ace pilots

[Clifra Jones]

After a gozillion posts on this subject, an audio clip of HT explaining it at the convention and I bet not 10% of AH players understand the collision model.

I haven't counted but I bet the % is less than that in this thread.

Bronk, very good explanations but you are wasting your time. Some don't get it and I believe that some don't want to get it.

[Bronk]

Originally posted by Clifra Jones


Bronk, very good explanations but you are wasting your time. Some don't get it and I believe that some don't want to get it.

Thank you. I have to try, as it is one of my pet peeves.
I wish someone with more talent than me would do a wmv side by side of those 2 films.

Bronk

[hubsonfire]

There's been film, discussions, lectures, illustrations, a chunk of the actual code, and not one single screenshot or film (at least that I've seen) that shows the collision model working differently than has been described, and yet people still refuse to believe it works consistently, and as intended.

Ain't thata hoot?

[sax]

Originally posted by LTARghst
Is it me or is ther a major influx of people getting rammed more lately due to the fact of a large number of Noobs. Was defending a base yesterday and was rammed many times. These were guys never heard of so figured NOOBS. Was rammed by the same guy 3 times at one base. This Noob made it an effort to pull up into me everytime I broke off. Started spraying 2 out. Is it just me?

Thank 's be to what ever powers that none of us so called vet's came to this game noob's .
And if they really bother you just get SR to spanh em in the DA .

Sax owns TW9 .

[Simaril]

Whole premise invalid.

There has not "been" an increase in rams. I havent seen a collsion in weeks....unless its one that I let happen by getting too close.

Just a thought for those who A) Don't believe the explanations, and 2) think the "collision model is screwy."

This is a simulation. For a month, try flying AS IF you really were in a metal airplane, and that you would die if you ran into something. In real life, that would mean you didnt cut it close, because you wouldnt want your airplane to hit the other metal things in the sky. After all, you never knwo what the other lunatics on the road are going to do, so you give them some margin of error when driving..right?

You will find that magically "all those other ace pilots" stop "ramming you."


BTW, for those who are honestly trying to understand the thing -- don't get confused between "whose fault" the ram, is, and whose "front end" saw the ram happened.

Regardless of who could have avoided the accident last, all that matters is who's computer saw the planes intersect. SO if HE pulled up into YOU based on what YOUR COMPUTER saw, then "you collided" with him. OTOH, if he pulled up to avoid you on his front end, he may have missed completely and should not be punished for your inability to stay safe.

[Booz]

Originally posted by Blagard
So how is "fault" determined?

 

  Fault always lies with the pilot of your plane. It's your job to avoid contact with all objects in the air - Bullets, bombs, rockets and planes included.

[Simaril]

Originally posted by Booz
Fault always lies with the pilot of your plane. It's your job to avoid contact with all objects in the air - Bullets, bombs, rockets and planes included.

Sig material, sir!

[FBplmmr]

the bullets ram me:(

[Wannab]

To HO or NOT to HO..... that is the question

Ho shots to me are a matter of need....
if you get where im goin here.
if im out numbered 5v1 i garantee the first front end i see is getting nailed
if im protecting a squady i will ho
my personal favorite is the RUN HOer
you know that guy that extends 2+k then turns in full speed
after maybe one or two HO passes ill shoot back

once again you may see the need here
LTAR's are a class act squad
if they are hoin its usually out of need
and once again the old arguement comes up
its there money

On the ramming subject it happens
both parties fault for not avoiding even when you avoid there is no garantee you will get away from the RAMMER
but it happens deal with it move on

thats just my 2 cents

[Bronk]

Originally posted by Wannab
To HO or NOT to HO..... that is the question


On the ramming subject it happens
both parties fault for not avoiding even when you avoid there is no garantee you will get away from the RAMMER
but it happens deal with it move on

thats just my 2 cents

Bzzzzzzzt wrong
look at films i posted.

