General Climate Discussion

[AKH]

Scientists expect that global warming will cause a variety of changes to precipitation patterns in the United States. Many areas will receive increased amounts of rain and snow over the course of a year; some areas will receive less. But scientists expect that, all across the country, the rainstorms and snowstorms that do occur will be more intense – increasing the risk of flooding and other impacts.

In this report, we evaluate trends in the frequency of storms with extreme levels of rainfall or snowfall across the contiguous United States over the last 60 years. We analyze daily precipitation records spanning from 1948 through 2006 at more than 3,000 weather stations in 48 states. We then examine patterns in the timing of heavy precipitation relative to the local climate at each weather station.

We find that storms with extreme amounts of rain or snowfall are happening more often across most of America, consistent with the predicted impact of global warming.

link

[Donzo]

Originally posted by crockett
Considering the consequences are pretty drastic is it worth the risk that you maybe wrong? Is spending a few extra bucks really that big of a deal if we might be able to slow it down or stop it?  

Has anyone every considered the consequences of not slowing it down or stopping it (provide, of course, that we could control it)?

[JBA]

Originally posted by DiabloTX
I wonder what size carbon-footprint was created flying all of those delegates to Bali?

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601170&refer=home&sid=aPbfclqokwcw
Government officials and activists flying to Bali, Indonesia, for the United Nations meeting on climate change will cause as much pollution as 20,000 cars in a year.
The delegates each will produce an average 4.07 metric tons of carbon dioxide, or CO2,

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/main.jhtml?xml=/earth/2007/12/02/eabali102.xml
The 15,000 politicians, civil servants, green and industry lobbyists and journalists who will fly in are estimated to emit the equivalent of more than 100,000 tons of carbon dioxide, equivalent to the annual emissions of the African state of Chad.

And your EU taxes hard at work saving the globle from yourselves.....

with many saying accommodation is only available now at around £400-to £500 a night for a small single room.
The hotel where British ministers will stay, the Westin Resort Nusa Dua, describes the experience of staying there as “sheer indulgence.”
The EU will be sending a delegation of 90 officials with the environment commissioner, Stavros Dimas.
It unclear, however, what 20 MEPs and 18 assistants, who have no formal part in the process, will be doing.
They will be staying, on expenses, at the Conrad Bali Resort and Spa, one of the Hilton Hotel chain’s luxury hotels.
Their itinerary includes a day trip to the fishing village of Serangan with time for surfing

[crockett]

Originally posted by indy007
It's not about whether its "Global Climate Change" or "Global Warming".

You'd have to be an idiot to argue that.

The only important part is the "Man-Made" in front of it, and the accuracy of that claim.

Hey we have a winner. Unfortanly the Right wing always has to have something to argue about, so they are willing to ignore the issues at hand just to aruge.

[Angus]

Same where I live.
BTW, It's december, and I live close to the polar circle (64+N.Lat).
There is no frost in the ground, and we didn't have anything proper for several years. It's autumn weather, and lots of water and wind.
We are having one low-pressure area after the other with wind speeds up to 60m/sec, typically 30. Both categorize close or into being a Hurricane.
We are now having no.4 in some 10 days!!!

Anyway, I was planning to plow in the winter (which should normally to be considered impossible). I am getting around to it, just too busy yet. Just 10 years ago, you could forget that after october, now you can almost take it for granted.
So, in short it's quite warmer, and the trade is picking up on the reality...

[AKH]

Originally posted by Donzo
Has anyone every considered the consequences of not slowing it down or stopping it (provide, of course, that we could control it)?

The range of climatic changes anticipated in the United States – from rising sea levels to stronger and more frequent storms and extreme temperature events – will have real impacts on the natural environment as well as human-made infrastructures and their ability to contribute to economic activity and quality of life. These impacts will vary across regions and sectors of the economy, leaving future governments, the private sector and citizens to face the full spectrum of direct and indirect costs accrued from increasing environmental damage and disruption.

The US Economic Impacts of Climate Change and the Costs of Inaction

[indy007]

Originally posted by crockett
Hey we have a winner. Unfortanly the Right wing always has to have something to argue about, so they are willing to ignore the issues at hand just to aruge.

