Gameplay seem boring? Here's an idea...

[Bronk]

Dok your turn in the barrel.







Bronk

[Rolex]

The dojo analogy is good.

Negative, superficial potshots at most ideas seems to be the norm around here, because it's easy, I suppose. The fallacy with that mindset is that it's easy to try things. If it doesn't work out, improve it until it works, or drop it - no harm done and no money lost.

Mentoring one-on-one is fine. The trainers do a superb job, I'm sure. But what about between training session?

Years ago I proposed a Training Squad - a squad that new guys could join for a couple months to learn how to have fun with others while they learn more about the game in the MA. While some squads invite anyone, it doesn't mean that they instill attitudes that make the MA more fun. Many times the new guys are used for cannon fodder ("All you new guys go de-ack that large field, so we can set up a vulch!" or, "Dive bomb those lancs over and over until you sink the CV!").

A training squad with some basic principles that could teach by example:

- How to appreciate a good fight without going nuts if you lost.
- How to have fun without HOing everything in an La-7.
- How to wing up, have fun and laugh while flying an FM2 or Spit I into a furball.
- Being recognized for fighting that good fight in a P-40, even if you didn't land 2 kills.
- Take them on a variety of squad missions to experience every part of the game, not just low-alt, T&B dogfights, but killing gvs, taking a field, flying bombers above 500' AGL, a gv assault
- Change countries every 10 days just to get to hear the voices of people who shot them down, or they shot down.

All with the constant goal of having fun, some laughs and getting recognized for their improvement until they're ready to move off to another squad. No permanent squad members except for the squad leader - they all move off after 1 or two months.

Of course, it was soundly critized before, and will be criticized again here. All it needed was a little internal promotion from HTC as a MOTD in the MA once in a while, or in the Training Arena, but that didn't, and won't ever happen.

I wanted to do set it up before because a fresh batch of enthusiatic newbies every month or so would be a diversion from the mind-numbing boredom with the MA many players feel once in a while. We just have to get used to the fact that nothing is going to change because nothing is going to change to change it.

[mars01]

I meant the half-hour flight part.

If your talking about a half hour flying around circle jerking each other and not fighting then yeah that sucks.  

If your talking about a half hour fighting then you couldnt be more wrong.  You guys that think furballing only last a few seconds between flights must not be very good at it.

[DoKGonZo]

Originally posted by mars01
If your talking about a half hour flying around circle jerking each other and not fighting then yeah that sucks.  

If your talking about a half hour fighting then you couldnt be more wrong.  You guys that think furballing only last a few seconds between flights must not be very good at it.

I guess it's just easier to say anything different sucks.

Whatever. I've lost interest.

[mars01]

I guess it's just easier to say anything different sucks.

WTF are you talking about Dok?  Time for the meds...

Who's saying "anything different" sucks, you?  It seems you are trying to pigeon hole myself and Laz for whatever reason.  If you were really reading along you wold notice how silly your remarks are.

[Visigothan]

If your talking about a half hour fighting then you couldnt be more wrong. You guys that think furballing only last a few seconds between flights must not be very good at it.

That's about like saying Matt Hughes is a terrible fighter because he only fought Royce Gracie for 1 minute and 39 seconds.

[Sloehand]

Originally posted by mars01
What most people want is a place where you can always find a fight and you don't have to fly 5 mins to get there.  If that were supplied then I could give a crap what the rest of you do.  Those that want to fight will be there.

Here ya go!  It's called the DA.  Now that it's porked for anything else, just choose up sides with a bunch of guys and go at it night after night, day after day, ad nauseum.  All yours for the furballing.  Leave all that other crap, like teamwork, coordination, cooperation, organization, communication, goalsetting, etc. for the MA.

Now go away and play.

[Sloehand]

Originally posted by mars01
Yep when I said most people I was refering to Furballers, that being the context.

 Visigothan - Yep so were most of us the first couple of years, then you hit that point where what you described gets very routine and mundane.

So in essence your saying, you originally enjoyed the full "immersion" gameplay and teamwork aspect of the game until you slowly grew bored and now only seek individual combat as the most stimulating way to enjoy the game.  
AND now, you and the rest of the veteran Furballers-Only Club (FOC's) want everyone else (espcially newbs) to skip past (read fast forward) what should be their first two years of enjoying the immersion part, and jump right to the part where they are as bored with the gameplay/base-taking as you are, and diligenly provide you with targets as they endeavor only to engage in furballs.

OK, now I understand.  Got it.

[Gianlupo]

Maybe I'm a bit simplistic, but I think all Mars asked for is closer fields, so you can quicly find a fight and when your field is horded you can move to another one without having to look at the clipboard map for minutes in search of a good place where you can find other fights without the need of 10 15 minutes of flying.

He never said the others have to skip any phase of the gameplay, he just wants not to have to waste time for finding his own fun. And I think HTC shouldn't deny him this.

Simaril, as I've already told you, you're a wise man. Unfortunately I think your ideas, as well as Rolex's, will hardly find any use.

