Author Topic: The Turning Point  (Read 679 times)

Offline xrtoronto

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The Turning Point
« on: July 30, 2006, 04:47:35 PM »
Severe reactions to an attack by the Israeli Air Force on the Lebanese town of Qana, located 16 km east of Tyre, has provoked widespread commendation of Israel’s continuing military operation; and may even be a major ‘turning point’ in this 19 day old war. The air raid, occurring in the early Sunday morning hours, resulted in a basement shelter filled with refugees, many of them women and children, being hit by IAF bombs with more than 60 people reported killed and injured. As the bodies were continuously pulled out of the rubble, the angry outcry has resulted in a cancellation of a planned visit to Beirut by U.S. Sec. of State Condoleezza Rice. Though Israeli military authorities reported that Qana had been used to launch Katyusha rockets into Israel, [the resulting death and injury and of innocent civilians has created such a strong backlash against Israel that an immediate and unconditional ceasefire is now being demanded by world leaders, including Jordan’s King Abdullah, who called the attack “an ugly crime.

Israel Defense Minister Amir Peretz has asked the IAF to investigate the cause of the attack and why this particular location (i.e. the shelter area) was attacked. This effort is not enough to placate an extremely agitated Lebanese populace who afterwards surrounded and broke into the U.N. Beirut headquarters, smashing everything they could lay their hands on, and waiving yellow Hezbollah flags, as well as shouting slogans tied to that organization.

The reverberations from this attack, called an international outrage by many, could well be Hezbollah’s “secret weapon” as they know that international public opinion is even more potent than their continuing to shoot their missiles into the Jewish State. Incidents such as this have always occurred during warfare; and a very similar one occurred in Baghdad during the 1991 Gulf War when an American launched ’smart bomb’ struck a shelter in central Baghdad, killing more than a hundred civilians. That incident, and the public outcry it created, resulted in an immediate scaling down of U.S. attacks on the Iraqi capital, and may have helped keep Saddam Hussein in power, even after his army was crushed.

Hezbollah has successfully used civilians to keep their enemies at bay, and even in the initial attacks on southern Beirut, Hezbollah had used heavily populated areas to launch missiles, as well as hide militiamen and arms. This may have also occurred in what will now be referred to as the ‘Qana massacre’. And regardless of the outcome of Israel’s investigation, the international condemnation pouring out, with the help of zealous news medias, will most likely result in even Ms. Rice and U.S. President Bush calling for an immediate cessation of hostilities.

Hezbollah, especially their leader Sheikh Nasrallah, couldn’t be more pleased, and are probably already making plans on how to exploit this event to the fullest. They even know that if an international peacekeeping force is sent to S. Lebanon (most likely composed of many American combat personnel, despite being stretched thin in Iraq and Afghanistan) will be to Hezbollah’s advantage, as a few well- orchestrated suicide terror attacks will make this force flee like the Americans did form Beirut in 1982. And Nasrallah also knows that he doesn’t even have to fire any more of his Katyusha rockets into Israel, as the ‘missiles’ of anti- Israel public opinion have already been very successfully launched.


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« Last Edit: July 30, 2006, 04:49:48 PM by xrtoronto »

Offline Toad

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The Turning Point
« Reply #1 on: July 30, 2006, 05:51:38 PM »
Mostly likely this is the turning point where it all turns back to the place from which it began.

From where it will start again, you might say.
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!

Offline Bronk

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The Turning Point
« Reply #2 on: July 30, 2006, 06:11:51 PM »
Love what you highlighted  and  omitted highlighting.
I'd have highlighted these parts.


Israeli military authorities reported that Qana had been used to launch Katyusha rockets into Israel


and how about this



This effort is not enough to placate an extremely agitated Lebanese populace who afterwards surrounded and broke into the U.N. Beirut headquarters, smashing everything they could lay their hands on, and waiving yellow Hezbollah flags, as well as shouting slogans tied to that organization.

Yea its the UN fault lets smash em up.


Ohh my particular fav...

