Raptor undecided...

[EsX_Raptor]

Alright guys, this is my problem: I've been flying AH on a Spitfire Mk VIII ever since I read it was a good plane for dweebs. Now the thing is, I can see that I'm greatly improving in it and I find it comfortable to fly compared to other planes. But then it comes to my mind that I don't like the Spit 8 that much, I don't even like British planes, any. I'm 100% in the Luftwaffe vice and I can't get out of it. It seems like in every WWII based game I've been playing as German (Axis), I hate Allies. So I tried to fly the Bf 109K-4 because it really appealed to me (and after reading it's performance and comments on it) But sincerely, I can't do anything on it. It has a very small cockpit view (try to fly on it when your engine oil has been hit) and it has a nose gun (don't like it), it is not as maneuverable and very fast. I haven't tried any other German planes, I prefer to get some advice from you all because I always get discouraged by a lot of people, example: I say, 'wow! I like this X plane' and they go 'it's a piece of crap, gun with wings, etc, etc, etc.' so then I go 'I now like this Y plane' and the same thing happens. It is mostly because many people there are just total dweebs and hate to talk about planes they don't like so I preferibly will post this here and at least get some accurate comments on a plane I'd like to fly.
Ok,
I've heard that the FW 190 are really good planes to fly, but there are some models and I really dunno which one's mostly similar to what I've been flying; a Spit 8. I also don't like either nose mounted guns, just don't. And I thought the Bf 109K-4 was going to be my choice =[ Sigh
Don't forget you can give me encouragement to use some of the German models you find acceptable (Fighters plz =])
That's pretty much it, I hope to get any help on this..
Thank you very much!

-Raptor:aok

EDIT: Btw, I hate energy fighters too.. but love planes with high roll and maybe turn rate.

[LancerVT]

if youre interested in the 190's and have been flying the spit8, try out the 190a5. lightest and most nimble of the 190s. 2 20mm in the wings with 2 7.9 mgs in the cowl. Don't take the 2 extra 20mm. They are the 20 MG-FF, which is an older design and  has inferior ballistics to the 20 MG 151/20. The german 20mms take some getting used to but they get the job done.

[EsX_Raptor]

Awesome! A light and nimble German fighter =D... I will surely give a try to the FW 190A-5. So do you say I should take the 2 20mm and the 2 7.9 mgs for ballistic reasons in the other two extra 20mm... cc... I will do that =]
Thanks!

EDIT: Also, what you all think about the FW 190A-8?

[68slayr]

A8 has one of the largest gun packages...it is like flying a rock in a turn fight and doesnt hold E very well.  i would ssay D9 or A5 for you.  I would also look at the 109G14

[EsX_Raptor]

Thanks for the info on the FW 190A-8, I thought it could be a very slow plane due to the high speed it has at any alt. Though they say it has a good roll rate but it's mostly an E fighter (big no! for me lol)
What guns package would you reccomend for the Bf 109G-14?

Package 1
1) 20 mm MG 151/20 150 rpg
2) 13 mm MG 131 300 rpg
Package 2
1) 30 mm MK 108 65 rpg
2) 13 mm MG 131 300 rpg

I would go for the first one, but not sure.

What's good about the FW 190D-9? I see it is a good high alt fighter.

Thanks!

EDIT: Is the Bf 109K-4 a bad plane for me overall?

[The Fugitive]

The 190 series is pretty much all BnZ/ energy fighters. Yes the A5 is the most "nimble" of the bunch, but its still a nimble brick.  

The 109's might not be as fast as the 190s, but they are much better at turning. The G2, and F4 are a lot of fun to fly, pretty nimble, climb well, accelerate very well.

The cowl mount guns may not have been your problem. If you had loaded up the  30 mm cannon on the K4 that may have been the problem. Using that is like lobbing potatoes at the planes. It take a while to learn how to shoot that gun, of course once you figure it out one hit with it can kill quite well

All planes have their hidden talents, and there problems. Taking the time to try them.... and I mean flying them for a few weeks to learn them.... can be fun, and help you find the plane you want to fly. I love the 38 and spend most of my time in it, but I still try other planes.

