Author Topic: Gay Marriage thread (Read 5016 times)

lazs2 · « **Reply #135 on:** April 11, 2006, 09:13:39 AM »

and deselys... how many gay relatives or close friends do you have? How much do you really interact with them? I ask because between my brother and cousin and my girfriends gay brother and their dozens of friends....

I have been around a lot of em... they are not like you and I. It is a noticeable difference... it cuts both ways too.. they all recognize that I am "different" too..

We accept that about each other. We do not intrude on each others world save for decency and treating each other with respect.

Trying to invade heterosexual marriage is not respect. Any more than a group of meterosexuals all invading the gay bars every night... they don't want heteros there. It is legal but.... disrespectful.

lazs

TexMurphy · « **Reply #136 on:** April 11, 2006, 09:21:59 AM »

lazs

Correct me if Im wrong here but basicly you dont like gay people because you are repulsed by seeing your self in their position. I can buy that argument.

I cant see my self in a gay sexual situation either. But on the other hand I cant see my self in any intimite situation with a fat redneck midwest 220lbs chick either.

I think we can both agree that their private life should stay private, just like you and your gf/wife/whatever´s.

But really what is the problem with them getting legaly married. I mean the fact that they are married doesnt change your view of that specific gay couple. From your perspective its still just another gay couple.

All it affects is their rights. It doesnt compromise your life in anyway what so ever. Their marrige has ZERO effect on your life.

Tex.

deSelys · « **Reply #137 on:** April 11, 2006, 09:26:13 AM »

If you don't see the difference between a gay couple and an incestuous couple, I'll suggest you to buy 'biology for dummies'.

Besides, a gay men will always loves men. He can fall in love with Arthur, if Arthur goes away or die, the gay man will look for another man. OTOH a boy who has developed a crush with his sister, if he isn't allowed to marry her, has chances to meet another woman later and to fall in love with her.

Now you'll tell me: 'but gays can't reproduce, so it goes against the expansion of the species and the mixing of the genes!!'. I'll grant you that, of course, but as they are gays ANYWAY, being married or not WILL NOT change an iota to the situation.

Why am I in favor of gay marriages: if one dies in a gay couple, the other HAS MUCH LESS rights regarding inheritance, insurance,... I've just witnessed this first hand a couple of months ago when a young lesbian died. While she and her mate were financially independents and living together since YEARS, it only took a couple of weeks for the parents (who had excellent relationships beforehand) to violently argue about who would get the car, the TV, the home theater, the Golly-geen frigging cellphone!! Had they been married, the surviving one would have avoided this extra-grief.

So you don't want to go to your brother's gay wedding? Tell it to him but don't prevent him to be happy.

Jackal1 · « **Reply #138 on:** April 11, 2006, 09:28:32 AM »

Not but one problem with that Tex. Marriage is between a man and a woman. Plain and simple.
Why can`t they use the laws that are in effect as it stands, hire a lawyer and form a legal partnership?
Thier rights , as it stands, are the same as everyone else.
Why would you find it feasible to have to introduce "special" laws for this group?

TexMurphy · « **Reply #139 on:** April 11, 2006, 09:34:25 AM »

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Originally posted by lazs2
I have been around a lot of em... they are not like you and I. It is a noticeable difference... it cuts both ways too.. they all recognize that I am "different" too..

In the above statement insert "black", "asian", "muslim" instead of them and read it...

then read the following statement...

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Originally posted by lazs2
We accept that about each other. We do not intrude on each others world save for decency and treating each other with respect.

and finally the last statement and replace hetrosexual and metrosexual with "white" and gay with "black", "asian", "muslim"

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Originally posted by lazs2
Trying to invade heterosexual marriage is not respect. Any more than a group of meterosexuals all invading the gay bars every night... they don't want heteros there. It is legal but.... disrespectful.

This is what I mean... its the same kind of racistical segregation arguments as you had in the US up till the 60s with the black population and reading things like that in the year 2006 gives me the creaps...

Humanity consists of individuals. Each individual is different no one is identical. But everyone regardless of gender, religion or sexuality should have equal rights in society, everyone should be treated with the same respect.

Tex

Jackal1 · « **Reply #140 on:** April 11, 2006, 09:40:48 AM »

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Originally posted by TexMurphy

This is what I mean... its the same kind of racistical segregation arguments as you had in the US up till the 60s with the black population and reading things like that in the year 2006 gives me the creaps

Gay is not a race. Irrelevant. The race card won`t work here , no matter how many times you shuffle the deck.

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Humanity consists of individuals. Each individual is different no one is identical. But everyone regardless of gender, religion or sexuality should have equal rights in society

Gays have the exact same legal rights as everyone else.

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everyone should be treated with the same respect.