Hezbollah has successfully used civilians to keep their enemies at bay, and even in the initial attacks on southern Beirut, Hezbollah had used heavily populated areas to launch missiles, as well as hide militiamen and arms. This may have also occurred in what will now be referred to as the ‘Qana massacre’. And regardless of the outcome of Israel’s investigation, the international condemnation pouring out, with the help of zealous news medias


Ohh no this time Hezbollah did not use this particular site... pfffft


Gets even better....



Hezbollah, especially their leader Sheikh Nasrallah, couldn’t be more pleased, and are probably already making plans on how to exploit this event to the fullest.  


Yup they don't care how many innocents they place in the line of fire ...just as long as they don't get shot at.


Amazing how to people read a story and get different things out of it.



Bronk
« Last Edit: July 30, 2006, 06:20:58 PM by Bronk »
See Rule #4

Offline Captain Virgil Hilts

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The Turning Point
« Reply #3 on: July 30, 2006, 06:16:59 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Toad
Mostly likely this is the turning point where it all turns back to the place from which it began.

From where it will start again, you might say.


You mean it'll start again when Hamas, Hezbollah, or Islamic Jihad decide to violate cease fire number 847,972, by killing Isreali civilians or kidnapping Isreali soldiers from Israeli soil?

Where upon while Israel tries to deal with the attack, the "civilized" world will call for cease fire 847,973.

Because instead of allowing Israel to stomp a mud puddle in their tulips and stomp it dry, they (the "civilized" world) called for cease fire number 847,972?

If cease fires brought peace, the Middle East would be the most peaceful region on the planet. (Shamelessly stolen from Thomas Sowell)
« Last Edit: July 30, 2006, 06:19:55 PM by Captain Virgil Hilts »
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Offline kamilyun

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The Turning Point
« Reply #4 on: July 30, 2006, 06:36:09 PM »
What sucks is that Syria and Iran get to screw with Israel by their proxies Hezbollah while Lebanese civilians (roughly 1/2 Christian, btw) get tagged by Israeli bombs.

Hezbollah, has a sweet job.  1)  Launch rockets 2) Hide amongst civilians 3)Wait for Israeli retaliation 4) Wait for Arab (and sometimes international) condemnation 5) Rinse and repeat

I'm not sure why Israel doesn't have Predator drones, 10-15 in the air at any one time.  This would be the easiest way to deal with the rocket firing.  They leave a distinct trail and could easily be traced back and hit within 1-2 minutes....

Offline xrtoronto

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The Turning Point
« Reply #5 on: July 30, 2006, 06:40:24 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by kamilyun
I'm not sure why Israel doesn't have Predator drones, 10-15 in the air at any one time.  


they do...one crashed just a couple days ago...the idf bombed the crash site 30 minutes later so the sensitive material inside would not go to hezbollah

Offline Gunslinger

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The Turning Point
« Reply #6 on: July 30, 2006, 09:26:58 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by xrtoronto
they do...one crashed just a couple days ago...the idf bombed the crash site 30 minutes later so the sensitive material inside would not go to hezbollah


Did they hit any kids when they bombed it?

Offline lasersailor184

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« Reply #7 on: July 30, 2006, 09:29:50 PM »
They should have.  That way Toronto could happily condemn Israel with the rest of the world, but not actually do anything.
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Offline Black Sheep

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The Turning Point
« Reply #8 on: July 30, 2006, 09:40:29 PM »
Yeah - but even a complete moron driving a TV guided missile can tell the difference between a 3 story building and a mobile rocket launch site, ya think?

Offline Maverick

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« Reply #9 on: July 30, 2006, 09:43:45 PM »
I'm afraid that the turning point will end up going to the hezbollah. They have brilliantly won the media war and all it cost them was a relatively few lebanese. No matter what the situation is on the ground, rather than risk criticizing the hezbollah and their tactics, the politically correct media had already decided who will win the conflict. Hezbollah played them like a word class orchestra and swayed opinion away from their own initiating the conflict to the bad evil isreali's counter battery fire. Now it's left to let the diplomats decide how much Isreal will have to sacrifice in territory to gain a brief "peace".