Btw, if someone put a horde buster gang up, I'm in!

[lazs2]

lets face it... the strat and gameplay and maps are designed so that no fighting the horde is really possible not to mention... fun.

The horde has all the advantages... they don't have to be good..   It doesn't matter how many die because they feel that they are "helping"  it matters not that they lose 20-30 guys if they can take out the radar and the fighter hangers.... you also have the peee 51 guys who will hit the figthter hangers at an undefended near field.

hordeing the horde on the surface sounds allmost fun... two hordes clash and you have... a fight!   nope... you have one group of lemmings throwing themselves at fighter hangers....

You can allmost hear the sigh of relief in the voices of the talentless horders when the FH's go down.... such a relief.... to not have to engage in air combat anymore in an air combat sim..

Nope... the reason we have hordes is that the game is designed for em...

I think that simply moving most of the fields to the minimum 3/4 distance apart would greatly improve gameplay for the people who like to fight without driving off the talentless newbie.

lazs
Public Relations Officer for the BK's

[Simaril]

Tilting at windmills? Maybe.

I just like the idea of trying to DO something constructive instead of wallowing in whines.

Realistically, there are only 2 choices. Either we:

A)  accept AH as it is, or

B) we do something to change it.

If you're going to select A, then stop whining and enjoy what we have. If you're going to select B, then stop whining and do something.

What can we do? Well, we can make our concerns known. I'd have to say this base is thoroughly covered; in fact, the horse is probably as bruised as a dead thing can get. Put a checkmark beside "tell HTC what you think the probelm is."

If HTC doesnt make changes -- for the reasons explained above -- then we have to take over.

1) Base separation is not something that HTC does for us. Everybody who says center bases should be 3/4 sectors away, and bases should have a fightertown center, well -- band together and manufacture some maps.

2) If you dont like the low skill level of the population, what are your suggestions for changing it? Don't expect HTC to throttle down their business so you're happier; not gunna happen.







So what are the fighter guys gunna do? What choices will the furballers like the BKs make?

If we all choose business as usual, no involvement or change efforts from us, then we should (with all respect) Shut The Heck Up.

[mars01]

Originally Posted by:Sloehand
AND now, you and the rest of the veteran Furballers-Only Club (FOC's) want everyone else (espcially newbs) to skip past (read fast forward) what should be their first two years of enjoying the immersion part, and jump right to the part where they are as bored with the gameplay/base-taking as you are, and diligenly provide you with targets as they endeavor only to engage in furballs.

OK here is another great example of the moronic reading what they want instead of reading what was written.  I guess your hands aren't the only thing that are slow.

Originally Posted by:Gianlupo
Maybe I'm a bit simplistic, but I think all Mars asked for is closer fields, so you can quicly find a fight and when your field is horded you can move to another one without having to look at the clipboard map for minutes in search of a good place where you can find other fights without the need of 10 15 minutes of flying.

He never said the others have to skip any phase of the gameplay, he just wants not to have to waste time for finding his own fun.

And here is a great example of someone who can read what is written and understand what was said.   Gian and thank you for showing not everyone on these boards is a moron!

If we all choose business as usual, no involvement or change efforts from us, then we should (with all respect) Shut The Heck Up.

Sim while I think your post is nobel and your enthusiasm is great, I guess we'll just have to wait for your efforts to go into affect.  When you realize we have very little ability to change this game ourselves, what will you do?
Shut the heck up or lobby like the rest of us.

[mars01]

And just to drive my point home a little more Sim, not trying to be a jerk.

Go to this post:  Same Idea

Originally Posted By: mars01 from link above.
The point of the post was to start a dialog where we might figure out a way to help people attain skills while getting the word out that this kind of behaviour is not really fighting or if the community deems it is a valid form of fighting then so be it.

Did you see the date 8/11/04  I am not trying to discourage you and I hope you have a lot better luck at changing what is going on.  But my past expieriance is what I am speaking from, not my arse.

[DoKGonZo]

Mars, whether you mean to or not you do give the impression that you think that anything short of diving into a low furball 30-seconds from the end of the runway is worthless. Maybe that's what's fun for you, but you apply such a harsh value judgement to everything else that it's no suprise you get the reactions you do.

[mars01]

Mars, whether you mean to or not you do give the impression that you think that anything short of diving into a low furball 30-seconds from the end of the runway is worthless.

Could you please cut out and post some quotes that give you this impression.  Please show me my harsh judgement with my own words.

I have said it many times I am here to fight.  The longer the fight, the bigger the battle the better.  Do I care if I die, sure, but it sin't going to stop me from being agressive and fighting.  Give me a place where I can find this kind of action without doing more flying around looking for a fight, then fighting and you will hear nothing but joy from me.

Do I care how other people enjoy the game, as long as they are not stopping me from fighting then I could care less how everyone else flies and what I think should not affect them.  If they are getting what they want out of the game then more power to them.