Author Topic: forget gun control... (Read 2401 times)

lazs2 · « **Reply #45 on:** July 02, 2007, 08:29:09 AM »

maybe not wearing a helmet or a seatbelt is stupid... swimming is stupid... drinking is stupid.. skydiving is stupid.

To me.. a helmet ruins the experiance of riding a motorcycle. I like to hear and see what is going on around me and have the wind in my hair. I will take the infintesimal risk that I will hurt my head.

For me... wearing the seatbelts that come with new cars ruins the experiance of a trip on the road. they are extremely annoying to me. for the thousands of hours of discomfort they cause I will take the minute little chance that I will get into any kind of a wreck where I might get more injured without em.

who enjoys air travel these days? If there were an airline and airports that operated like one 10 years ago I would still be willing to fly.

You let your wives and girlfriends drive you around... you (I say you in the broad sense... you know who you are) have never really learned how to handle a car in extreme situations... you think you can get away with smoking a little weed or drinking and driving... You are riding a motorcycle that is 100 times more capable than you are and therefore extremely dangerous in your hands.

And you say that I am stupid? I am taking much less risk than you are.

But hornet... at least you have allies... they socialists who think their government can do no wrong.. the angus's.... they think you are right.. the more government control the better. That must make you feel all warm inside I betcha.

lazs

lazs2 · « **Reply #46 on:** July 02, 2007, 08:33:12 AM »

and vor... put simply... it may not be the safest thing to do... not wearing seatbelts or helmets but it is far from "stupid high risk behavior". the chances of either of those things paying off for the thousands of hours of discomfort are minimal.

Helmets are worn by race car drivers and you have to crawl in the car over the full cage rollbar. but... it is very safe.

By your logic... not wearing a helmet in a car and a firesuit and a full cage rollbar is very stupid risky behavior.

Now they have roll control on cars so you can't corner too fast.. the idea being that people are too stupid so you need to mandate how they corner.

lazs

Jackal1 · « **Reply #47 on:** July 02, 2007, 08:36:27 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by bj229r
We had a thread or 2 like this about motorcycle helmets some time ago---the "you're an idiot and the law is for your own good" segment ganged us no-helmet types like frat boys on a drunk chick:)

Come to Texas boys.
We fight the idiotic helmet laws like they are the plague here.
We`ve been up and down and back and forth, but at the presence we have it our way.
We are , however, thinking of introducing a "No running with sharp objects" proposal for the naive and nanny dependent to occupy their mind.

lazs2 · « **Reply #48 on:** July 02, 2007, 08:43:53 AM »

yep... most of the people who are telling us that it is a small inconvienece and worth it and all that have never rode without a helmet for any length of time to compare.

They are so used to the uncomfortable 3 point seatbelt that they don't know any better. or.. they just like to tell people what to do.

It is like the people of socialist countries who have never even handled a handgun telling me that they are no good for anything but killing someone at 10'.. that you can't hit anything with one past about 10'.

They are amazed when they ever do get to shoot handguns at how accurate, fun to shoot, and well made they are... at the feeling of security they give.

I think that most of the people who like seatbelt and helmet laws are people who can't drive worth a damn... they need to wear seatbelts and helmets and...

they know it... they don't want people making fun of em for looking like a dork with a helmet on in 100+ degree weather soooo... they vote to make everyone do it.

lazs

VOR · « **Reply #49 on:** July 02, 2007, 08:56:49 AM »

I'm not trying to tell you what to do or even what to think. Live however the hell you'd like and extend the same courtesy to me. Isn't that how it should be?

lazs2 · « **Reply #50 on:** July 02, 2007, 02:15:45 PM »

yes vor.. that really is the way it is supposed to be.

lazs

lazs2 · « **Reply #51 on:** July 03, 2007, 02:20:47 PM »

but... for eagl and all the others who simply bought the insurance companies bs and soundbites...

http://www.bikersrights.com/statistics/goldstein/goldstein2.html

This is a very complete study on the effects of wearing a helmet and fatalities and serious injury.

