HT ... idea on Arena population control

[hubsonfire]

Originally posted by Mustaine
this whole thing with the arenas though does disrupt one thing... things like RJO. now some didn't like that, others did. one thing it did do was bring a the community together a bit, and helped the rooks overcome their low numbers before it was started. it is a shame soemthign like that can no longer realistically function. i kind of liked being one of the defense people in that, when the knights / bish tried to backdoor the horde there were certain people who's job it was to defend even while outnumbered the back lines.

Having been on both sides of the RJO, it seems to me that part of what was attractive was that the RJO encouraged a sense of community that was otherwise lacking, ie squads cooperating, large well organized groups (not the mindless hordes, but still not something I would like to see every 15 minutes, mind you), lots of chatter between groups that didn't often communicate. It just made the cartoon world seem a bit smaller, and a bit friendlier. Anyway, it's only my opinion, but I can't help but think there would never have been any need for something like that in a smaller arena.

The only real issue I see with slap's idea is that country changing, for balance or whatever reasons, is antithetical to many people (even I was that naive in the past, but a few tours on the other 2 chesspieces cured me of that), and I'm not sure how many would tolerate being told, effectively, that their ideas of right and wrong and fair would no longer be accepted as valid. Considering how many are upset now, I think HT's right. There would be a great deal more unhappiness than there is now.

But yeah, it would definitely force some balance, and would make some sort of adjustment to the new world a necessity, and not an option, which is one benefit of the new system over what you suggest.

Personally, I like it, but I'm a little more flexible when it comes to this type of thing. I don't care who I get to shoot at.

[SlapShot]

Hub ... people don't have a choice now if the arena is MAXed ... and it really wasn't intended to allieviate the angst that large squads have of not changing sides ... so in the long run, this idea should not piss off anymore people than are already pissed off.

What it would do is not piss off those people who don't care for what chess piece that they fly for ... just as long as they can get into the arena that they want to ... the free by-product is a balanced arena ... probably no ENY ... and the arena does not have a hard-coaded MAX.

The larger squads have to figure out what they are going to do no matter what ... the change has been made ... it's up to them to figure it out how to adapt.

[FiLtH]

For the past year Ive been amazed at how close the 3 countries have stayed for the most part. There may be an odd night one team had 50 extra guys on, but normally they have been with 10-20.

  For me, whether its my country or an enemy's, when a bunch of guys come on, its fun either trying to stop them, or working with them to do big missions.

  Does this bother more people than I think it does?

[SlapShot]

Originally posted by FiLtH
For the past year Ive been amazed at how close the 3 countries have stayed for the most part. There may be an odd night one team had 50 extra guys on, but normally they have been with 10-20.

  For me, whether its my country or an enemy's, when a bunch of guys come on, its fun either trying to stop them, or working with them to do big missions.

  Does this bother more people than I think it does?

It did even out for awhile but got out of hand again.

I think, and hope, that your question would/could be answered in another thread (no offense) ... I would like this thread to discuss the merits of the idea and hopefully not go off on some other tangent.

[hubsonfire]

Originally posted by SlapShot
Hub ... people don't have a choice now if the arena is MAXed ... and it really wasn't intended to allieviate the angst that large squads have of not changing sides ... so in the long run, this idea should not piss off anymore people than are already pissed off.

What it would do is not piss off those people who don't care for what chess piece that they fly for ... just as long as they can get into the arena that they want to ... the free by-product is a balanced arena ... probably no ENY ... and the arena does not have a hard-coaded MAX.

The larger squads have to figure out what they are going to do no matter what ... the change has been made ... it's up to them to figure it out how to adapt.

True enough, I guess it's a bit late to start worrying about that. I was thinking that the larger groups wouldn't be able to fly together in a particular arena as it maxes or ENY kicks in, but I guess we're already seeing people running into this with the smaller caps.

[Edbert]

I think that other than moderate tweaks I'm with Dale, let the hubub die to to more normal whine levels before doing anything drastic. Once TOD comes out I doubt any of the EW/MW/LW arenas will max out, at least for a while.

But...after more consideration....if you want to consider short-term fixes...maybe there could be at 100 player limit for any one team, with a 300-player cap in each arena it ensures the arena will never get maxed out AND have unbalanced teams. If there are unbalanced teams in a non-maxed arena then the players only have themselves to blame.

...just another thought.

[SlapShot]

Originally posted by Edbert
I think that other than moderate tweaks I'm with Dale, let the hubub die to to more normal whine levels before doing anything drastic. Once TOD comes out I doubt any of the EW/MW/LW arenas will max out, at least for a while.

But...after more consideration....if you want to consider short-term fixes...maybe there could be at 100 player limit for any one team, with a 300-player cap in each arena it ensures the arena will never get maxed out AND have unbalanced teams. If there are unbalanced teams in a non-maxed arena then the players only have themselves to blame.

...just another thought.

Yours is just another angle and  that is what my idea would boil down to ... even and balanced sides ... but mine differs with the addition of the MAX being dynamic and allowing it to be surpassed if balance was maintained within a range.

