Author Topic: Ice bubbles reveal biggest rise in CO2 for 800,000 years  (Read 4759 times)

Offline Yeager

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Ice bubbles reveal biggest rise in CO2 for 800,000 years
« Reply #30 on: September 05, 2006, 12:01:16 PM »
The earth will survive humanity, and life will continue without us, as long as the sun survives to provide energy....

Humanity will not last forever, nor should it.  As we each are guaranteed a death sentance so it only makes sense our species will one day end.

Only the passage of time will truly last forever.  All other elements will decay into death status.
"If someone flips you the bird and you don't know it, does it still count?" - SLIMpkns

Offline Neubob

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Ice bubbles reveal biggest rise in CO2 for 800,000 years
« Reply #31 on: September 05, 2006, 12:10:03 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Yeager
The earth will survive humanity, and life will continue without us, as long as the sun survives to provide energy....

Humanity will not last forever, nor should it.  As we each are guaranteed a death sentance so it only makes sense our species will one day end.

Only the passage of time will truly last forever.  All other elements will decay into death status.


I think we'll last longer than many think. The same talents that has produced the technology that supposedly threatens us today will overwhelm the problems it created.

Or not.

Offline Angus

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Ice bubbles reveal biggest rise in CO2 for 800,000 years
« Reply #32 on: September 05, 2006, 12:37:45 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Yeager
The earth will survive humanity, and life will continue without us, as long as the sun survives to provide energy....

Humanity will not last forever, nor should it.  As we each are guaranteed a death sentance so it only makes sense our species will one day end.

Only the passage of time will truly last forever.  All other elements will decay into death status.


The earth, - yes. However perhaps in a similar form as Venus until the light goes out.
It's no excuse for us to behave like we do though....
It was very interesting to carry out the flight trials at Rechlin with the Spitfire and the Hurricane. Both types are very simple to fly compared to our aircraft, and childishly easy to take-off and land. (Werner Mölders)

Offline IgnorantJoe

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Ice bubbles reveal biggest rise in CO2 for 800,000 years
« Reply #33 on: September 05, 2006, 12:49:46 PM »
Why do core samples taken at one location provide detailed information for the entire earth?

A change of 30ppm of CO2 in 17 years establishes a definitive rate of change?  Wouldn't you want more points on that curve to be more accurate?

Does anyone realize that a single volcanic eruption can produce more CO2 than all the automobiles can for a single year?

Or that automobiles isn't the only possible reason for increased CO2?  Could reducing vegatation inhibit the reduction of CO2?

Does anyone wonder who funds this research?

What would happen if the research pointed out that there wasn't a problem?

How can someone claim that humans have changed CO2 levels "outside the normal range" when you have core samples taken from only one location which only represent less than 1/4th of the earth's life?  What is normal?

Hasn't the earth heated up several times before?

Why do so many people jump on bandwagons so easily?



I ask because I'm ignorant.

Offline Neubob

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Ice bubbles reveal biggest rise in CO2 for 800,000 years
« Reply #34 on: September 05, 2006, 12:59:17 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by IgnorantJoe
Why do so many people jump on bandwagons so easily?
 


Bandwagons allow for entire groups to say 'see, I knew it!' based solely on the fact that a bunch of other people are saying 'see, I knew it!' right along with them.

That's why people like bandwagons.

Offline Elfie

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Ice bubbles reveal biggest rise in CO2 for 800,000 years
« Reply #35 on: September 05, 2006, 02:00:33 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by mora
straw man

Ton of CO2? You release the same amount of C02 when you burn an amount of hydrocarbon, it doesn't matter if it's in a car or an airplane. A typical fuel consumption of an intercontinental airliner is around 3 liters per kilometer(77 Miles Per Gallon) per passenger. Even the smallest cars consume almost twice of that, and they are mostly occupied by a single passenger. You better start carpooling or we are doomed.


IF an airliner is burning THREE litres of fuel per kilometer, per passenger, no way it is getting 77 MPG per passenger. Thats approximately 5 litres of fuel per mile, per passenger. Or approximately 1.25 gallons per mile, per passenger.