In short.. it states that Helmet use increases neck injuries.

speed and intoxication have the most to do with fatalities no link can be found between helmet use and prevention of fatalities (survivability) despite the myths and the "it saved my life" hearsay... there is no stat that says you are more likely to survive a serious crash if you are wearing a helmet. at fatal speed an intoxication...

you are going to die... helmet or no helmet. and...

If you survive.. you are far more likely to suffer a neck injury if you were wearing a helmet than not.

at best it is a tradeoff at non fatal speeds.. you get some minor reduction in head injury with a helmet but trade off for increased neck injury.

" Past a critical impact velocity to the helmet, measured by the normal component of velocity, helmet use has a statistically significant effect which exacerbates the severity of neck injuries.

Using the point estimates in equations 5-8 and the average weight of the helmet (2.70), estimates of this critical impact speed are around 13 mph. Beyond this realistically attained critical speed the energy absorbing ability of the helmet which is capable of reducing the extension- flexsion response of the neck to head impacts are surpassed. Under these circumstances, the inertial and post-impact response of the neck are intensified due to the added mass of the helmet and neck injuries result. An impact to the head whose normal component of velocity is 20 mph will increase the severity of neck injuries by around 10. Equations 7 and 8 also reveal that marginal increases in helmet weight do not have a statistically significant effect on the severity of neck injuries. This finding along with the acceptance of the zero constraints in equations 5 and 6 imply that it is the added mass of a helmet and not its specific weight that is responsible for exacerbating neck injuries. "

but.. regardless of the controversy... the choice of any trade off in personal safety should be just that..

personal....

Read the entire study and you will see that while a helmet may be a great thing for sports like football or riding a slow bicycle.. there is no clear cut advantage on a motorcyle and any of the speeds normally operated at.

lazs

Gh0stFT · « **Reply #52 on:** July 03, 2007, 03:35:31 PM »

fatal speed my A** LOL
tell your Story Robert Kubica who survived the last
High Speed Formula 1 Crash in Canada, tell him to not wear
a Helmet because it doesent matter

wrag · « **Reply #53 on:** July 03, 2007, 03:48:33 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Gh0stFT
fatal speed my A** LOL
tell your Story Robert Kubica who survived the last
High Speed Formula 1 Crash in Canada, tell him to not wear
a Helmet because it doesent matter

Was he on a motorcycle?

Do they use the head/helmet straps in formula one like they use em in nascar?

Gh0stFT · « **Reply #54 on:** July 03, 2007, 04:00:35 PM »

wrag does it really matters, motorcycle or car?
crashes at this speed can end fatal with our without a helmet,
but a helmet can help to protect your only one brain.
Why else this GP guys:

wear one, because it just looks cool? lol

wear one or not, its your brain. I doubt the gouverment can help either here.

john9001 · « **Reply #55 on:** July 03, 2007, 04:01:19 PM »

that's called a "hans device", it was mandated after Earnhardt and other drivers had their necks broken by the heavy full face helmets.

do they have a hans device for motorcycles? One motorcycle mfg is testing air bags for motorcycles, whats next, seat belts and roll cages?

McFarland · « **Reply #56 on:** July 03, 2007, 06:58:17 PM »

That, and the helmet gives you more area to put your advertisements.

But, I know seatbelts don't save lives as much as people think, me cousin was killed by one. He believed they should be worn, (although, he also believed it was your choice), he always wore one. But, he was killed by his. In a driver's side impact, it will hold your head to the blow, instead of allowing it move away from it. If me cousin hadn't been wearing a seatbelt, he would have lived.

AKIron · « **Reply #57 on:** July 03, 2007, 07:39:13 PM »

Seatbelts do save lives, there is irrefutable evidence. They don't save everyone but they try.

McFarland · « **Reply #58 on:** July 03, 2007, 07:47:07 PM »

But they have been known to kill people as well. So it's 50/50 there, whether wearing one is safe or not. Depends on the crash.

Sandman · « **Reply #59 on:** July 03, 2007, 09:52:04 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by McFarland
But they have been known to kill people as well. So it's 50/50 there, whether wearing one is safe or not. Depends on the crash.

Source?