Now I feel sorry for her

[SteveBailey]

Originally posted by Curval
Quoted again for the politicos who just seem upset that she criticised Bush.

Grandstanding BS.  She has a right to criticize Bush.   I criticize Bush.  I don't call Bush a lying Bastard, I didn't say our country was waging the war of terrrorism on the world.  Other irresponsible things Sheehan said:

‘This country is not worth dying for.’

"Is there anyone in America who cannot yet see that Donald Runsfeld is a liar…that he, as with Hitler and Stalin….will say anything so long as he thinks it will help shape the world to his own liking? Is there even one, sane adult among us who cannot see that Donald Rumsfeld is a threat to our nation’s security and to peace on our beloved earth?"


"Our country has been overtaken by murderous thugs..."

[Guppy35]

Originally posted by SteveBailey
Grandstanding BS.  She has a right to criticize Bush.   I criticize Bush.  I don't call Bush a lying Bastard, I didn't say our country was waging the war of terrrorism on the world.  Other irresponsible things Sheehan said:

‘This country is not worth dying for.’

"Is there anyone in America who cannot yet see that Donald Runsfeld is a liar…that he, as with Hitler and Stalin….will say anything so long as he thinks it will help shape the world to his own liking? Is there even one, sane adult among us who cannot see that Donald Rumsfeld is a threat to our nation’s security and to peace on our beloved earth?"


"Our country has been overtaken by murderous thugs..."

Did you read what I wrote Steve?

Did she get used for political purposes?  Sure.  A desperate mom, lashing out at anyone she can find to blame for the death of her son.  Again, trust me on this, you go a little crazy after a loss like that.  And again, you reach a point where you figure out that no matter what you do, you can't bring your kid back.

And it sucks.

Problem is, her grief got played out on a public stage.  I think about some of the stuff I did, hoping, praying that my kids would somehow show up again and if it was played out for everyone to see, they'd think I am crazy.  What some of the other parents I know who've lost kids have done would make you think the same.

It is not a rational thing to deal with.  There is no set path through grief and there is no set end time.

As near as I can tell, her efforts did little other then to give folks without a clue to her pain, a reason to ***** about her.  

Seperate the politics from the grief and cut the lady some slack.  

And then try and imagine dealing with the loss of one of those beautiful little girls you've got Steve.  And then multiply it by a million as there is no way to know until you are there.  And you wouldn't wish for anyone to be there with you.

[Captain Virgil Hilts]

I sympathized with her right up until she began make a spectacle and a sad celebrity of herself. It has nothing to do with politics. I know many people who lost children, none of them has made a public spectacle of themselves, nor turned themselves into celebrities over it. Even if you look at people like the Petty family, who were celebrities to begin with, or the Walshes, who were not, none of them behaved in the bizarre and disgusting manner Cindy Sheehan did. When you pose for a magazine, dressed in lycra/spandex tights, lying face down  on your child's grave, you are not grieving, you are sick, very sick. That's not the action of a grieving parent, but rather the actions of a wacko whose loss of their child just tripped their trigger. She's done nothing at all positive with her grief, and she's still looking to cash in.

SHE made the decision to play her grief out on the public stage. SHE thrived on the attention, the money, and the spectacle. Yes, it is a terrible thing that her son was killed. But it is even more terrible that she made a sick, twisted, public spectacle of her grief. I do not think we've seen the last of her, as much as I would like to hope that she might recover and grasp reality, and hopefully find some peace and healing. I just don't think that's what she wants.

[Guppy35]

Originally posted by Captain Virgil Hilts
I sympathized with her right up until she began make a spectacle and a sad celebrity of herself. It has nothing to do with politics. I know many people who lost children, none of them has made a public spectacle of themselves, nor turned themselves into celebrities over it. Even if you look at people like the Petty family, who were celebrities to begin with, or the Walshes, who were not, none of them behaved in the bizarre and disgusting manner Cindy Sheehan did. When you pose for a magazine, dressed in lycra/spandex tights, lying face down  on your child's grave, you are not grieving, you are sick, very sick. That's not the action of a grieving parent, but rather the actions of a wacko whose loss of their child just tripped their trigger. She's done nothing at all positive with her grief, and she's still looking to cash in.

But I do know folks who've gone that route and it is desperation.  There's a gal here that lost three of her daughters.  She's made a career out of speaking about how they 'married Jesus" that day and that God did it to her because she was strong enough to handle it, blah, blah blah.  No thought to what those three girls might have wanted out of their lives and so on.

It's how she's found some sort of peace with it.  To me it's grandstanding and I don't get it.  But all it took was one conversation with her.  She called us shortly after we lost our two.  I guess being in the multiple dead kid crowd made us special.  She spent the entire time talking about her kids.

And that's the key.  You are desperate not to have your kids disappear.  For her and for Sheehan, a part of that public act is that piece of it.  If you talk about it enough, your kid doesn't disappear.

I rarely bring it up, and when I do i feel a bit guilty, but it's usually when i feel like I need to make a point and the, for lack of a better word, 'power' of that experience lends some credibilty to what I say.

In general I think most of us who've lost kids, don't talk about it though, because it makes people uncomfortable, and we're supposed to 'get over it' in time.

And yeah I suppose she's a whacko, but then again most of us are who've lost our kids.  Because there is no sane way to deal with it.

[SteveBailey]

Originally posted by Guppy35
Did you read what I wrote Steve?