[Spatula]

Try the 109G-2. Still wont turn quite as well as a spit 8, but close enough to make it a close fight (espc when you get the flaps out). The G2 turns better than any 190, accelerates better, climbs better and is slightly faster on WEP (slower on MIL below 6k). The G2 is faster than the spit 8, and is closely matched on climb rate. The WEP lasts forever on the 109s, so it has an advantage over the spit there too.
The G2 would be a good plane to use as a spring-board to the K4. The G2 is better all-round slightly than the G6, the G14 is also a good option, but once WEP is used up, its the worse the 109 to be in and the frontal-view is slightly worse.
Only real short-comming is that it only has one 20mm nose-mounted cannon, where the 190s and spits have better guns. But a nose-mounted cannon doesn't suffer the same convergence problems wing-mounted guns do, so its a better technical solution. The single 20mm can in the 109G2 is more than good enough to dismiss your enemies - you may take some time to get to grips with its trajectory, ROF, and muzzle velocity as the all impact deflection shooting.

[Dichotomy]

If you get a chance to talk to Storch he's an assassin in German Iron

[Vudak]

I'd have to agree with Spatula and Fugitive on the G2.  It was my bird of choice for a good six months or so and definately gives you plenty of options.

You mentioned you don't like nose-mounted guns, but I wonder if part of your problem was that you were flying the K4, which uses the 30mm.  Though extremely potent, it's a real pain to learn to aim well (though some of the best sticks in this game certainly favor it).

The G2's 20mm, though lacking the same punch, has better ballistics than the 30mm, and you'll likely get more hits.

Of course, the problem with the G2 is that you'd better make those hits count.  I'd generally aim for the centerline of the plane and found that I'd get many kills by knocking off the tailfeathers of various aircraft.  If you can figure out how to do that on purpose, you're golden

[TUXC]

Try the other 109s besides the K for a while. 2 tips: get really close before firing, and be careful when diving fast. 109s tend to go into "lawn dart mode" when over 480mph. Start out using the one nose-mounted 20mm at first. The 30mm cannon takes a while to get used to but it's a one shot killer against fighters. Gondolas are good against bombers but ruin your maneuverability against other fighters.

If you ever fly knights and are looking for people to fly German planes with then check channel 115 and see if anyone in II/JG11 is on. We almost exclusively fly Luftwaffe machines.

[BaldEagl]

I love the 190's.  All of them.  They are best at the B'n'Z game though.  Here's a little rundown:

190A5 - Best turning, best climbing
190A8 - Biggest gun package, good for buff hunting
190D9 - Fastest.  Period.
190F8 - Best for ground assult but a nice diversion for air-to-air.
Ta153H - One of the fastest planes in the air over 25K.  Good for high alt hunting.

I always take the biggest gun package available.  Keep them fast, keep turns to a minimum and use their superior roll rate to get you out of trouble.

Now, if you want something similar to the Spit VIII try the 109F4.  It will turn as well as any of the Spits except maybe the Spit V.  The G2 is a close second.  It will go turn for turn with a Spit XVI.  Speed and climb rates are good in either but you need to be careful diving as they compress sooner than the Spits and, as mentioned above, the ballistics on the German planes aren't as good as the Hispanos in the Spits so get used to aiming a little high.

Oh, and if you're flying a 109 don't take the gondolas.  They just add drag and you don't need them.