Even the worst SUV's get better mileage than that, far better.

Want to do something about CO2 levels? Plant a tree, stop the deforestation of the Amazon rain forest.
Corkyjr on country jumping:
In the end you should be thankful for those players like us who switch to try and help keep things even because our willingness to do so, helps a more selfish, I want it my way player, get to fly his latewar uber ride.

Offline Dinger

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Ice bubbles reveal biggest rise in CO2 for 800,000 years
« Reply #36 on: September 05, 2006, 02:10:43 PM »
Gasses distribute pretty evenly.
A single data point, even a single source, is not a reliable basis for anything.
The change in CO2 being plotted is several orders of magnitude beyond what volcanic eruptions can produce,
Research demonstrating rise in CO2 levels is funded by several groups around the world, and vetted by peer review; as is research on the rise in global temperatures, the association between CO2 and global temperatures, and the history of climate change.
Scientists claiming "it's not as bad as all that" are funded by the major oil companies; and even they do not question that human activity has sent the atmospheric levels of CO2 skyrocketing.
The research itself isn't saying "there is a problem"; it is saying, "These are the facts, and here's what's associated with them."
"There is a serious problem" is how we understand the facts; "Oh my god, the world is gonna catch fire" is how the press portrays it.

Yes, the earth has been a lot hotter than it is now -- all that carbon that we're pumping out of the earth and burning used to be in the atmosphere. And yes, to say it's out of the earth's "normal range" is a little presumptuous. But as humans, we really shouldn't care about the "normal range" of Earth temperatures in absolute, or the fact that the earth was once boiling hot. We should care about the temperatures necessary to sustain human life.

The bandwagon was twenty years ago. Now it's just cold, hard facts.
Human ingenuity might get us out of this, but there's far more of us now than there ever was; resources (such as water and food) are already scarce -- climate change will make that even worse; and the global economy has a single point of failure: burning carbon for energy.
It's time to get ingenious.

Offline mora

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Ice bubbles reveal biggest rise in CO2 for 800,000 years
« Reply #37 on: September 05, 2006, 02:20:19 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Elfie
IF an airliner is burning THREE litres of fuel per kilometer, per passenger, no way it is getting 77 MPG per passenger. Thats approximately 5 litres of fuel per mile, per passenger. Or approximately 1.25 gallons per mile, per passenger.

LOL, my bad.... of course it would be 3 liters per 100 km per passenger.

Offline lazs2

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Ice bubbles reveal biggest rise in CO2 for 800,000 years
« Reply #38 on: September 05, 2006, 02:33:32 PM »
well... I was gonna ask some of you global warming caused by C02 experts for a little math but it seems you have trouble with math so...

I will just ask.... How much do we have to reduce C02 emmisions in order to stop the current global warming?

What should we do right now?

If we all stopped driving and burning anything as of right now.... how many minutes.... how much will it slow the natural global warming trend we are in?

And.... what do we do if we go into a global cooling cycle?

How much is co2 raising the tempreture of the planet?   Not, how much was it 100 years ago and how much is it today but..... How much is the fault of co2?

none of you know the answers.... none of you can say that if we all suddenly left the planet that it would change the rate of global warming one little bit...

lazs

Offline WilldCrd

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Ice bubbles reveal biggest rise in CO2 for 800,000 years
« Reply #39 on: September 05, 2006, 03:31:30 PM »
Well, I recently purchased several "choice" acres on the moon and on mars.
soon as i figure out the whole getting there and surviving there thing im gonna kick back and watch you earthers kill yourselves either the fast way or the slow way. I got a "prime" location to watch it all :cool:
Crap now I gotta redo my cool sig.....crap!!! I cant remeber how to do it all !!!!!

Offline indy007

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Ice bubbles reveal biggest rise in CO2 for 800,000 years
« Reply #40 on: September 05, 2006, 03:51:50 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by eureka101
Ooooh Lazs, you're starting to sound like Jackal there. Next you'll be saying "pulse rate above 30" or some such line.

So let me ask you: How many international visitors does Dixon attract each year? :rofl


At least compare Windsor to our American places with castles...
Disney (just the California adventure park) had 4.7 million visitors last year... hundreds of thousands of them foreigners.

