What's wrong with drilling for our own oil?

[Eagler]

Hasn't there been more oil spills caused by tankers during transporting than an oil rig or pipeline leak? So where is the environmental damage when we drill our own oil? Seems they help the fishing, ever seen the fish around an offshore rig?

Eagler

[Mickey1992]

I have heard many varying reports that the oil in the persian gulf part of the world will dry up during the next 50-100 years.

I think that the reason there is no push to drill for oil in the US or near-offshore (other than the tremendous costs involved), is that we are simply waiting for the persian gulf to dry up, leaving the US and Russia with the only oil supplies in the world.

Of course, that's just my opinion.  I could be wrong.  

[Soda]

I think this might answer part of both questions and points made:

Partially right Mickey1992, that and the cost to get oil out is quite expensive in North America compared to from the middle east.  Sea transport is still the cheapest way to get bulk stuff from point A to point B... especially in those quantities.  Also, drilling on sand, or in solid ground, is easier than in the conditions of Alaska or offshore.  Typical rig costs for drilling (based on rough numbers and experience in the industry) are $10K/day for good ground (flat, solid, mild conditions), $25K for bad conditions (more equipment and housing costs plus generally getting the equipment in is tougher), $100K/day for offshore (lots of costs and environmental levys).

When there is no more oil in these places like Iraq they aren't going to have a whole lot of economy left unless the price of sand increases on the world markets.  Just wait and see how they destabilize when that happens.  Scarey thought.

Soda

[This message has been edited by Soda (edited 11-02-2000).]

[Dowding]

When the Persian supplies run out, there's always Antarctica. It has huge oil reserves just waiting to be drained once the international agreement on non-exploitation is broken.

Only a matter of time IMO.

[Toad]

yeah, unless some of those "almost ready for prime time" alternative energy sources take a 20-30 year development leap all of a sudden.

Either that or back to burning all the trees and coal we can find.

Neither is too likely, so pretty soon penguins will be wearing BP decals.


 

[StSanta]

I think we're thinking about this the wrong way.

We say "let's find more oil, regardless of the cost to the environment" when we should say "let's focus on not needing as much".

What I liked about northern Sweden was that there was a lot of undisturbed nature there. Take a snowmobile, ride for an hour, and you're in Elk Land.

Hell, we already got 95% of the world to play with and abuse. Can't we just leave *some* unspoiled wilderness alone?

Our vehicles need gas, for sure. But it is certain that we can find more effective ways of yusing it than we do now. So I ain't saying "boohoo, give up yer cars" or anything like that. Merely "think fuel conservation".

As long as a non renewable source  (oil) is cheaper or almost as cheap as a renewable one (milk), we really shouldn't be whining.

The US economy wouldn't come to a halt if gas prices were raised 100%. It'd affect the freedom of the individual in the sense that they'd have to think about when and how to use the cars though.

Which, IMHO, is not a bad idea  .

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StSanta
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"

[Dowding]

I agree StSanta - but I can't see the oil companies leaving antarctica alone for a second once supplies become really stretch. They'll find some way of breaking or 'bending' international law to turn a profit and supply us all with petrol.

[-lynx-]

Bad StSanta, baad!

 

What I liked about northern Sweden was that there was a lot of undisturbed nature there. Take a snowmobile, ride for an hour, and you're in Elk Land.

Hell, we already got 95% of the world to play with and abuse. Can't we just leave *some* unspoiled wilderness alone?

Our vehicles need gas, for sure. But it is certain that we can find more effective ways of yusing it than we do now. So I ain't saying "boohoo, give up yer cars" or anything like that. Merely "think fuel conservation".

Yeah - why don't you? Lazy bum  ! What was wrong with skiing to that wilderness spot of yours? Gotta love them environmentalists on their snowmobiles !!!

But seriously - I live 7 miles from my work. I could be cycling to work on a nice day saving the fuel and blah-blah-blah... Why don't I? I'm not stupid to brave this narrow, windy road on a bike - it's just not worth the risk. What we need is not just "more roads" or "tax people out of their cars" but environmentally friendly alternatives - cycle paths etc.



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lynx
13 Sqn RAF

[StSanta]

lynx:

lol, yer right. I only took a snowmobile when I could borrow one  .

In DK, we have cycle paths everywhere. You're also right that in many cases, cars *are* needed and are essential. The question then is "how much fuel do I want my car to burn?"

American traditionally have been fans of huge gas guzzlers, and the trend to SUV sort of is indicative of it.

A Fiat Punto will get you from point A to point B just as quickly in a city  . The chicks won't be too impressed, but if thereason ya travel by car is for transport, that's not relevant  .

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StSanta
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"

[-lynx-]

StSanta - ever tried a couple of hundred miles/day in a Punto? It's not fun. You need bigger car if you drive lots. What we need is a ban on huge Range-Rovers and such like delivering kids to schools for ~1/2 mile tops and creating absolute nighmare on the roads .



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lynx
13 Sqn RAF

[F4UDOA]

I read a stat during the Gulf war that the USA gets 80% of it's oil from either Mexico or the Alasken Pipeline. Therefore only 20%could come from the middle east. Sounds like much of oil is somewhat domestic already.

Remember when the oil prices change they change globally. It is not just the OPEC countries that set oil prices. The oil companies would like you to believe that.

Later
F4UDOA

Remember I read that in 1991 in the USA today during the war. This is not a campain statistic.

[Soda]

Interestingly enough, a very large portion of oil/gas (as in natural gas) is used in heating, electricty generation, and industry.  Cutting back on driving helps, but turning on your computer also uses these resources.

The costs of alternatives in relation to the cost of oil/gas has not made it economical, when that changes then you'll probably see a lot of advancement in a short period of time in alternative fuel sources.

North America could support it's own oil/gas needs, it's just more expensive.  With the general direction of oil prices these days though it becomes more and more feasible.

Soda

[LJK Raubvogel]

You are right F4UDOA, the US gets a small percentage of its oil from the Middle East. You have to remember that not only Middle Eastern countries are in OPEC. I know Venezuela, and I think Mexico too are also in OPEC.

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LJK_Raubvogel
LuftJägerKorps

[Eagler]

 http://www.eia.doe.gov/emeu/cabs/opec.html

These are the guys with all the cards, or at least the best hand.
 http://www.opec.org/faqs.htm

OPEC FAQS

Eagler

[StSanta]

Lynx, yah I've been there, done that. 1200 km in one day in a Fiat Punto. It ain't that bad.

There are larger more comfortable vehicles that still are reasonable economic.

But, of course I was talking about the daily commute  .

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StSanta
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"