Respect is earned or not by everyone. No exceptions. It is also one of the few things that cannot be forced or changed by introducing some lame law. You either have it, earn it, deserve it or not.

deSelys · « **Reply #141 on:** April 11, 2006, 09:41:15 AM »

Jackal1, has a civil wedding the same value to you than a church weeding?

If you value most the church (religious) wedding, why do you accept that divorced people are allowed to contract another marriage? Why don't you demand for them to hire a lawyer and form a legal partnership.

Do you feel less married to your wife because 10 houses down your road, two men are 'married' instead of having contracted a civilian partnership?

Why would gay have to follow a different, and probably more expensive and complicated procedure (hint=lawyer) to formalize their union? You won't have to go and be merry at the party, you won't have to call them differently, you won't be tempted to become a gay....so why?

Curval · « **Reply #142 on:** April 11, 2006, 10:02:01 AM »

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Originally posted by deSelys
okay, Curv is as kindergarten as you. Both of you will stand in opposite corners during next recess.

lol

Lazs thinks that the world would be better off if women were never allowed to vote. It is quite an apt comment in this thread because it fits him right in with the backward rethoric out of Jackal et al.

His response to my suggestion that this is just tough guy biker mentality is also typical...he calls me a girly liberal, once again showing his "tough guy" biker mentality.

Lazs likes to throw jabs about trust funds etc. but I think he is just upset that he wasted his early life on drugs, drug dealing and probably being a school bully. All the guys he labels "girly men" drive by the water treatment plant in their nice cars on their way back to their nice homes, wrinkle up their noses, roll up their windows and thank their lucky stars they actually DID something with their lives instead of being forced to clean poopy water at such a stink hole of a place.

Jackal1 · « **Reply #143 on:** April 11, 2006, 10:04:29 AM »

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Originally posted by deSelys
Jackal1, has a civil wedding the same value to you than a church weeding?

Church "weeding" is the best idea I`ve seen you come up with yet.

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If you value most the church (religious) wedding, why do you accept that divorced people are allowed to contract another marriage?

Contract? See you are looking at marriage as if it was some form of document or legaly binding text. Marriage is between a man and a woman. Goes way farther than the legal implications we have put on it. If a man and a woman get a divorce, with one stating to the other the wishs and reasons for the divorce, why shouldn`t they be allowed to marry someone else? Once again irrelevant due to marriage being between a man and a woman.

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Do you feel less married to your wife because 10 houses down your road, two men are 'married' instead of having contracted a civilian partnership?

10 houses down there could not be two men "married" unless it was a two family household. Marriage is between a man and a woman.
IF two men contracted a civilian partnership around here ,and it was anything but a business partnership, their biggest concern would be locating a good realtor to relocate.

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Why would gay have to follow a different, and probably more expensive and complicated procedure (hint=lawyer) to formalize their union?

Because it would be their decison to do so, not anyone elses. At that point they have a choice either to hire the lawyer, form the partenrship or not. Because they are asking for sperate laws/legalization from the rest of society you beleive we should foot the bill? Why wouldn`t they be held responsible for their own actions? The rest of us are. Ridiculous.

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You won't have to go and be merry at the party, you won't have to call them differently, you won't be tempted to become a gay....so why? [/B][/Q

So why......what?
I find it totaly ludicrous that anyone would find it appropiate to support and ask for laws to be put into place especialy for perverts. If they decide to live that way, they should go do it and deal with the circumstances of their choice, just as the rest of society deals with the responsibilty that we all have for our decisons.
You want to push through some new "special" laws for child molestors? Molesting children is what makes them happy. Should we be able to stand in their way of "happiness" and fulfillment? Just how far would you be willing to go with this charade?

TexMurphy · « **Reply #144 on:** April 11, 2006, 10:04:32 AM »

Jackal1

No gay couples dont have the same rights... they dont have the right to marry the person they love and want to spend the rest of their life with...

you do they dont...

Sexuality isnt a race but obviously it works just as well as a segregating instrument as race...

Tex

Jackal1 · « **Reply #145 on:** April 11, 2006, 10:14:23 AM »

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Originally posted by TexMurphy
Jackal1

No gay couples dont have the same rights... they dont have the right to marry the person they love and want to spend the rest of their life with...

you do they dont.

They have the right to marry someone as long as it is of the opposite sex, just like everyone else. Same rights as everyone else.
Marriage doesn`t enter the picture for gays. Marriage is between a man and a woman. They can form a legal partnership is they wish. There are no laws against it.

deSelys · « **Reply #146 on:** April 11, 2006, 11:18:54 AM »

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Originally posted by Jackal1

Contract? See you are looking at marriage as if it was some form of document or legaly binding text.

Now you're beginning to see the light: marriage is a contract giving you certain rights (and obligations). The rest is up to you and the person you're marrying: love, care, etc...

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If a man and a woman get a divorce, with one stating to the other the wishs and reasons for the divorce, why shouldn`t they be allowed to marry someone else?