Bronk

[GooseAW]

Originally posted by Bronk
You my friend have just proven you are the one with "no clue".
Let me clue you in. Collisions are detected client side, that is to say on your pc.
So what you see is what you get. After a collision has been detected 2 things happen.
1. Orange text telling you a collision occurred. Orange
2. Your front end sends a private text to the player you collided with. White

I'll see if can find the films I posted before and repost here.


Bronk

Actually, oh mighty chief too much time on hands, I am far from clueless. I am however far from a techie. So I therefore do not understand nor particularly care to understand how it all works. What I do care about is what I see on my "front end" as you put it. What I see in the instances I am referring to is a player who can't get my six, so he  goes all out to RAMM me. Orange or white, I've had em both but in every instance I am trying to avoid the HO/RAMM and watch the tard pull wildly into me.

I guess your point is that these others are not seeing it as I do which would possibly remove the blame from them. if that's the case then the techies need to fix it. Personnally I rarely get rammed but that one instance where the same guy rammed me and several others several times is highly annoying. Perhaps with your expertise you can help HTC fix this issue.... It seems to me that in a ramm only the eye can say who rammed who, so how can the system say who gets orange and who gets white. If I'm flyin straight and level and the enemy flies straight up my 6 and through me, and I get the "orange text", are you going to say I rammed him?

I don't care to get in a pissing match with you or any others over this and don't have the time to do so, or to do the research to have a war of words.
All I think most posters here care about is what they see...

[Bronk]

Goose DL those 2 very short films.

You can then see why the orange text player is the one at fault.

Fault being not maintaining enough separation.

There is NO issue with the collision model.
There are people who are ignorant on how it works.
I can't help educate those on how it works if they're not  willing to learn.

As far as what you "see" is exactly that.
You see your plane touching another you hit.
On the other guys he be much farther away.


Bronk

[Lusche]

Originally posted by GooseAW
int is that these others are not seeing it as I do which would possibly remove the blame from them. if that's the case then the techies need to fix it.

You can't "fix" that. Internet signals can't be faster than speed of light. And the numerous processing instances between you and your enemies computer add some time to that lag.

To intentionally RAM you, an enemy must must head to a specific EMPTY point in air (on HIS Front End) where he thinks YOUR plane and HIS "target drone" collide on YOUR  front end.
As nobody knows how big the combined lag is, nobody really knows what the other is seeing on his respective front end.

[E25280]

Originally posted by GooseAW
Perhaps with your expertise you can help HTC fix this issue.... It seems to me that in a ramm only the eye can say who rammed who, so how can the system say who gets orange and who gets white. If I'm flyin straight and level and the enemy flies straight up my 6 and through me, and I get the "orange text", are you going to say I rammed him?

You are operating under several false assumptions, the biggest of which is that there is an "issue" to begin with.  There is not.

There is no "eye" who determines who hit who.  This is not BF1942 where everyone is essentially logged onto one server where all the action resides.  AH resides entirely on the client's PCs, not the server.  

The server is essentially only a data transfer point.  It acts as the hub through which all the PCs send everyone elses PCs their positional data.  So, when a collision happens, it is because your PC detected that your plane's position and the position of the other plane have intersected.  I repeat, YOUR PC DECIDES IF THERE IS A COLLISION -- NOT THE HTC SERVER.

There is no "Rammer" and "Rammee" in the code.  There is only the detection of two objects occupying the same point in space.  You either collide, or you don't.  Fault has nothing to do with it.  Who was flying straight and who was turning has nothing to do with it.  There is only the fact that YOUR PC says your plane was in the same position as another object.

Due to internet lag, the other guy, playing the game on HIS PC, with his own SEPARATE reality, will see your relative positions a little differently.  Bronk's films, if you bother to look at them, demonstrate this quite clearly.

And guess what?  I am not a techie either.  If I can understand this, anyone can.


: Get over this stupid nonsense about people intentionally ramming someone else.  Guess what -- if he intentionally tries to ram you, unless it is from dead-bang head on, chances are he will collide and you will not.  If you doubt it, get with a buddy and go to the DA and try to intentionally ram one another.  I think you would be surprised.

[Bronk]

Originally posted by E25280
SNIP

Dang, even a mud crawler gets it.

LTARget.

Bronk