Depleted Uranium...

[WhiteHawk]

Man, stumbled upon a website that happen to equate depleted uranuim shells with that of a dirty bomb??  Except it maims friend and foe alike.  Anybody know anything about this stuff?  Military peopel who work around or with this?  I know quite a few Gulf war vets and all of them seem fine but is this what this gulf war syndrome is?

[Nilsen]

DU rounds have been banned in many countries as they are indeed very dangerous if you get hit by them.

J/K. There should be plenty of reading out there if you are indeed interested, just dont count on alot of people beeing against them in here. Just like anti-personel mines and cluster bombs there are many nations who refuse to use them because of the problems they cause on the battlefield AFTER the fight is over.

[Fishu]

After the first gulf war iraqis living in the areas of combat suffered from increased cancer and birth defect rates. DU rounds are mainly suspected to be the cause.

Depleted or not, it's still uranium.

Mines and cluster munitions are a lesser risk because those doesn't contaminate the air and can be disarmed and contained easier than contamination. Mines can be also used rather safely when used considerately. Most problems by mines are caused in the areas where those are scattered all around randomly.

For example in the WWII germans didn't just lay mines whenever they felt like so. Germans marked minefields on the maps and they had a set of different patterns for their minefields which could be identified after finding couple of mines. None of this is practiced in the countries which suffers from mines, which leads to all the negativity towards mines.

So, yes...  DU and mines are two different animals.

[Mr No Name]

Moral of the story: (also applies to cluster munitions) Dont tick off countries that use these weapons.

[Blooz]

I'd attribute the cancer and birth defects to the burning oil wells alot faster than DU ammo. Breathing all that sooty oil smoke didn't do anyone any good.

The problem with DU is that the hulks of vehicles destroyed with this ammo have uranium dust in them.

It's the same danger that you'd have if you breathed powdered lead, aluminum or any other metal you'd care to name.

The people working with the destroyed vehicles just need to protect themselves from the dust.

[Xargos]

Do the pilots of the A-10s breath any of the air from their 30mm?

[Hornet33]

Many of the Gulf War vets that have had medical problems spent allot of time up in the oil fires in Kuwait. I know because I'm one of them. While I was lucky and only spent a few days up in that hell hole, I have had some medical problems ever since. The first couple of months after I returned to the states, I was coughing up black tar out of my lungs every morning and would have a hard time breathing after one of these coughing fits. Yes I was a smoker but I was 19 years old at the time and had only been smoking on and off for a few years. What I was experiancing was not normal.

I have also had unexplained skin rashes on and off over the years. My hair started going grey right after I returned. I've had blood presure and heart problems. I had a heart attack at the age of 30. I'm 35 now and I'm going through the process of being medicaly retired from the military with 100% disability. I can no longer pass a physical to remain on active duty. I contribute many of my symptoms to serving over there because I do work out and try to stay in decent physical condition but it gets harder all the time.

My kids have also had medical problems. Nothing real serious, thank God, but when I'm laying awake in the middle of the night I wonder if it's just one of those things or if I might have passed something on to my kids.

The scary thing is, I know I'll be lucky if I'm still alive 10 years from now. At 35, contemplating your own death is kinda messed up.

The point of all this is that while people like to point fingers at DU rounds being used, and the higher cancer rates and stuff, no one wants to look at the enviromental impact all those fires had. There were days when the wind wasn't blowing and the smoke hung so thick over the area you had to turn on the headlights on the vehicles in the middle of the day because it was so dark. You couldn't see more than 20 feet at noon because of the smoke. How many toxins where put into the air and ground during that time. Those fires burned for months spewing toxins all over the area. Toxins that have been proven to cause cancer and those toxins don't just go away when the fire is put out. Take a look at the health of the fire fighters that went over to put them out. A very large percentage have the same symptoms as the soilders do. Is that a coincedence? I doubt it.

The amount of DU ammo used in the Gulf War can't account for the numbers of people that have fallen ill since that time. The toxins released by those fires can.

[dmf]

I have a friend who's husband was in Desert Storm and she said that along with everything else, he never sleeps anymore, she said when he does sleep he wakes up screaming. I think he did Bosnia and that stuff too.

[Xargos]

I think my Father worked for the NSA, he will wake up screaming, even today.

P.S.  Him and I get along today, but he won't talk much about the past to me.

[tedrbr]

Iraq sites can often be contaminated by depleted uranium from Desert Storm and the Iraq War.

DU used in AP ammunition, as well as penetrating bombs (used against buildings and bunkers for example).  Saddam had a lot of NATO munitions from the Iraq-Iran war in those bunkers we blew up as well, some of which probably had DU.

American G.I.s told to stay out of burnt out Iraqi armor in Iraq, but either to get their glory pics taken, collect souvenirs, or (in my case) trying to salvage some armor or blister shields to use in up-armoring our own soft-sided vehicles for use in-country, soldiers get exposed to DU residue.

Also, many buildings were hit in Iraq with what were probably DU tiped bombs.  The Ministry of Information is one I can think of.  My Heavy Search and Rescue Team (one of many jobs) trained in bombed out buildings like these... as part of our mission was to enter bombed out structures to look for survivors, sensitive documents and equipment if necessary, if insurgents started to drop buildings around Baghdad.   Shoring, blocking, & bracing of compromised structures, work in confined spaces, patient packaging and extraction, and rope work.  

This put us in contact with DU residue as well.  Some units have reoccupied many of these bombed out shells, braced them, and turned them into working and living areas.  This also exposes soldiers to DU.

Never heard of any thorough surveys being done as the how wide spread DU residue exposure actually is in country.  Or of any testing of soldiers, living and working areas, or equipment for contamination to DU (among other hazards).

[Blooz]

Xargos says "Do the pilots of the A-10s breath any of the air from their 30mm?"

The problem with DU happens after the projectile hits a target. The penetrator itself is not radioactive but it is a heavy metal. When this metal is disintegrated into dust after striking the target the powdered uranium dust is dangerous if inhaled.

The precautions are the same in any dusty environment. Masks, suits , gloves are used for protection.

The people I worry about are those that were at ground zero on 9-11. The dust they inhaled was powdered concrete which is basically like inhaling powdered glass.

[Xargos]

We have so much to learn as humans.

[Hap]

Originally posted by Xargos
We have so much to learn as humans.

Ditto big time.

[dmf]

Somebody correct me if I'm wrong but isn't uranium radioactive?

[Xargos]

It's a heavy metal and a poison.

P.S.  I have slight lead poisoning and it effects my reaction time down.