That must be rough. More people want to see the fake castle of a cartoon mouse, than a storied bastion of royal power.

:lol

Offline Elfie

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Ice bubbles reveal biggest rise in CO2 for 800,000 years
« Reply #41 on: September 05, 2006, 04:57:49 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by mora
LOL, my bad.... of course it would be 3 liters per 100 km per passenger.


Even that is kind of misleading. It assumes the airliner has a full load of passengers, which isnt always the case.

http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview?id=48121


According to British Airways, a 747-400 plane cruises at 576 mph (927
km/h), burns 12,788 liters (3378 US gallons) of fuel per hour, and
carries 409 passengers when full:
http://www.britishairways.com/flights/factfile/airfleet/docs/7474.shtml

If the plane is 75% full, one passenger is carried 22.2 km for each
liter of fuel burned (52.2 miles for each US gallon of fuel burned).
This fuel efficiency exceeds that of almost all cars, when the driver
is travelling alone.

These figures assume the car only has the driver, again, that isnt always the case.

I dont burn 3378 gallons of gas in an entire year but a 747 does in just a few hours. In a few hours a 747 pumps out more hydrocarbon emissions than I do in a car in over 4 years. Thats just ONE 747 flight.

If I used a full tank of gas every week (I dont, use about 3/4) I would use 728 gallons per year.
Corkyjr on country jumping:
In the end you should be thankful for those players like us who switch to try and help keep things even because our willingness to do so, helps a more selfish, I want it my way player, get to fly his latewar uber ride.

Offline Shuckins

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Ice bubbles reveal biggest rise in CO2 for 800,000 years
« Reply #42 on: September 05, 2006, 05:17:37 PM »
Before too much finger-pointing in the direction of Brazil for its cutting of the rain forests takes place, it might be well to consider just how much unnecessary consumption of lumber takes place right here in the United States.

We are the leading consumer of wood products, bar none.  One has only to consider the vast number of McMansions being constructed in suburban areas and upper crust communities to understand the magnitude of that consumption.  Does a family of only two or three really need a 6,000 square foot, multi-story home to dwell in.

Construction companies that build these large cookie-cutter monstrosities often prepare a site by bulldozing ALL vegetation, and planting them as close together as possible.  If the home-buyer wants trees on their property, they have to start from scratch.

With so much lumber being needed for construction, the cutting of forests is reaching unbelievable proportions.  Replanting of cut hardwood forests is often in faster growing pine, leading to a complete change in the former eco-system.  I can't speak for the rest of the country, but here in Arkansas bottomland hardwood forests are headed the way of the dodo.

If the planting of trees will help address the atmospheric problems threatening our planet, then I am all for it...but we as Americans also need to live a less ostentatious lifestyle and thus have a lesser impact on the environment around us.


Sorry.....my rant for the day.

Offline Elfie

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Ice bubbles reveal biggest rise in CO2 for 800,000 years
« Reply #43 on: September 05, 2006, 05:28:25 PM »
Well Shuckins you are right about construction companies just bulldozing all the vegetation. Especially on the larger construction projects.

Logging needs to be done in a manner that doesn't wipe out the forest. Trees that are cut down need to be replanted and not just with fast growing pines.

In regards to the Amazon rain forest, that ecosystem is disappearing at an astounding rate.
Corkyjr on country jumping:
In the end you should be thankful for those players like us who switch to try and help keep things even because our willingness to do so, helps a more selfish, I want it my way player, get to fly his latewar uber ride.

Offline aztec

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Ice bubbles reveal biggest rise in CO2 for 800,000 years
« Reply #44 on: September 05, 2006, 05:33:40 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Yeager
The earth will survive humanity, and life will continue without us, as long as the sun survives to provide energy....

Humanity will not last forever, nor should it.  As we each are guaranteed a death sentance so it only makes sense our species will one day end.

Only the passage of time will truly last forever.  All other elements will decay into death status.


Dang thats deep Yeager...You just re-read Johnathon Livingston Seagull? ;-)