I'm not right wing. Socially, I'm one of the most liberal posters on this forum (real liberal, not democrat socialist "liberal"). I'll still call the "Man Made" bit garbage. It's politics, not science.

[AKH]

More guff from Lazs

Projected changes in future sea ice conditions, if realized, will result in loss of approximately 2/3 of the world’s current polar bear population by the mid 21st century. Because the observed trajectory of Arctic sea ice decline appears to be underestimated by currently available models, this assessment of future polar bear status may be conservative.

USGS Science to Inform U.S. Fish & Wildlife Service Decision Making on Polar Bears

[crockett]

Originally posted by Angus
Same where I live.

I can't say the same in regards to snow as I live in Florida.

What I can say is when I was in High School I used to have a lawn service. During the summer it used to be a daily thing that we would have rain and thunder storms everyday about 3pm. It was like clockwork.

Nowadays that's few and far between.

Something else I've noticed, is the beaches are eroding due to sea level rise. Back when I was a kid, I remember coming up to Flagler Beach to go surfing with my brother.  

Used to be a sandy beach, now it's almost all washed away and the ocean is almost to the point of washing away parts of Highway A1A during storms. They had to come in and line the entire section of beach with rocks, because the sea level has risen and the beach is pretty much gone.

Makes me wonder what it will be like in another 20 years.

[crockett]

Originally posted by indy007
I'm not right wing. Socially, I'm one of the most liberal posters on this forum (real liberal, not democrat socialist "liberal"). I'll still call the "Man Made" bit garbage. It's politics, not science.

Yes I was agreeing with you.  on the only real argument is if it's man made or not.

[straffo]

Originally posted by AKWabbit
There is no obligation to prove a negative.
 

That's wrong


no need to back this assertion as you know

[john9001]

dude, where's my hurricane?

oh, beach erosion is natural, you need to read up on littoral drift.

[Maverick]

Projected changes in future sea ice conditions, if realized

I believe that what Laz was trying to say is nicely encapsulated in your quote. I have made the pertinent parts bold so you can see them. There is no guarantee that this will in fact occur or that it is not part of a natural cycle of climate change the Earth goes through without any help or interference from humans.

[bj229r]

Originally posted by lazs2
bj said...

"For me this keeps coming back to: HOW much 'global warming' has happened thus far? ~ 1 degree since the automobile was invented....how much , if any, caused by us? Unknown

EVERYTHING ELSE isn't HAPPENING, it's merely PREDICTED to happen in the future by the SAME @#$ers who couldn't tell me at 9pm Tuesday I was gonna have an ice storm on the way to work Wednesday morning"

That about sums it up.. the co2 doubling that they are all telling us will end the planet is about 65% of the way through..   yet.. we have only 1 degree.. maybe a hundredth of that caused by us..  the predictions are just that... forced computer models... data on about 11 natural climate forcings of which they know very little and even less about how they interact.

The more co2 you add.. the less the effect.. the first 40 ppm has more effect than the next 300 ppm say... after that.. almost nothing.. it is like painting a window black to keep out the sun.. the first coat does the work.. the next 100 coats do very little.   If Co2 is affecting the weather.. it has shot it's wad already

as for louis... if he ain't beetle.. he is a good imitation.   guns scare him and he thinks the big bad Americans are making it too hot.

A whole on degree..  if we do everything the kyoto treaty wants... we may.. under the best scenario they can muster...  effect the temp a half a degree in 100 years.. for that.. we spend trillions.

lazs



Even the

FINally! SOMEone realizes my genius!

[AKH]

Originally posted by Maverick
Projected changes in future sea ice conditions, if realized

I believe that what Laz was trying to say is nicely encapsulated in your quote. I have made the pertinent parts bold so you can see them. There is no guarantee that this will in fact occur or that it is not part of a natural cycle of climate change the Earth goes through without any help or interference from humans.

I don't suppose that you bothered to read the linked summary?  I doubt it, since you don't even appear to have seen the second sentence that I quoted.  I have emboldened the important words to aid your comprehension:

Because the observed trajectory of Arctic sea ice decline appears to be underestimated by currently available models, this assessment of future polar bear status may be conservative.

You may prefer to fixate on other words, of course.

Very little is guaranteed.  That is why absolute statements are rarely made, even when there is a 0.95 probability of something occurring. Any first year science student knows this.