Illegal Alien "contributions" To The U.s.

[Ack-Ack]

Originally posted by Tango


As for the crime issue, half the crime commited here is by illegals. How do I know? I know someone who is an ICE agent.

LMAO@Tango.  Why not cite a more credible source than "I know someone.".

I have it on good authority that Oswold acted alone.  How do I know?  I know someone, who knows someone else that knows yet another person that knows a CIA agent.

ack-ack

[Tango]

Ack, my brother has been an Immgration officer for the past 15 years. He can tell you alot of stories of the crap he has to deal with. 99.9% of all the illegals they pick up have commited crimes in this country. Anything from ID theft to murder.

[MiloMorai]

So if all these illegals are sent back to where they came from, who will do the jobs they are doing for the same money?

[Trell]

100% of them have committed a crime.   They are here illegally

[Trell]

Originally posted by MiloMorai
So if all these illegals are sent back to where they came from, who will do the jobs they are doing for the same money?

We don't need the jobs done for the same amount of money.

Just because they can find someone to do your job for 3$ an hour,  does not mean it is right..

[Rolex]

Originally posted by SteveBailey
You're full of chit.  Not only do they file tax returns, many of them file returns w/ false W2's merely so they can get a refund.

They can't get a refund with a false W2 any more than you can. If they are, then that is the fault of the IRS. The ones filing using an individual taxpayer number do get a refund of overpaid taxes, just like you do.

Illegal aliens paid $7 billion in Social Security contributions and $1.5 billion in Medicare payments last year that will payout no benefits to them. Billions more were paid in federal and state income taxes. They also paid unemployment insurance, property taxes, gasoline taxes, sales taxes, road tolls, taxes on gas, cigarettes and alcohol. They bought food, electricity, water, gas, clothing, internet services, phone service, cars, etc, while providing labor and services.

Illegal aliens are not eligible for food stamps, Social Security, Medicare, unemployment, or college financial aid, but they are treated in emergency rooms, and their children get a K-12 education.

Areas near the border get the short end of the stick because they usually arrive broke and are a drain on local services. States that bear an unfair burden should be more forcefully seeking a fairer distribution of appropriation from Washington on federal programs, since it's the federal governments fault for not doing more to curtail illegal entry at the border. On a national scale, most economists will tell you their contribution vs. cost is a wash. If that were not so, why would businesses be so stridently lobbying Washington to not enact stronger anti-illegal alien laws?

Half of all felonies are committed by illegal aliens? Now that's a whopper of a fish tale. Two million people are in US prisons and jails, with the total alien prisoners equaling about 70,000. Note the italics? Alien and Illegal Aliens are not the same. Fifty percent of the total aliens incarcerated are illegal aliens. That 1.6% of the total prisoners. Americas jails and prisons are full of Americans.

Sorry for the adult tone of this post. I know unemotional reason irks the watermelon out of you.

[bj229r]

Originally posted by Hornet33
Well not sure if you guys have heard this yet or not, but I was watching CSPAN a little while ago and evidently last night congress had a vote come up that would ALLOW illegal aliens to apply for welfare, food stamps, and government housing among some other things like the free health care they already get.

Anyway the bill failed on the vote. The Democratic leadership came back after the voting was over and decided to re open the vote so they could get it to pass!!!!!! The entire republican membership walked out. I just listened to around 20 members of congress that were pissed because the democratic leadership blatantly broke the rules of the House and on their own passed a law that REWARDS illegal aliens with US citizens tax dollars.

I've been trying to find the bill online but haven't had any luck yet, but how screwed up is that????

One of the posts in here stated that Illegals DON'T receive help from the government...then WHY was this bill necessary?

