'No Habla Espagnol'--A potential discrimination suit

[Nilsen]

I see no problem with the shopowners sign at all.
If he had said say... "order in english not in spanish" or any such thing it could be abit different.

[Angus]

The world should IMHO just accept English as a Universal language.
That is, if it's not your first language, then the second. Everybody should speak 2 languages.
It's already half way there

[gunnss]

I live in a state where the poupulation is effectivly bi-lingual, (NM) but the language of "Money" is english.  If you want to play in the big money games, (more tha a care or house) ya do it in english......

Personaly I have Castillano, (Kinda like spanish but snobier) fair German, and Anglish...... and when stationed in Germany made a point in using as much of the locakl language as I could
Gunns

[Heater]

as someone that has immigrated to another county, I can only say one thing on this, if you live there learn the customs & language.. if you do not want to then leave!.  Why should someone that lives in country A have to learn the Language of Country B because you are to lazy to learn to speak the langauge where you live.

[lazs2]

Nothing wrong with learning other languages if you enjoy it or plan to travel a lot (euros can walk out of their countries) or.... it is some advantage to you..

Here, realisticly...  spanish is the language of the lower class and the poor and the illegal without rights.

If you own a bussiness that caters to the poor and lower class and the illegals then learning spanish will help you.   Check cahing places.... checker at Wallmart.... grocery stores...

For me...  if they don't understand english here when they speak to me or I speak to them... I just ignore em.  Most of us do.  

To allow them to continue to speak spanish and half heartedly make some things bilingual is a well meaning but perfect way to keep one group at the lower end of the economic scale.

In the final analysis....learning a language is hard... if you aren't forced to do it you probly won't

lazs

[storch]

that may be the case in california but here, the people at both the high and low end end of the socio-economic spectrum usually speak spanish or portuguese.  many are here from south america making significant real estate purchases and want to be catered to in the lanugauage they are most comfortable with.  the guys with attitudes like yours have pretty much yielded the field to guys like myself that are equally fluent in the two prinicipal world languages.  thats fine with me, I obtain an overflow of work for our shop from both the anglo and hispanic customer base with ease.  often times an anglo customer will hear me direct a crew in spanish.  some are amazed,  some are more amazed when they discover they just did business with a "julio" or a "Qball".  I just wink and smile at the comments that often typically follow of "oh I have many cuban friends".

[Nifty]

Blown way out of proportion.  Read the sign again.

'This is AMERICA: WHEN ORDERING 'PLEASE SPEAK ENGLISH'

It says please speak English. It doesn't say "if you don't order in English we're not going to serve you."

Geno's is trying to serve customers as fast as they can. If the order taker has to spend extra time to get an order because a customer can't (or won't) order in English, then that just slows up the food line for all the other customers waiting.

Is it really that hard for anyone who doesn't speak English to learn enough to order from a basic menu?

What is really irritating is when you go to a gas station or fast food joint in the USA and you can't communicate with the employee because the employee doesn't speak English. It's happened to me before. Went into a Texaco station next to our hotel near Miami one morning. We just wanted a danish and a cup of coffee before heading out. No coffee was made, so we asked the employee if she was gonna make more. She didn't now what we were saying (or at least acted like she didn't know) and just dismissed us.  The filters and coffee packets were right there, so we decided to do it ourselves, as I'm sure most of you know, when you need coffee you NEED coffee.  As soon as we touched the filters she started yelling at us in Spanish, to which we replied that it would be nice if she'd get off the phone and make the damned coffee if she didn't want us to make it.

We ended up drinking a damned Coke with our danish.

Moral of the story... don't wake up late and miss the continental breakfast in the hotel!  

[Goomba]

I agree that American education is lacking in languages.  I'm glad to say that, at least around here, a second language has become mandatory beginning in 3rd grade.  I just wish that someone hadn't decided that Spanish was the only choice. Hows THAT for discrimination?  Mandatory Spanish?  'High pot, this is the kettle.  You're black.'


Angus;  You make a valid point about the same statement vis-a-vis Icelandic, but I would suggest again that the perspective is really socio-political, not the language.  I don't imagine (although what do I know) that Iceland suffers the same particular problem we do, nor to the same degree, that such an expression of frustration would be necessary.

Besides, a well-mannered guest to your country SHOULD make an attempt to speak the native language.  Might mangle it, sure, but at least try.  And a new immigrant should WANT to learn it.

Ultimately, what really underlies my feelings is the idea that these people (wherever they are from) clearly demonstrate how they think...no respect for the Rule of Law, no respect for the language, no respect for our culture, and no desire to assimilate.  It is OUR country, and we have a right to expect that an immigrant WANTS to be AMERICAN, not just to be in America to exploit us.

I also believe that this point of view applies universally, for any country.  An immigrant should want to be where they are going, and want to be a part of a new culture in a very real and personal sense.  If not, then it's only exploitation, and not worthy of my concern.

[Nilsen]

If you live in a country that doesnt dub movies and tv shows then english should be a pice of cake to learn. If a book has been written in english it will often be translated to norwegian, but i try to find an english copy if i can.

In norway we dont dub, and i could speak english at a very early age. My aunt and cousins in Italy can hardly understand a word of it, but they have been "forced" to see all their shows on tv in dubbed Italian. There is something really funny wathing Friends or listening to john wayne in italian.

Dunno if they dub everything down in Mexico but i would guess they do.

