Please Un-neuter the 109 F

[Seagoon]

Just realized I probably originally posted this is in the wrong area...

Hi Guys,

I used to fly the 109F and G6 quite a bit, but with the removal of the gondolas from the F and the 30mm from the G6, I don't anymore. I'm not going to argue the G6/U4 point, but what has happened to the F is in my mind a shame that needs to be addressed.

I've noticed that I seldom if ever see F's in the MA, which isn't surprising given the enormous difficulty of shooting down planes with only 1x20mm and 2x7.9s. Even Adolf Galland and other German Aces accepted that this armament was wholely inadequate, especially for bomber intercepts.

The fact is that the 109F-4/R6 did have underwing gondolas and that this variant was produced in numbers, adding it back would also bring the F variant back to the MA.

Either do that or please reduce the ENY on the F to about 50 to reflect its toothlessness.

- SEAGOON

[Gr3y]

I completely agree with you seagoon... i used to love the 109-f4 until the gondolas went bye bye....




PLEASE PUT THEM BACK!!!!

[Krusty]

Bah. You want the F4 with gondolas? Fly the G-2. F-4 sucked horribly with gondies. They severely hindered its performance, in every way. As long as you get 200 rounds in the hub gun you're good for at least 4-5 kills, the problem is surviving long enough to get them.

[Ack-Ack]

Originally posted by Seagoon


The fact is that the 109F-4/R6 did have underwing gondolas and that this variant was produced in numbers, adding it back would also bring the F variant back to the MA.



- SEAGOON

I think it was pointed out to you when you posted this thread originally that only 240 Fritz with the capability to carry gondolas were made because they required a new wing to support the extra weight.  And out of the 240, the majority didn't even carry gondolas.  So removing them as an option in the game is a reasonable one.  


ack-ack

[zorstorer]

Fuel on the fire

What about the numbers of 3 gun La7's?  Those were pretty low eh?

[Krusty]

I feel the 3-gun LA7 should be removed. Not because there's 3, but because each 1 of those is equal to 2-3 of the earlier guns. It's like going from 2 MG/FF to 3 Hispanos.

If they just added a third gun it would be fine, but it was a rare gun that didn't show up in large numbers and seriously gives the LA7 a punch it shouldn't have.

[Karnak]

Erm, looking at the muzzle velocities and tests in AH, they are essentially the same gun Krusty.  I certainly never noticed any practical difference between them.  Certainly nothing like going from MG/FFs to Hispanos.  Maybe, maybe like going from Ho-5s to MG151/20s.

[Krusty]

Karnak I've done flight tests.. Muzzle velocity tests? Where are these?

In AH the 2-gun set has a horrible "lob" in the trajectory. They are also MUCH weaker. I hit a P51D in a la7 vs p51 fight (I was LA, 2 guns option) and lit him up from stem to stern with 10+ 20mm rounds. Nothing fell off. Same thing in the 3-gun option would have killed him instantly.

Folks are always saying they hate the LA5 guns and love the La7 guns -- same deal, the LA5 has the same guns as the 2-gun option LA7.

There's a practical difference. If you fly with the 2-gun option it takes a lot more skill and more precise flying to get your kills. If you fly the 3-gun option any snapshot kills or disables.

[Karnak]

Muzzle velocities as listed in Tony William's books.