Because the church doesn't marry already divorced people either. And you seem to confuse the religious and civilian definitionS of marriage.

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10 houses down there could not be two men "married" unless it was a two family household. Marriage is between a man and a woman.
IF two men contracted a civilian partnership around here ,and it was anything but a business partnership, their biggest concern would be locating a good realtor to relocate.

You've already proven that you're pretty obtuse, you can drop it now. BTW, nice typical german 1933-1945 / fundamentalist mentality.

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Because it would be their decison to do so, not anyone elses. At that point they have a choice either to hire the lawyer, form the partenrship or not. Because they are asking for sperate laws/legalization from the rest of society you beleive we should foot the bill? Why wouldn`t they be held responsible for their own actions? The rest of us are. Ridiculous.

Foot the bill? You have to pay for other married couples?? OMFG, Texas is a worse commie hell than Europe!
Do you imply that by marrying, you're less responsible for your own actions?

(See, I can play the dense too....)

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So why......what?
I find it totaly ludicrous that anyone would find it appropiate to support and ask for laws to be put into place especialy for perverts. If they decide to live that way, they should go do it and deal with the circumstances of their choice, just as the rest of society deals with the responsibilty that we all have for our decisons.
You want to push through some new "special" laws for child molestors? Molesting children is what makes them happy. Should we be able to stand in their way of "happiness" and fulfillment? Just how far would you be willing to go with this charade?

Perverts? Yes...to your eyes mostly as homosexuality isn't forbidden by law as child molestation is. Btw, gay marriage is between two consenting adults. The molested child is not consenting (even if he says that he is, his young age voids this affirmation) and is a victim. You should have realized that by now. Or do we have to show concern to how you've raised your 4 daughters?

BluKitty · « **Reply #147 on:** April 11, 2006, 12:18:34 PM »

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Originally posted by Jackal1
I am not, nor do I ever wish to steep so low as to sell out my values to make the PC crowd happy.

"my values"? really?..... they are your's?..... what language do you speak? Did you make up your own language too? Are you religious? did you create that religion? ya, your values

===============

Funny how noone will take on my task

Define the sexes, Define "Male", Define "Female" ...... and don't leave ANYONE out.

Casca · « **Reply #148 on:** April 11, 2006, 01:22:58 PM »

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Originally posted by BluKitty
Define the sexes, Define "Male", Define "Female" ...... and don't leave ANYONE out.

Okeedokee give me a day or so. The lab is calling me in the morning.

Jackal1 · « **Reply #149 on:** April 11, 2006, 02:07:29 PM »

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Originally posted by deSelys
Now you're beginning to see the light: marriage is a contract giving you certain rights (and obligations). The rest is up to you and the person you're marrying: love, care, etc...

You wouldn`t know a light if ya was holding a Brinkman.

Marriage goes way beyond a legal contract.

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You've already proven that you're pretty obtuse

If you consider me obtuse , I will take that as a step in the right direction for I certainly wouldn`t wish to think, (or the lack thereof), the way you do. I prefer to think for myself and not be a slave to others opinions just to be PC. PC sucks. It`s a sell out.

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Foot the bill? You have to pay for other married couples??

No Einstein and that wasn`t what "footing the bill" refered to. We don`t have to foot the bill to have "special laws" put into force for married couples. We also don`t have to pay , as a society, for the aftermath. that is the responsibility already in place for married couples. Once again, marriage is between a man and a woman. Nothing more.

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Texas is a worse commie hell than Europe!

Enlighten me on your vast knowledge of Texas.

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Do you imply that by marrying, you're less responsible for your own actions?

Married people are responsible for their own and joint actions. Marriage is between a man and a woman. You`ll get it eventualy.

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Perverts? Yes...to your eyes mostly as homosexuality isn't forbidden by law as child molestation is.

Yes perverts. You don`t beleive it is perverted? Not but one reason I can see why a male would believe otherwise. I`ll leave that problem up to you if that is the case. At least then such a stance would be understandable.
My eyes and most everyone I personaly know, so there are a lot of eyes that see it the same as me.
So , are you willing to legalize child molestation also? How about murder? How far are you willing to go with the charade?

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The molested child is not consenting (even if he says that he is, his young age voids this affirmation) and is a victim.

So you wish to legalize that also?

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Or do we have to show concern to how you've raised your 4 daughters?

Define "we".
I wouldn`t suggest it, but if you do we can discuss it face to face.

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Because the church doesn't marry already divorced people either. And you seem to confuse the religious and civilian definitionS of marriage.

I don`t know what church you are refering to, but any church that I would consider being married in allows marriage of divorced people. Me thinks you assume too much. Reminds me of someone. :)Where do you get your ideas? Off of ebay?

There is not but one definition of marriage. If anyone is confused on the subject, it would be you.