You may not agree but that's the way I see it going from now on.
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Offline Bronk

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The Turning Point
« Reply #10 on: July 30, 2006, 09:45:52 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Black Sheep
Yeah - but even a complete moron driving a TV guided missile can tell the difference between a 3 story building and a mobile rocket launch site, ya think?



Exactly

Bronk
See Rule #4

Offline lasersailor184

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The Turning Point
« Reply #11 on: July 30, 2006, 09:49:09 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Maverick
I'm afraid that the turning point will end up going to the hezbollah. They have brilliantly won the media war and all it cost them was a relatively few lebanese. No matter what the situation is on the ground, rather than risk criticizing the hezbollah and their tactics, the politically correct media had already decided who will win the conflict. Hezbollah played them like a word class orchestra and swayed opinion away from their own initiating the conflict to the bad evil isreali's counter battery fire. Now it's left to let the diplomats decide how much Isreal will have to sacrifice in territory to gain a brief "peace".

You may not agree but that's the way I see it going from now on.



No.  The world wide media scene was played before the opening salvoes were even up.  You can figure out the reasons why, but it's really simple.
Punishr - N.D.M. Back in the air.
8.) Lasersailor 73 "Will lead the impending revolution from his keyboard"

Offline xrtoronto

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The Turning Point
« Reply #12 on: July 30, 2006, 10:14:40 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by lasersailor184
They should have.


They may have put kids there, but the Israeli aim has been less accurate this past couple days. A few days ago, they bombed the UN post that had been thre since 1958, killing 4. The UN pulls out all other UN staff and yesterday, IDF fired on the UN marked vehicles again, while trying to escape, but this time they only wounded the personel. Today, they kill all these women and children. All three incidents were 'accidents' of coarse. (just like the last time in Qana 10 years ago when they bombed another UN site killing more than a 100 civilians hiding in the basement to escape death - oh, that was another 'accident'.) The family last month on the beach, 7 killed by IDF (5 children) - another accident. *raises eyebrows*

Quote
That way Toronto could happily condemn Israel with the rest of the world, but not actually do anything.


Condem Israel? With all my conviction.  But, it's really a moot point now. Israel has lost global support from everyone but the US

*shrugs*

Offline Maverick

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The Turning Point
« Reply #13 on: July 30, 2006, 10:20:04 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by xrtoronto
Condem Israel? With all my conviction.  But, it's really a moot point now. Israel has lost global support from everyone but the US

*shrugs*


But hezbollah is okey dokie with you then?
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Offline GRUNHERZ

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The Turning Point
« Reply #14 on: July 30, 2006, 10:22:15 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Bronk
Love what you highlighted  and  omitted highlighting.
I'd have highlighted these parts.


Israeli military authorities reported that Qana had been used to launch Katyusha rockets into Israel


and how about this



This effort is not enough to placate an extremely agitated Lebanese populace who afterwards surrounded and broke into the U.N. Beirut headquarters, smashing everything they could lay their hands on, and waiving yellow Hezbollah flags, as well as shouting slogans tied to that organization.

Yea its the UN fault lets smash em up.


Ohh my particular fav...

Hezbollah has successfully used civilians to keep their enemies at bay, and even in the initial attacks on southern Beirut, Hezbollah had used heavily populated areas to launch missiles, as well as hide militiamen and arms. This may have also occurred in what will now be referred to as the �Qana massacre�. And regardless of the outcome of Israel�s investigation, the international condemnation pouring out, with the help of zealous news medias


Ohh no this time Hezbollah did not use this particular site... pfffft


Gets even better....



Hezbollah, especially their leader Sheikh Nasrallah, couldn�t be more pleased, and are probably already making plans on how to exploit this event to the fullest.  


Yup they don't care how many innocents they place in the line of fire ...just as long as they don't get shot at.


Amazing how to people read a story and get different things out of it.



Bronk


Nice post Bronk, I was just thinking the same thing how intersting it was which sectionsxrtoronto chose  to highlight and which to not.