SIG220's SIG 220 .45 Caliber Pisols!! -- PHOTO

[lazs2]

gunthr...  the reason is pretty simple..   You are correct that "most" people would not sell them just because of recoil but....

cops.... cops bought em for backup and carry off duty.. the rub was... now they got to qualify with em... with full house loads.   I think you can see where this is going...

the gun does kick..  I am not in the least recoil concious but.....

This is a whole new world of handgun recoil.

lazs

[Masherbrum]

Originally posted by Terror
Comes from competition and defensive shooting.  Fast and accurate are the order of the day.  Two to the body, one to head, transition, two to the body, one to the head, transition, two to the body, one to the head.  Or 1,1,2,1,1 for a tactical order/sequence drill.  Multiple threats require fast and accurate.

T

Please, do not teach this to anyone.   Shooting a "suspect" in this manner is borderline "mayhem" in some instances.  

This has NO BEARING on the Glock, none whatsoever.   Just an attempt to "make yourself appear to be a good shot".   In all of my dealings at the ranges that I have been too have been the following.   Those who bark the loudest, get silent quick.

Also, in the eyes of a prosecutor, the "Mozambique technique" isn't something to be proud of.

[GtoRA2]

Originally posted by Gunthr
I don't see why anyone would let recoil bother them enough to sell a great defensive carry gun like the 340pd - unless they just cannot hang on to it.  but most adults should be able to.   its not like they'd notice the recoil shooting it on some very very bad day when they're in a corner.

Shot one?

I think I put 9 or 10 rounds throuhg Laz's Grun did atleast 20.

I won't be shooting it again, it bruised my hand for 3 days.

Bar none the heaviest recoil I have ever felt in a handgun, it is what I imagine a normal little firecracker going off in your hand feels like.

[Masherbrum]

Originally posted by GtoRA2
Shot one?

I think I put 9 or 10 rounds throuhg Laz's Grun did atleast 20.

I won't be shooting it again, it bruised my hand for 3 days.

Bar none the heaviest recoil I have ever felt in a handgun, it is what I imagine a normal little firecracker going off in your hand feels like.

I'm gonna have to come out there and shoot with you two (lazs & yourself).   I have no doubt that it would be something other than fun.

[TalonX]

I like my USP 45 Tactical the very best....

I have Sig, several HKs, several Glocks, and others....  HK rules.

[Masherbrum]

Originally posted by TalonX
I like my USP 45 Tactical the very best....

I have Sig, several HKs, several Glocks, and others....  HK rules.

No question about that in my eyes, BUT unlike Terror.   I hold the Sig in the same class.   Glocks are good but I do not like the ergonomics.

[Gunthr]

Shot one?

I think I put 9 or 10 rounds throuhg Laz's Grun did atleast 20.

I won't be shooting it again, it bruised my hand for 3 days.

Bar none the heaviest recoil I have ever felt in a handgun, it is what I imagine a normal little firecracker going off in your hand feels like.  Gtora2

LOL Thanks for that insight there Lazs, has the ring of truth....  have  to qualify with it and use dept. issued ammo too.  i guess its just too many rounds for them.... i think about 48 for the course.  

Gtora2, I've got to shoot this this thing... obviously the light weight + round boot grip +357 = sore hand.  the good thing about that gun is that  you can always fall back to 38 plus P's....

[TwentyFo]

Charleton Heston is my president!!

[Slash27]

Originally posted by storch
sheesh, I know why the average LEO can't seem to hit a barn from inside the barn.  it's those glocks that just don't point natural like.  if the colt model peacemaker is the best naturally pointing handgun then the glock has to be down there in the amoeba slime pit.  it just does not point naturally for me.  I wanted to like the glock but it just simply does not work in my case.

sig is fine to me and the USP in my opinion is is simply the best of the plastic guns unless you have smallish hands.

For me the USP does feel right at all. I dont know why but it feels awkward and just does not sit right in my hand. The Glock does on the other hand and I have no issues with it. I do prefer a Kimber 1911 over anything else. Damn nice firearm. I may have tp pick up a XD 45 just to be sure though.

I tried a Sig out for about 9 months and it just did not do it for me.

[moneyguy]

i fired a Smith 10mm today at the range. got an instant woody, i want one.

[storch]

Originally posted by moneyguy
i fired a Smith 10mm today at the range. got an instant woody, i want one.