Object here is to let people join (balanced) arenas ... and not be shut out by a hard-coaded MAX of 300.

[Murdr]

Originally posted by SlapShot
Would this not help some people who want to fly in that arena, who really don't care what country that they fly for and at the same time direct people to help create a balance ... if they want to fly in that particular arena ?

Actually I kind of agree with the parameters Slap posted originally that it would be less restrictive.  

You could fly in the chosen arena, but only if you're willing to pitch in to balance the numbers for at least the time limit for country switching.  It would kill two birds with one stone.  The issue of being locked out of a maxed arena, and the issue of number balancing.  Maybe I'm missing something when considering the 'big picture', but it seems like it could quell more complaints that it would spawn.

[Kev367th]

Originally posted by SlapShot
Let's say that the arena max population is 300 in LW1 for example.

Current counts ...

Rooks have 150
Bish have 80
Knights have 70

So if I choose LW1 I am presented with a popup that provides me a selective choice to join either the Bish or the Knights ... Rooks are not available due to their superior numbers.

Would this not help some people who want to fly in that arena, who really don't care what country that they fly for and at the same time direct people to help create a balance ... if they want to fly in that particular arena ?

This would allow the arena max to be surpassed, but also persuade others to balance.

So when someone chooses the arena you do ...

If current_arena_pop >= arena_max ... display country choice panel

The country choice panel would display, in this case, Bish or Knights.

Now in the instance when all countries have equal numbers or equality in numbers with say +/- 10 people ... then the popup would not appear and they would go to the country that they last flew for in the arena.

Rooks have 110
Bish have 90
Knights have 100

This would not produce the popup and the player would just directly join the last country that they flew for.

Would this not make the joining of a particular arena fluid and dynamic and at the same time allow the population max to dynamically change if people choose to do the right thing ?

Hmm persuade - "To induce to undertake a course of action or embrace a point of view by means of argument, reasoning, or entreaty"

Persuade my ****, it's limiting choices YET AGAIN.

Guess you won't be happy till everyone either plays the game the way YOU WANT IT. or as Laz suggests, quits.

How about HT gives you your own arena to play in (invitation only) then you don't have to slum it with us others?

[SlapShot]

Originally posted by Kev367th
Hmm persuade - "To induce to undertake a course of action or embrace a point of view by means of argument, reasoning, or entreaty"

Persuade my ****, it's limiting choices YET AGAIN.

Guess you won't be happy till everyone either plays the game the way YOU WANT IT. or as Laz suggests, quits.

How about HT gives you your own arena to play in (invitation only) then you don't have to slum it with us others?

Please point out how its limiting choices YET AGAIN.

Currently when an arena is MAXed out ... you have no choice ... with this you do at least have a choice ... it may not be the one you want, but nevertheless it's still a choice, and when taken, it would also help balance an arena.

It's a choice that I believe that alot of people would like to have at the moment, because currently they don't have a choice. Arena MAXed ... no soup for you.

If you and all the others that all those who are holding their collective breaths and turning blue thinking that HT will undo what is done ... it ain't gonna happen.

Yeah ... it's all the BKs fault ... HT is easily led by the nose ... I can tell that you have never met with and talked to HT.

Thanks for your constructive input tho.

[Masherbrum]

Originally posted by Kev367th
Hmm persuade - "To induce to undertake a course of action or embrace a point of view by means of argument, reasoning, or entreaty"

Persuade my ****, it's limiting choices YET AGAIN.

Guess you won't be happy till everyone either plays the game the way YOU WANT IT. or as Laz suggests, quits.

How about HT gives you your own arena to play in (invitation only) then you don't have to slum it with us others?

You really should stop yer grousing and just give it a rest.

[DaPup]

Personally I think it takes care of 2 problems of mine right off the bat, the inability to fly in the arena of my choice and the small cap numbers.

How couldn't this only benefit everyone. It balances the arena, which HTC wants, and allows me to fly in the arena of choice, which I want. This has nothing to do with squads which is a issue I don't have so I don't see it as really limiting anything more than what is limited now.

What will happen friday and saturday night in the LW? It will max out and there will be 25-50 people in LW2, this could alleviate that problem. As arena numbers fluctuate you could always relog into the side your squad is on..

[SlapShot]

As arena numbers fluctuate you could always relog into the side your squad is on..

Even simpler ... once inside the arena and once your 1 hour time limit is up ... you dont have to log, you just switch sides.

[DaPup]

Originally posted by SlapShot

Even simpler ... once inside the arena and once your 1 hour time limit is up ... you dont have to log, you just switch sides.

lol, I forgot you change in o' club

But you get the idea, numbers will change constantly and offer opportunities for everyone, after an hour, to go to another side to find friends, squaddies or just to jump into the lower players country.

[hubsonfire]

Yeah, exactly. Once you meet a few criteria, you're turned loose. Numbers get to close, someone moves to another side to wing up with friends, this creates an opening for someone else to do the same, etc. after a while, chances are you'll know most of the folks in your time slot, still get to fly with your group, or lone wolf, or whatever. Everybody gives something, and they get the same in return. Sounds awful, eh?