[Soulyss]

AH has a long slow learning curve... I've been playing for what.... going on 8 years now and I'm still learning.  With that kind of road ahead for the dedicated player I've found that it helps to have the gameplay rooted in something outside of AH.  For myself AH has followed my own historical interests.  When I started I was really interested in the P-51 having read some pilot memoirs, I realized quickly that I was going to take my lumps regardless of what I flew so I spent my time trying to replicate the exploits I read about so often.  After awhile I started to find myself interested more in more in the pacific theater and the carrier battles @ coral sea, midway, and the cv raids on rabual, truk, etc.  So I picked up the hellcat and learned a whole new aspect to the game.  Now I've gotten the USAAF bug again and have been teaching myself about the south pacific and the P-40's and P-38's that protected Port Moresby and then took the fight up to Japan's backdoor.  

My long winded point being.. if you're a fan of the Luftwaffe planes I suggest you stick it out and learn one of them.  It will be an adjustment from what you're used to and you'll get shot down.  But find one that matches your own brand of flying and stick with it.  As others have suggested if you like the flying of the spitfire, I'd start with the 109F4 or 109G2.  The gunnery will come in time as you get used to the new ballistics.  

Anyway just my .02

[EsX_Raptor]

The Fugitive
I tried all of the FW 190's and they weren't as I expected; it's true they have a very, very good roll rate and acceleration, but the biggest problem is, as you say, they turn like bricks and worst of all, when turning like that they bleed E fast! I haven't tried any of the other Bf 109's yet but by what I see, I think I'm going to give a try to the G-2 and F-4. About the cowl mounted guns, yes that was exactly my problem. It's really difficult to shoot with them but they are ineed very powerful.

Spatula
I didn't know the WEP lasted forever on the 109's =O
I realize that yea, nose cannons don't have the same convergence problems as wing mounted ones do, that's an advantage right there!

Dichotomy
Storch? I'd be glad to ever see any Luftwaffe pro pilot

Vudak
So the G-2, that's the first plane I'm going to give a try to =] then I'll give a try to the F-4 and see what I like best!
About the 30mm, yea I'm pretty sure it was that the gun is really difficult to aim and since I'm a newbie at the game, I think I'll go for the lower caliber ones first and then when I'm pretty much used to it, I'll give a try to the K-4 once again.
The centerline! I never aimed for the centerline of a plane ever since all of these people in the MA told me that shooting at their wings was the best option and I got stuck to that principle. I'll follow your concept and do that and see what can I do! =D

TUXC
Oh yea!! I've 100% noticed that and that was one of the things that made me quit the K-4! The 109's get really UN-maneuverable as their speed increases. I've mounted the Gandolas onto my plane but dunno if they're alright.

I always fly Rooks, maybe because it is the default country but I don't know. If you say Luftwaffe pilots hang around there, then I'll surely be there! But now, (a very dweebish question) how do you turn into a channel? x__X

Bald Eagl
So aiming a little higher? Thank you very much for that comment! Now I'll have that in mind next time I go into a fight
I knew it, don't take the Gondolas, if they decrease maneuverability, then I won't use them.

Soulyss
Thank you very much for your comment Soulyss! I'm indeed a 100% Luftwaffe fan and will do anything to fly one of their planes.

[Vudak]

Whoa whoa whoa whoa now don't go taking aim advice from ME of all people lol.  That's just what I do.  I will say, however, that it makes sense to me to aim for the centerline because you have a chance of:

1.  Crippling the engine
2.  Putting oil all over their windscreen
3.  Wounding or Killing the pilot
4.  Knocking off the tail or feathers.

Also it helps because most good pilots will do their best to provide you with the smallest shot possible whenever they cross your nose.  Aiming for the wing in such a situation means missing the shot.

One more thing - 109s WEP doesn't last forever IIRC...  But it does last so much longer than other planes that it might as well.

[Engine]

Originally posted by EsX_Raptor
Thanks for the info on the FW 190A-8, I thought it could be a very slow plane due to the high speed it has at any alt. Though they say it has a good roll rate but it's mostly an E fighter (big no! for me lol)

I think you'll find that most of the Luftwaffe planes we have are primarily energy fighters, due to one characteristic or another. Lowspeed handling in the 190s is not well-suited to turnfighting.