Author Topic: Hanoi Jane movie  (Read 4134 times)

Offline Nash

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Hanoi Jane movie
« Reply #120 on: April 12, 2006, 01:43:00 AM »
I think Pongo's point is too easily missed.

And Jane's role here is given too much birth. Still...

If Fonda was in fact instrumental in ending the Vietnam War, through domestic dissent or whatever else, then there are literally thousands of grandchildren who are - at this very moment - hugging grandfathers who would otherwise not exist but because of her. Likewise the grandchildren.

Like ghosts, entire limbs of family trees would evaporate.......  the lines shrinking unto themselves as if they never existed. Gone.

Sons of daughters, of sons and daughters, just gone.

What would the happy side of a victorious Vietnam war look like, anyways?

Cheaper Asian manufacturing?

I think we have that despite, no?

It was a stupid war, fought for the wrong reasons, fought badly, and unwinnable.

So if Jane jumps up and tells everyone that they're being retarded, there's a certain part of me that's gonna say "you go!"

And she did.

The very same conviction that compels some to blame her for Vietnam, is the very same conviction by which ghosts hold the bat in their hands in little league, with their fathers watching. Ghosts who make their dads cry in some school play. Ghosts whose stories will never be told.
« Last Edit: April 12, 2006, 02:01:47 AM by Nash »

Offline Debonair

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« Reply #121 on: April 12, 2006, 01:50:19 AM »
according to Johnson it was winnable & they were winning when the plug was pulled

Offline Pongo

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« Reply #122 on: April 12, 2006, 02:08:44 AM »
Hes not likley to say that the B52 offensive was senslessly killing innocent civilians is he.
The Vietnamese seemed willing to take the casualities inflicted, without broadening the war the USAF couldnt truly issolate the north, if thats what he means by "execution" then he should be clear what is is asking for. Sure you can probably trigger korea II in vietnam but is how did that go?

Offline Debonair

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« Reply #123 on: April 12, 2006, 03:14:19 AM »
Gerald Johnson wasn't Bomber Harris & he wasn't talking about carpetbombing civilians.
Called to Command is the book, he wasn't even talking much about the air war.

Offline Toad

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« Reply #124 on: April 12, 2006, 07:30:43 AM »
Pongo, did you ever read "A Better War" by Lewis Sorley?
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!

Offline Hangtime

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« Reply #125 on: April 12, 2006, 08:28:29 AM »
who the hell is 'blaming' Hanoi Jane for the War?

She didn't start it, she didn't end it.

What she did do is label GI's as ignorant baby killers. And I'm using language that's significantly more polite than hers. She was a willing tool of the enemy. She admits it.

She coulda said all that, done all that and she would have been no more of a traitor than Charles Lindberg was for HIS anti-war pro-german stance.

Tell me... would Lindberg still be held in high regard if he made his anti-war speach FROM BERLIN after America got in the war? Or would he have been arrested, tried and convicted of Treason?

Here's a little missive from a guy I have some respect for.

" I received the below message telling me this was 32 years ago and to get a grip!  Since I have received several letters similar to Francine's this past month in reference to Jane Fonda.  I made the assumption that she was referring to Jane Fonda's trip to North Vietnam since her trip was 32 years ago.  To Francine and others out there, I live with some very vivid memories from Viet Nam every day of my life, just like many other Viet Nam Veterans.  The war became very personal to me and the memories make the war feel like it happened yesterday.

The following is Francine's letter:  

    -----Original Message-----
    From: Francine Strauss
    Sent: Friday, May 13, 2005 9:32 PM
    To: John Dennison
    Subject:


    This was 32 years ago - get a grip! We're Americans and we're allowed
    to speak our minds. You probably love the controlled, right wing world
    of George W. Bush - he will truly destroy our American way to his
    "right" way.

My Response to Francine:

    Francine,

    What are you talking about.....Jane Fonda?  If you are talking about Jane Fonda, she in her own words admitted to being a Socialist and revolutionary.  Here are some quotes from Ms. Fonda:  

        On November 21, 1970 she told a University of Michigan audience of some two thousand students, "If you understood what communism was, you would hope, you would pray on your knees that we would some day become communist." At Duke University in North Carolina she repeated what she had said in Michigan, adding "I, a socialist, think that we should strive toward a socialist society, all the way to communism. " Washington Times July 7, 2000

        On July 18, 1970, the People's World, the West Coast's Communist Party publication, carried a telephone interview with Fonda in which she said: "To make the revolution in the United States is a slow day by day job that requires patience and discipline. It is the only way to make it. . . . All I know is that despite the fact that I am one of the people who benefit from a capitalist society, I find that any system which exploits other people cannot and should not exist."

        Fonda made the following statement at the University of Texas: "We've got to establish a Socialist economic structure that will limit private profit-oriented businesses.  Whether the transition is peaceful depends on the way our present governmental leaders react. We must commit our lives to this transition ...... We should be very proud of our new breed of soldier. It's not organized but it's mutiny, and they have every right." Karen Elliott Dallas Morning News December 11, 1971

        "I am not a do-gooder, I am a revolutionary. A revolutionary woman." 1972

    What we all have to ask ourselves is why the news media failed to report on her political beliefs during the 1960's.  We need to ask why they failed to ask her about  her political beliefs when she was doing her book interviews this past month.  The only thing she regretted was that pictures were taken of her on the anti-aircraft gun.  She does not apologize for any of her other actions.  Fonda was trying to portray herself as a regular peace protestor who was against all wars and not her true beliefs as a communist revolutionary.  Jane Fonda was not your everyday average war protestor.  

    We were fighting Communist aggression in South Viet Nam.  This aggression was part of Russia's overall plan for world domination through communism by using their strategy called "War of National Liberation".  The seeds for this new strategy was planted throughout the world, including the United States where Jane Fonda aided the communists.  

    As for getting a "GRIP", I put my life on the line for this Country under a Democratic and Republican President.  I have seen friends wounded and killed by Communist aggressors (NVA - North Vietnamese Army) in South Viet Nam. At the time I was in Viet Nam I lived by John F. Kennedy's words "Ask not what your Country can do for you, but what you can do for your Country".  My question to you is: WHAT HAVE YOU DONE FOR YOUR COUNTRY?
    John D. Dennison  

    http://www.1stcavmedic.com

There was no response back from Francine in reference to my reply."


More here: http://www.1stcavmedic.com/jane_fonda.htm

Nope.. she's not the cause of the war. But, she did declare common cause with the enemy, actively supported the enemy and encouraged the enemy to fight on.

That cost lives... American and Vietnamese.

Fact.

And it is unforgiveable.
The price of Freedom is the willingness to do sudden battle, anywhere, any time and with utter recklessness...

...at home, or abroad.

Offline Pongo

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« Reply #126 on: April 13, 2006, 01:07:01 AM »
Just dont see how it cost lives, and it wasnt and isnt illegal to be a comunist.