Nice summary of the debacle:

Here’s how it went down. The House of Representatives, like all democratic legislatures, provides for what is called a “Motion to Recommit.” It’s one of the many minority rights built into the structure of the legislative process. Basically, a properly led majority party in the House – unlike in the Senate – can pass pretty much any bill it wants to. It can swat down minority amendments, or even disallow their introduction in the first place. In order to give minority members a semblance of dignity in such circumstances, they are usually permitted one more vote, before a major bill’s final passage, to send the bill back to committee. A good example of this would be a budget bill: Republicans don’t want to just vote against the Democrat budget, so they propose their own in the form of the motion to recommit, so at least they can have something they’re for. Now, because majority parties are in control of things and presumably have competent leadership, these procedural votes are typically formalities.


Until this year. In the seven months since the Democrats took control of Congress and, as now appears evident, elected the most incompetent speaker in American history, Republicans have passed one motion to recommit after another. They have cleverly written their motions so as to make it difficult for Democrats to cavalierly vote against them. Such was the case last night. Before the vote on the Agriculture spending bill for the next fiscal year, Republicans offered a nifty little motion to recommit so that illegal immigrants would not receive taxpayer funded government welfare. (My compliments to whoever thought that one up.)

Well, because a few of the Democrats can’t afford to have an ad in their next campaign saying he wanted to give illegal immigrants federal funds, Nancy Pelosi’s duct-taped majority sprung another leak. The motion to recommit, whose passage would scuttle the Democrats’ bill offering taxpayer benefits to illegal immigrants, was on the verge of passage, with 215 votes in favor and 213 votes opposed. Yet another ring was about to run around Pelosi and her bumbling leadership team.

Then it happened.

The presiding officer, the guy in the big chair with the gavel, was Democrat Congressman Michael McNulty, who would apparently make a compelling contestant on Are You Smarter Than a Fifth Grader?, gaveled the vote closed – repeat, closed – when it was 215 to 213. Republicans win. Except when McNulty got the tally from the Clerk and realized what happened, he and the Democrat leader conspired to “correct” their mistake, after the gavel had fallen.

Angry Republicans started asking questions, primarily one beginning with the words, “what” and “the”. Republican Leader John Boehner stood up and asked the same question, politely, and all McNulty said was that the “voting machine is down.” (The House’s electronic voting machine doesn’t just “go down”, incidentally: it was more likely turned off to hide the evidence of the crime.) A few minutes of strange rustlings over on the Democrat side of the dais ensued until finally Rep. McNulty spoke up again and said, “The Chair prematurely called the vote at 214-214 [a lie], while there were votes being entered [illegal]. After all the cards [whose?] were added, the final [illegal] vote was 212 to 216, nay. Sorry suckers, it’s Schlitz O’Clock!” (Okay, I added the last part.)

Except here’s the thing. The vote was closed. Not open. Not ajar. Closed. The rules don’t allow for McNulty’s personal problem with premature e-gavel-ation. He screwed up and cost the Democrats the vote. But in Nancy Pelosi’s America, votes only count when Democrats win: so she cheated, and bent a once-proud and honorable political party into an instrument of despotism. Jaw-dropping as it may sound, it’s not an exaggeration to say that for a few minutes last night, the United States was not a representative democracy.

Democrats came out to the floor this morning, admitted they made an honest mistake, and suggested we let bygones be bygones. That’s all well and good, except for this: when a motion to recommit passes, no other votes are taken! The Agriculture bill is sent back to the House committee, not to the Senate for further action. And on top of that, the Democrats even tried to expunge the record. They’re hoping the American people don’t notice. In short, they think you’re even less on the ball than Congressman McNulty.

(And for those of you who are trying so desperately to compare it to the Medicare vote that was held open for three hours, I give you this. The House requires a minimum of 15 minutes for a vote; however, the vote can stay open as long as needed, until the strike of the gavel when the vote is properly tallied. That early morning in 2003, we won, fair and square. Democrats had every right to find it annoying – I would have in their shoes –, but what we did was no way illegal or unruly. What’s amazing is that after we took the Democrats to school for 12 years, they’d still rather cheat than learn.)