I don't know why the 10mm never caught on.  it is a powerful enough pistol cartridge, adequate for anything requiring man stopping.  I shot one in a colt delta which is a 1911 when they first emerged in the mid 1980s and was impressed.  

I waited a bit to see if the cartridge would catch on and sadly it never did so in 1993 I purchased a .40 S&W instead, first an S&W model 411 which is wildly inaccurate and then an H&K USP.  in time, with much tinkering and after many many rounds I figured out how to make the model 411 work for me. the S&W mod 411 is my favorite fun pistol especially when I go to the range shooting.  I often shoot with LEPs from my town and they often bring new friends, as the conversation inevitably turns to how well a man can shoot I'm asked to bring out the nasty 411.  the new guy can't hit anything with it while those of us in the know hit black every round.  that 411 is worth it's weight in gold on those occasions.

[Captain Virgil Hilts]

Two reasons the 10MM never caught on. First, the gun it was originally intended for, the BrenTen, never really made it into production, for several reasons, mostly money. Second, the FBI almost adopted it after the infamous Miami Shootout, but because of recoil and a couple of other factors, adopted the 40 Short and Weak instead.

I like 10MM, but store bought ammo is expensive and hard to find, so that hurts it for personal defense. Dan Wesson makes a 1911 pattern 10MM that I'd like to have but it is expensive. Actually, 10MM is a lot like 41 Magnum, besides being very close in ballistics in many loadings, they both have very small but very dedicated followings.

[lazs2]

The EAA I have is interesting... it has the low barrel like the block guys like for that 30 rounds at thirty bad guys in 5 seconds thing that is so important in a defense gun and... it is basically a convertable handgun.. it is one gun in dozens of calibers.

Mine is in 45 auto.    I have a 22 kit.   I could buy a 9mm or 10 mm kit or 357 sig kit for it.. conversion takes about 5 seconds or so.  I have shot one in 10 mm.

I have not shot a semi auto pistol yet that I thought had recoil.. including some desert eagles.

lazs

[Suave]

I've been contemplating a tangfolio witness as a fun gun. Like I said some forieners I know praise it and .38 super. That's a rare ammo here and I'm not ready to admit that I'm old enough to be a reloading guy. Thoughts on .38 super ?

[Terror]

Originally posted by Masherbrum
Please, do not teach this to anyone.   Shooting a "suspect" in this manner is borderline "mayhem" in some instances.  

This has NO BEARING on the Glock, none whatsoever.   Just an attempt to "make yourself appear to be a good shot".   In all of my dealings at the ranges that I have been too have been the following.   Those who bark the loudest, get silent quick.

Also, in the eyes of a prosecutor, the "Mozambique technique" isn't something to be proud of.

Every defensive shooting class I have been to has taught tactical sequence with follow ups to the head.  

Per Tyler CourtHouse Shooting

A local resident, Mark Allen Wilson, was returning to his nearby apartment when the shooting began. Wilson, who held a Texas concealed handgun permit, is believed to have responded to seeing Arroyo shoot his wife by drawing his own weapon, a Colt .45 caliber pistol and approaching. Arroyo was already engaged in a heated gun battle with sheriff's deputies and Tyler police officers and apparently did not see Wilson.

Wilson fired one round at Arroyo, causing him to stumble. A witness saw the round strike Arroyo and saw "white puffs of powder-like substance" come from Arroyo's clothing. This appeared to be the first time Arroyo was hit or injured during his attack on the courthouse. Wilson then took cover behind Arroyo's truck.

As Arroyo approached, Wilson stood up and fired again at Arroyo over the truck, hitting him; however, Arroyo was wearing a bulletproof vest, and Wilson's shots did not disable him. Arroyo turned and fired at least one shot at Wilson, who faltered and disappeared from view behind the truck. Arroyo then fired at him three times, killing him.

Arroyo was wearing body armor and withstood several .45acp hits to the body from Wilson.  It seems two to the body and one to the head is definitely a worthwhile drill to practice and be able to utilize in a hostile situation.  "mayhem" or not.

The ability to quickly and accurately followup with shots and being able to transition smoothly to multiple targets has a direct bearing on survivability in a hostile situation.  IMO, Glocks make this easier than SIGs. Period.  SIGs are just harder to be fast and accurate with.

Terror