
80,000 ft - Mach 1.5

That would give it a ceiling of 100,000 ft and probably a Mach 3 capability.  Wow, anybody know whats in that engine?  Is a hybrid ram jet type of engine like that of the SR-71?
« Last Edit: March 14, 2006, 08:25:01 AM by Choocha »
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Offline Nilsen

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On the F-22
« Reply #1 on: March 14, 2006, 08:20:14 AM »
I kida doubt that mach 3 is possible with it but who knows
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Offline Choocha

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On the F-22
« Reply #2 on: March 14, 2006, 08:25:51 AM »
If it can cruise at Mach 2.0, then a sprint to Mach 3 and beyond is easly within reach.
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Offline Nilsen

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On the F-22
« Reply #3 on: March 14, 2006, 08:26:54 AM »
well then .. since you know :)
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Offline z0rch

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On the F-22
« Reply #4 on: March 14, 2006, 08:37:32 AM »
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Offline RTR

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On the F-22
« Reply #5 on: March 14, 2006, 08:49:44 AM »
The speed of sound at sea level (a standard day, sea level and 15 degrees celsius and 29.92" Hg) is about 740mph.

As you gain altitude and the air gets thinner this number drops. Also what drops is the engines ability to create thrust, because of the lower density of the air.

So, all things being considered, even with the ability to "super cruise" I don't think you are going to see mach 3 out of this aircraft at any altitude.

I'm not sure how you determined from 80,000ft and supercruising at mach 1.5 gives a ceiling of 100K and mach 3 using afterburner.

I think you may not understand what afterburning is, and what you get out of it vs what its limits are. It uses alot of oxygen  (air) which is a pretty rare commodity at 100,000 ft.  So unless you have some way of carrying the extra O2 to burn at that altitude (rocket type engines for example) you are going to be pretty limited in afterburning, if you could utilize it at all.

I will say that the F-22 is a pretty cool aircraft though.:)

cheers,
RTR
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Offline john9001

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On the F-22
« Reply #6 on: March 14, 2006, 09:33:53 AM »
i thought the F22 did not have afterburn, thats what super cruse was for.
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Offline RAIDER14

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On the F-22
« Reply #7 on: March 14, 2006, 09:36:21 AM »
In a dive from 80,000ft. it could probaly reach mach 3 , I wonder what the world looks like at mach 3:confused:
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Offline RTR

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On the F-22
« Reply #8 on: March 14, 2006, 09:47:42 AM »
LOL

Okay, I give up.

If we keep hammering on it, eventually we'll get the round peg to fit into the square hole.

RTR
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Offline Choocha

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On the F-22
« Reply #9 on: March 14, 2006, 10:20:41 AM »
RTR,

Your from Canada so I'm waiting for the F-22 still can't touch the Avero Arrow.  That's why the CIA, FBI, ATF, INS, Border Patrol, and New Jersey State police conspired to kill the program and keep Canada down.
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Offline Dinger

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On the F-22
« Reply #10 on: March 14, 2006, 10:21:13 AM »
Nah, supercruise is for being very fast. Afterburner is for going very very fast. Being able to achieve and maintain supersonic flight without A/B will allow it to go very fast without the inherent range penalties you get from highly inefficient A/Bs.

Oh yeah, another thing, where you're shooting across the deck faster than the speed of sound, the bad guys don't see you until you crack over them. And then, if they happen to have something heat-seeking pointing about, your signature will be much less without A/Bs. And at night, you won't be quite as visible.
All kinds of uses for supercruise that don't preclude attaching A/Bs (though I don't know if they have it).

Oh yeah, and these speeds are level flight speeds. In a dive at Mach 3, the world probably looks very small. Then very big. Then very dark.
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Offline RTR

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On the F-22
« Reply #11 on: March 14, 2006, 10:41:21 AM »
LOL Choocha.

I never said anything negative about the Raptor. (although I am sure there are points there).

Just kinda suspect that a little research into a subject you are obviously interested in bears a look.

As for the Arrow, it's been discussed ad-nauseum on the boards here. Not worth revisiting, and not relevant here.

btw, you are probably right about the New Jersey State Police!;)

cheers,
RTR
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Offline Chairboy

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On the F-22
« Reply #12 on: March 14, 2006, 10:46:51 AM »
Oblig: "You've never been lost until you've been lost at Mach 3."  - Paul F. Crickmore, test pilot.
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Offline kevykev56

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On the F-22
« Reply #13 on: March 14, 2006, 11:24:04 AM »
The Raptor even in a dive at Mach 3...wow I wonder what the heat buildup on the wings would be. The SR-71 would heat up to over 900deg F and made from titanium.

I wonder how the composite wings would hold up on the F-22? Since your diving you will be at a lower alt than the 100k the SR-71 flew at meaning more air density and more heat.

If the F-22 is Mach 3 capable at any altitude it is a huge feat of engineering. Its already the greatest plane flying today, and im sure will be long into the future as well.



Coocha,

The Tyndall Raptors have done approaches outside my office here on Eglin AFB. You are correct sir, very distinct sound and very graceful flying aircraft.

I was lucky enough to see one flying above Mach 1 during a test on one of the ranges a few years back. A very fun experience.
« Last Edit: March 14, 2006, 01:18:34 PM by kevykev56 »
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Offline Choocha

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On the F-22
« Reply #14 on: March 14, 2006, 12:05:35 PM »
Hey,

Your down the street from me.  Yes, then you have heard that sound.  Everybody in my office as picked up on it.  It is very distinctive.
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