Heeh, that was Tom Delay link

[Tango]

Originally posted by Rolex
Illegal aliens are not eligible for food stamps, Social Security, Medicare, unemployment, or college financial aid, but they are treated in emergency rooms, and their children get a K-12 education.

BS. All it takes is for them to steal someones SSN and they get can get food stamps and can apply for anything else. The problem is the owner of that SSN is held responsible when the illegal runs up bills and doesn't pay them when they skip town.

As for thiers kids education, how many of them are in school and can't speak english? ALOT of them. The school in Dequeen, Arkansas is about 50% hispanic and many of them have to have Spanish speaking teachers. Just that much more money being wasted on illegals.

[bj229r]

Originally posted by Rolex
.........................................
Half of all felonies are committed by illegal aliens? Now that's a whopper of a fish tale. Two million people are in US prisons and jails, with the total alien prisoners equaling about 70,000. Note the italics? Alien and Illegal Aliens are not the same. Fifty percent of the total aliens incarcerated are illegal aliens. That 1.6% of the total prisoners. Americas jails and prisons are full of Americans.................... .............

Sorry for the adult tone of this post. I know unemotional reason irks the watermelon out of you.

Can't speak to % of total crimes, but there are LOTS more than 70k in jails:

As Investors Business Daily reported in March 2005:

"The U.S. Justice Department estimated that 270,000 illegal immigrants served jail time nationally in 2003. Of those, 108,000 were in California. Some estimates show illegals now make up half of California's prison population, creating a massive criminal subculture that strains state budgets and creates a nightmare for local police forces."
  Citing an Urban Institute study, director of research for the Center for Immigration Studies Steven Camorata noted in 2004: "Roughly 17 percent of the prison population at the federal level are illegal aliens. That's a huge number since illegal aliens only account for about 3 percent of the total population."

Former California Gov. Pete Wilson places the percentage of illegal aliens in U.S. prisons even higher. In 2001, he told Fox News Channel's Bill O'Reilly:

"We had problems related to the costs of educating children who were acknowledged to be in the country illegally, healthcare costs. One in five in our prison population were illegal immigrants who had been convicted of a felony after entering the country illegally."

The Federation for American Immigration Reform also turned to the Justice Department to get statistics on criminal aliens. They report:

"In March 2000, Congress made public Department of Justice statistics showing that, over the previous five years, the INS had released over 35,000 criminal aliens instead of deporting them. Over 11,000 of those released went on to commit serious crimes, over 1,800 of which were violent ones [including 98 homicides, 142 sexual assaults, and 44 kidnappings].

link

This guy has an interesting take:

Fortunately, a number of congressmen requested that the General Accountability Office (GAO) investigate and report information on criminal aliens incarcerated in federal and state prisons and local jails. The resulting GAO report, published in April 2005, revealed that illegal aliens make up 27% of the prison population. (The oft-cited figure of 12 million illegal aliens in the country means that they make up just 4% of the general population.)

Since illegal aliens are unlikely to be committing white-collar crimes, that figure likely underestimates the amount of violent crime committed by illegal aliens. Using the GAO report, Representative Steve King of Iowa points out that 25 Americans, on average, are killed by illegal aliens every day (about evenly split between motor vehicle accidents and outright murder).

Do the math: That works out to more than 9,000 deaths per year, or more than 36,000 deaths over the past four years. That's more than ten times the number of Americans killed in Iraq over the past four years!

Oddly, I've seen people in my hometown protesting against the war in Iraq, but I've never seen anyone protesting against the illegal alien invasion that is killing tens of thousands of Americans right here on our own soil.

link

[lazs2]

rolex and 2bi8ghorn... I don't know where you get the figures about 7 billion being paid out to false ss cards... if that is the case we need to shut down SS... I mean... wow.. 7billon a year free coming into it and it still won't work!

The vast majority of illegals work under the table... for cash.  there is no workmans comp or SS or medicare or health benifiets paid... they work for construction and farm and landscaping jobs that are under the table.

