General Climate Discussion

[lazs2]

pretty weak you guys..  by my reasoning.. a stopped watch is accurate more often than a fast or slow one in that it is at least right twice a day.

straffo... the models are not predicting the future.. they are making graphs and charts about the past using data from the past.. in other words.. they take a known and then try to fit their model to it by inputing data till the results match.  

this is fine.. but..  when new data about the past comes up.. their neat little graphs and charts look silly.. say for instance.. it is found that 1935 was the hottest year and not 98 as previously thought... AKH posted one of their neat charts that showed that their model predicted the 98 hottest year even tho... they precicted it in 2000...  

The graph shows of course.. that 1935 was just another year... now..  they are proven wrong.

They won't predict the future at all after the great hurricane (or lack therof) fiasco.

So back to you acolytes and alter boys... what do the models say about next year and the year after?

lazs

[straffo]

That's why there is about 10 models (at least) currently none are accurate enough,there is no real consensus yet.

The problem is not the cause but the probable consequences in case GW is really happening.

Will we want to be responsible of GW or not ?

Can we do or do we want to do something against GW ?





Btw what is the hurricane fiasco ?
When knowing we cannot predict accurately how will be the weather during the next 5 days how can someone predict a year before ?

That make no sense.

[AKH]

According to GISS, the five hottest years on record are 2005, 1998, 2002, 2003 and 2006.



CRU: 1998, 2005, 2003, 2002, 2004, 2006



And the NDCC.



1934 certainly was not the hottest year on record.

Your comments on climate models are just as valid.

[Arlo]

Originally posted by AKH
According to GISS, the five hottest years on record are 2005, 1998, 2002, 2003 and 2006.



CRU: 1998, 2005, 2003, 2002, 2004, 2006



And the NDCC.



1934 certainly was not the hottest year on record.

Your comments on climate models are just as valid.

A plot hatched by Gore and his way back machine. Follow the money. He want's to destroy the economy of the U.S. to make money, man.

[john9001]

i doubt the satellite data from 1860 is very accurate.

[Arlo]

Originally posted by john9001
i doubt the satellite data from 1860 is very accurate.

How would you know? Gore's evil plot to become the richest man in the world by destroying the global economy was bound to include carrying along a satellite in his way back machine.

[Angus]

I live in Iceland, and it's December. I walk around in a T-shirt, but it's all Gore-propoganda, for it really is 75 on Kelvin.
And John, are you really that thick? A 19th century satellite may look like this:

[Jackal1]

Froze my tomato plants night before last.
Damn global warmin.....errrr climate change.

[Angus]

You should perhaps grow them up here
Or in Greenland....

[lazs2]

So angus.. what bad things have happened to you in this wonderful and perfectly natural warming period in our climate history?

Wait.. don't tell me..  the ice cube crop production is down 10%... cocktails everywhere are more expensive in bars and homes.

and akh..  guess it was 1936..  better get back there and adjust those pesky models to fit the past.. your charts are simply outdated.. they need to be adjusted to fit the past.

"Ironically, a report issued yesterday by the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration says that while the summer of 2006 was the second-warmest on record, the hottest year for the contiguous 48 states since statistics began in 1895 was 1936 – seven decades ago."

http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=51992

lazs

[Angus]

For us up here?
Well, we are certainly getting the good end of it
I'll give you odds and ends.
We are starting to grow wheat. Barley has done fine for the last 20 years as well.
We are starting to grow peas as well.
My turf-cycle growing speed has increased.
I don't have to do a lot of snow-shoveling in the winter.
I can plough any month of the year instead of having oct-may out.
Unwarmed greenhouses are starting with apples and cherries.
(thermal water has been applied as an addition to the greenhouses "greenhouse effect" )
Lots of harnessable hydro-energy, since the glacial rivers are just big and fine.
No more icebergs, or ship-killing drift-ice.
The downside is ...:
Longer periods of same kind of weather, markedly in the summertime.
New insects and Fungi, as well as other organs.
Decreased crops in natural growth (mostly grass) due to the above
Erosion due to the above.
Shrinking glaciers, which means our rivers are going to drop to a leak in incredibly close future, - so hydro power is out.
Anyway, I always thought our country had a naughty climate, and it's getting warmer, and for my egoistic plans that's just delightful.
I always envied my European colleges for their "easy-mode" of agriculture.
So, it's changing, - downside being that in other places it's getting worse.
But at least I realize it....


And that means all 365 days of the year.

[AKH]

Well, lazs, I was under the impression that the topic under discussion was MMGW, AGW or global warming:

Another Climate Scientist debunks MMGW

Not that it will convince the die-hard Man-Made Global Warming followers, but hey...I can try.

You, however, seem to be under yet another delusion that we are actually talking about U.S. warming.  I know that you usually advance a parochial perspective, so it's natural that you only consider MMUSW.

[Angus]

Well, AFAIK, the US mainland is generally not warming, as well as a good chunk of the Asian continent.
But the rest of the globe more or less is, and that's a lot of....area.

[lazs2]

angus.. and this has been bad for you in what way again?

lazs

[Angus]

Me? Not at all, or hardly at all. Quite good actually.

But, I'm not a complete egoist, nor the complete idiot to think that we're just going to up a little hill and stay nice and comfy.

Even if the change will stop where it is, it's going to bring some trouble.

If it carries on, it will even bring us (up here) trouble.

Bottom line is that at least we (up here) realize.