 

Yes and I was mostly responding to Curval.  I cannot pretend to understand how she feels about the loss of her son and frankly, hope I never do understand.

When she first began protesting the war and bought the property in Crawford I thought, " She has a right to protest the war and,  although I think she is a little odd, we have to cut her some slack because she is a grieving mom.  God grant her peace."

I figured that as time went on, and she went thru her grieving process, that she would become a voice for the anti-war crowd, which i again recognized as being her right.

As time went on, however, she became more and more vociferous, her comments more outrageous, more irresponsible.  It was then that I ceased excusing away her behavior as a grieving mom. To me, she began to appear more of an opportunist. As her comments grew into rabid attacks more than anything else, I lost any feelings for her beyond thinking she is a mother who lost a son and  an opportunistic nutjob.

[VOR]

She was caught on the emotional rebound by her political puppeteers after the tragic death of her son, and when she called on them to hold up their end of the bargain she got a cold dose of political reality. That's all that happened. She's only just realized how she's been used.

[Yeager]

Guppy, take a deep breath, read it again, and realize that I do not have to be a parent of dead children to be deeply appreciative of the sacrifice of our soldiers in battle.

"Her son died serving our country and that says it all for me. He died in service of every american, and there is a an infinite amount of value in that, at least in my reasoning."

Tell me, should Memorial day be only for those who have lost loved ones in war, or should it be for every one of us to reflect and appreciate the sacrifice?

I stand by my statement, it reflects who I am, how I was raised.  If you dont like it, fine by me, but do not presume for a moment that you have some gifted position in this life to inform me as to whether I have a clue about tragic loss or not.

p'fff.....

[Phaser11]

Who was she?

[rpm]

"Casey died for a country which cares more about who will be the next American Idol than how many people will be killed in the next few months while Democrats and Republicans play politics with human lives."

Spot on.

[AAolds]

I did not agree with her position and certainly did not like some of the company she choose to keep.  She did make some valid points in her "resignation" letter.  May she find some kind of peace in her life, she has certainly used any goodwill the pubic at large has or had for her.  Personally, I'm not surprised to see that the left dropped her like a hot potato.  She pawned herself out to make a statement and get attention.  I hope she got what she bargained for because from now on she will never shake her reputation.

[Guppy35]

Originally posted by Yeager
Guppy, take a deep breath, read it again, and realize that I do not have to be a parent of dead children to be deeply appreciative of the sacrifice of our soldiers in battle.

"Her son died serving our country and that says it all for me. He died in service of every american, and there is a an infinite amount of value in that, at least in my reasoning."

Tell me, should Memorial day be only for those who have lost loved ones in war, or should it be for every one of us to reflect and appreciate the sacrifice?

I stand by my statement, it reflects who I am, how I was raised.  If you dont like it, fine by me, but do not presume for a moment that you have some gifted position in this life to inform me as to whether I have a clue about tragic loss or not.

p'fff.....

Your belief on it is your own, and as one who has spent much of his adult life honoring vets, and trying to help families of those who lost sons in WW2 come to terms with it, I understand your point of view.

I was responding to the way you dismissed her belief and by asking have you lost a son, I was trying to point out how that belief system is forever changed

Her beliefs are just as valid is yours is my point.

Go here:

http://www.worldwar2pilots.com/b24intro.htm

I wrote this 9 years ago for a memorial day to remember Al Brody, the guy in my avatar.   This was 7 years before I lost my own kids.  I stand by what I wrote.  I think you'll find I have a fairly decent understanding of what it means.

[Yeager]

copy that

[Tango]

Near the end of his tour of duty, the U.S. invasion of Iraq began. Sheehan re-enlisted, knowing that his unit would be sent to Iraq[4]. Sheehan's division, the First Cavalry Division, was sent to Iraq. On March 19, 2004, Sheehan's unit, C Battery, 1st Battalion, 82nd Field Artillery Regiment arrived at FOB War Eagle in Sadr City. Just a few weeks later, on April 4, 2004, Sheehan was killed in action after volunteering as part of a Quick Reaction Force to rescue American troops.

Looks to me like she didn't respect his decision to be over there. Probably a good reason why her husband divorced her as well.

[Guppy35]

Originally posted by Tango
Near the end of his tour of duty, the U.S. invasion of Iraq began. Sheehan re-enlisted, knowing that his unit would be sent to Iraq[4]. Sheehan's division, the First Cavalry Division, was sent to Iraq. On March 19, 2004, Sheehan's unit, C Battery, 1st Battalion, 82nd Field Artillery Regiment arrived at FOB War Eagle in Sadr City. Just a few weeks later, on April 4, 2004, Sheehan was killed in action after volunteering as part of a Quick Reaction Force to rescue American troops.

Looks to me like she didn't respect his decision to be over there.

Parents can be goofy like that when it comes to their kids.  You have to trust them, but it doesn't mean it's easy.

My wife will forever question that she let our daughter go that weekend when something was telling her not to.  But we trusted our son to look after her, and I'm sure he did, right up til the car hit them.

Ask any parent out there.  The second you let them go off to a friends house, or off to school, you never quite sleep the same, because they are out of your sight and you have to trust that things will be OK.  You do it, because you'd go crazy otherwise, but sometimes it ends up with a cop at your door telling you your kids are dead.

And as I've said often this thread.  I hope you never know what it's like.  But please don't judge her too harshly.  If you knew what it was like, you'd probably be a lot slower to bash her.

[Shifty]

Originally posted by rpm
Spot on.

Agreed.