U.S. Army Says 5.56mm Is Adequate

[Hangtime]

Damn, Pongo. I miss you. One line a month is not enough.

BTW, how yah been?

[lazs2]

neat discussion....

First of all.. I am happy with anything that will shoot but I like my M1 garand and like the 14   The 16 will do in a pinch.  It won't do the things I want it to tho.

The M1 carbine was a..... carbine... but so is the m16 in my opinion.. the M1 carbine used a totaly new round that had never been used in anything before much less a pistol...  It was also not a pistol caliber at all... it was a .308  It was a handy gun.  I would use it in a pinch too.  it hits about like a .357 mag.  the first carbines were tested using winchester .358 self loader ammo.   This was a round used in "rifles" for hunting and many lament that it was not adopted for the carbine...

In a lot of cases... I would just as soon have a good semi auto or pump shotgun with 00 or #4 buck and a big revolver for backup.   Any place I can see a long ways (over 50 yards) I want a garand or 14 or something semi auto in ought six or .308.

The BAR was an amazing gun...  with a small mag.  

And... when it comes right down to it.... Only about 10% of the people in a fight will even fire their weapons.  only a few are really comfortable with guns... those few will make a BAR or bolt action mauser work really well...  most won't... most are better off with the pissant rounds.   Some kind of hit or lead in the air is better than nothing.

Also.. a lot of guys who are really good with guns are not team players anyway so you don't want to design your weapons systems around them... You need to do that around the average soldier and let the guys with a lot of skill use specialty weapons and specialty missions.

We are probly doing it about right at this time... some slight increase in caliber to say .243/257 would probly be OK tho.

lazs

[Boroda]

Originally posted by Neubob
Of course, as mentioned earlier, the Russian penchant for squealing up everything good and worthwhile has taken a bite out of this weapon. Developed and fielded in limited numbers, it's unlikely to gain the recognition of the Ak or the ARs.

I never saw an "Abakan" myself.

Frankly speaking I doubt that it will ever be a significant improvement in infantry weapons.

Accuracy is not an issue. Reliability is. I doubt that any design can beat good old Kalash in this field.

For special forces - Nikonov's automat may be a good thing, but for ordinary infantry - i doubt it. Anyway we have one SVD for every 10 infantry men.

[Hangtime]

Yup.. that SVD is a competent weapon. Kinda odd that it's limited to a 10 round mag. The Romanian version is a hair less accurate, every bit as reliable... and has the same 10 round mag limit. Wierd. They are WAAAAY over priced here. Must be the 'cachet' of unusual appearance and reputation.

Given a choice between the SVD and an m-14.. close call. The M-14 is more versitile, better ammo loadout. SVD can reach further, has a good optics system (standard) and is every bit as reliable as an AK. I guess it would depend on terrain and mission.. I'd select the SVD for sniper work. As an Infantry weapon, the M-14 is more versitile.