They do indeed have anchor babies while here and they are the biggest drain on our prison and justice system along with out medical and education system.  They drain far more than they put in...

They do not have car insurance.   The vast majority are driving without car insurance or a drivers license.    

2bighorn..  I would have it so that the free market ruled it.. I would have no real borders... the difference is.. for that to work.... some things would have to be in place....

no such thing as an anchor baby... unless one of your parents is a citizen... you aren't.

no free schooling...  you come here you leave the kids behind.

No free medical... if your employer won't pay... you don't have it.

No SS for anyone.

No medicare for anyone

Have to be from now on I guess..  or refund everyone who has paid in to SS and medicare along with interest.

That isn't going to happen so... enforce the laws we have or don't enforce any of em on me.

If it is illegal to have a false SS card then put anyone in jail who has one.

If it is illegal to cross the border without papers then arrest anyone who does so.

If it is illegal to hire a non citizen then arrest and imprison any employer who does so.

lazs

[Speed55]

The main point, as far as i see it, is that they don't belong here.

Going to Storch's post.  Anyone see the irony about how a bunch of illegal aliens protest  about how unfair it is for other illegals to be deported, and 9/10 times they win.

Imagine what would happen if large mobs of americans went from town to town and protested businesses that were hiring illegals.  First off the organizer of that protest would automatically be deemed the villian, and a racist in the public eye from the media.

Next, the illegals themselves would organize and protest the protestors.  

Next, there woud be violent clashes between the two groups, with alot of people being arrested and released and things would probably escalate into some kind of crazy mad max street war.

OR:  The gov't, state, and city, could allow the people that "protect and serve" to do there jobs, including arresting illegal aliens (criminals) on the spot and send them to a detention center to be tagged, and shipped back to wherever they come from.

Read the post by Karnak who can't even get his WIFE here legally.

[Sundowner]

Originally posted by lazs2
and yet... somehow... we survived without the huge amounts of illegals... somehow we managed to get people who were high school or less graduates to build houses for $25-50 an hour...  somehow... 3 of them did the same job 10 illegals did..  or are you one who claims that the homes are better built with more quality now that illegals are doing it?

Kids did work and do work at denny's.    The cannery in the town next to me was at a college town... it ran seasonaly like they all do right now and it was full of housewives and kids helping to pay their education...

Take any factory and chase out the illegals and the next day all the jobs are filled with legals.

Jail the employers.. they are the problem.

lazs

Hear, Hear!

Regards,
Sun

[Sundowner]

Originally posted by Rolex
They can't get a refund with a false W2 any more than you can. If they are, then that is the fault of the IRS.

If a person finds a way to defraud the system, then succeeds at it, it is then the system's fault and not the perpetrator's fault?

YIKES!

Regards,
Sun

[lazs2]

Yep... these masterminds can get social security cards and drive to work but they can't fill out a tax return?    

I know for a fact that the landscapers and mexicans waiting out in the parking lots of home depots and the roofer crews are all getting paid slave labor wages and all under the table.  

lazs

[Rolex]

Hi bj229r,

I don't see how this shows 50% of all felonies are committed by illegal aliens.

Let's talk about statistics...

Citizens can't violate immigration laws, a federal offense, so all people held in federal prisons for immigration offenses are going to be illegal aliens. Illegal aliens caught and deported are held in federal custody until deportation. That is one reason you see such a high percent of illegal aliens as federal prisoners. It does not mean they have all committed a felony other than the immigration felony.

I have no reason to doubt Gov. Wilson's comment about 20% of the state prison population being illegal aliens with felony convictions, considering the high rate of illegal aliens in California. But that does not translate across the nation as a whole.

Your second link is factually wrong. The study quoted had no breakdown between illegal and legal aliens. The term "criminal alien" encompasses any foreign-born criminal, including legal residents.

Statistics are like lampposts. The function is to illuminate, but drunks use them to prop themselves up.