[Neubob]

Not to downplay or overplay the importance of Spanish, or any other foreign language spoken in the US, I think it's safe to say that the significance of that sign was completely blown out of proportion.

It was up for something like 6 months before the hissy fits started, and, as somebody said earlier, business owners generally reserve the right to refuse service to anybody, for any reason.

I thought it ended with the 90s, but apparently, this country is still PC crazy. The scariest thing about this is that, political/social movements are often met with reactions of equal absurdity. If the PC craze subsides on its own, it'll be nice and comfortable for a while, but if these nutcases continue to freak out and start ideological battles over nothing, they're eventually gonna breed some radical anti-PC nutcases... That, I am not looking forward to.

[Speed55]

We are lazy and arrogant as Americans. We should be teaching our children at least 2 languages. Most of the rest of the world is multilingual.

Right, most of the rest of the world speak there native language, and english.

And to say "WE" are lazy and arrogant is very powerful statement. Speak for yourself.
Replace "we" with "you", and delete "as",  and i bet you'll find it branded on a few jihad asses.

If you want to learn 80 languages to increase your business than more power to you, but to say that i'm lazy and arrogant because i don't is wrong.

I'm in the HVAC industry. Out of a 14 hour day, much of the time is spent on a roof somewhere, with the weather around 90 degrees and high humidity.   Other times i'm contorted in a 100+ degree ceiling trying to get to a control panel. I'll get a few ours of a/c when i drive from job to job in nyc traffic, which in itself is mind numbing.
When i finally get a chance to get something to eat, i expect the guy or girl behind the counter to speak english. I don't even care if it's broken english, because at least then i know they are trying.


I think the people that come to this country expecting a red carpet welcome, and have no intention of assimilating into our society are the lazy and arrogant ones.

Think of the guy that runs that store. Customer comes in..
Owner says, "What would you like?"
Customer says, "Yada yada yada."
Owner says, "I'm sorry i don't understand you."
Customer says, "Yada yada yada."
Owner says, "NEXT!"
Customer says, "Yada yada yada stupido motigone gringo."

Imagine that happening often. From my experiance lefties will see it this way... The owner should learn spanish, or whatever language so he can better his business, and show compassion to these poor souls.

I see it the way the owner does... If i learn spanish, than i have to learn, chisese, japanese, italian, russian, pakistani, indian, ect.

Just put up a sign that says, 'This is AMERICA: WHEN ORDERING 'PLEASE SPEAK ENGLISH'

[Maverick]

Originally posted by Nilsen
If you live in a country that doesnt dub movies and tv shows then english should be a pice of cake to learn. If a book has been written in english it will often be translated to norwegian, but i try to find an english copy if i can.

In norway we dont dub, and i could speak english at a very early age. My aunt and cousins in Italy can hardly understand a word of it, but they have been "forced" to see all their shows on tv in dubbed Italian. There is something really funny wathing Friends or listening to john wayne in italian.

Dunno if they dub everything down in Mexico but i would guess they do.

Nilsen,

The TV and films in Mexico are broadcast in Spanish, no English.

[Nilsen]

Originally posted by Maverick
Nilsen,

The TV and films in Mexico are broadcast in Spanish, no English.

Yup thats what i would have guessed.

[Neubob]

Originally posted by Speed55
Right, most of the rest of the world speak there native language, and english.

And to say "WE" are lazy and arrogant is very powerful statement. Speak for yourself.
Replace "we" with "you", and delete "as",  and i bet you'll find it branded on a few jihad asses.

If you want to learn 80 languages to increase your business than more power to you, but to say that i'm lazy and arrogant because i don't is wrong.

I'm in the HVAC industry. Out of a 14 hour day, much of the time is spent on a roof somewhere, with the weather around 90 degrees and high humidity.   Other times i'm contorted in a 100+ degree ceiling trying to get to a control panel. I'll get a few ours of a/c when i drive from job to job in nyc traffic, which in itself is mind numbing.
When i finally get a chance to get something to eat, i expect the guy or girl behind the counter to speak english. I don't even care if it's broken english, because at least then i know they are trying.


I think the people that come to this country expecting a red carpet welcome, and have no intention of assimilating into our society are the lazy and arrogant ones.

Think of the guy that runs that store. Customer comes in..
Owner says, "What would you like?"
Customer says, "Yada yada yada."
Owner says, "I'm sorry i don't understand you."
Customer says, "Yada yada yada."
Owner says, "NEXT!"
Customer says, "Yada yada yada stupido motigone gringo."

Imagine that happening often. From my experiance lefties will see it this way... The owner should learn spanish, or whatever language so he can better his business, and show compassion to these poor souls.

I see it the way the owner does... If i learn spanish, than i have to learn, chisese, japanese, italian, russian, pakistani, indian, ect.

Just put up a sign that says, 'This is AMERICA: WHEN ORDERING 'PLEASE SPEAK ENGLISH'

Couldn't agree more.

[CyranoAH]

Don't see anything wrong with the sign. Here, the government encourages people to always try to communicate with inmigrants in Catalan (local language), so that they can blend better.

Of course if they don't understand the language, you'll rarely see anyone not switching to spanish.

In my case, when we have kids, I'll be talking to them in english, the wife in catalan, grandparents in spanish, and they'll learn french at school.

Friend of mine did it (german-spanish-catalan-french) with their children and as long as they identify the language with the person, they never mix them up.

Daniel