Author Topic: Connections  (Read 1337 times)

Offline lasse

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Connections
« Reply #15 on: February 15, 2000, 10:07:00 AM »
Im at work right now, but I get a ping of 153 as an average to HTC.

I live in Norway.
Thats way up north in europe if you didnt know  

------------------
The Wild Vikings
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lasse-
You smell that? Do you smell that?
Napalm, son. Nothing else in the world smells like that.
I love the smell of napalm in the morning.
The smell, you know that gasoline smell, smelled like victory.

Offline Dinger

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« Reply #16 on: February 15, 2000, 10:17:00 AM »
Go with dingy he's right.
Here's my summary of connect-related issues, from a year of reading people whine about it and flying here and on brand-W.

A. Things that will screw up your connx mighty fast:
1. A "Winmodem" -- CPU-driven compression has a problem with online games, as both need the processor at about the same time (AH will use your CPU at 100%, Winmodem will want some of that too, it won't get it, and the results are ugly).  To oversimplify, if you cannot use your modem with DOS, you have a problem.  This is serious.
2. On a TNT card (and I imagine for others)  If you've got Vsync off, make sure your drivers are set to render 0 frames ahead.
3. Packet loss.  This is your number one enemy.  Think of every lost packet as a microwarp.
4. Wildly variable connection lag.  This will cause all kinds of jumping around, late hits, offsides and the like.

B. Ping Times and Bandwidth
I've been in Europe, connecting across a LAN on academic networks.  These nets are heavily used (read oversubscribed) during working hours and amazingly fast off hours.  So, I've been able to experience with the same connection, >1000 ms with nasty packet loss, 700 ms steady with minimal loss and up to 160 ms ping times.
1.
Bandwidth doesn't matter.  Those who brag about their cable modems will have great bandwidth, and might be able to receive video on their computer; they might (probly) also get a faster ping time than a modem.  But if their ISP has oversubscribed their services, you're gonna see nasty problems, packet loss, narrow bandwidth, and the like, especially at peak usage hours.
Again, I've seen my PC get up to 100k/sec streaming video on weekends.  But at 1:00 PM on a wednesday afternoon, I'll get 100 bytes/sec and I'm lucky to get a single web page without losing the connection.

2. Lag
   Yes, lag makes a difference.  It comes in two flavors -- server lag and connection lag.  Server lag is more or less static, and reflects the time it takes for the server to process information and spit it out again.  I t might increase with users online.  Connection lag is the time it takes for the data to travel from the FE to the server and back.  This is more or less related to your ping time.  There is a difference to playing with 700 ms and 100ms, and there is a difference to playing against someone witha  700ms and someone with a 100ms connection.  The higher your lag, the older the information you receive in your FE world; so e.g. the A/C charging behind you is closer than it appears, and the one you're attacking  will see you farther away than you really are.  In other words, you need to adjust your reaction times and tactics to fit your lag times.  From my experience, switching between  700 and 200 ms lag can be disorienting -- your reflexes are all off.

So, in summary, modem or not, high ping or low, what's key is to get a steady stream of data flowing at a constant speed.

Dinger

Offline Vermillion

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« Reply #17 on: February 15, 2000, 10:35:00 AM »
My question is how many of you that have had connection problems, have done a traceroute, saved the data and sent it in to HTC?

Because if you haven't, then you have no right to squeak.

The one time I did this, I got an immediate response from Pyro on it.

Personally, I have great connects to AH thru two different ISP's, both on a off brand v.90 modem.

Typical ping times are in the 160's-170's ms, with 0% packet loss. However there are times, that there is gonna be lag no matter how good your connect is, and if you are on digital (cable/ADSL) or plain old analog.

Lag is a fact of life of internet gaming. But you do NOT have to have a digital connection to be competitive. Period.

I think I do pretty good (ie. average)and I am one of the "great unwashed masses".

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Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure,
"Real Men fly Radials, Nancy Boys fly Spitfires"

Offline lasse

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« Reply #18 on: February 15, 2000, 12:15:00 PM »
Like this?
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
| 0  |  | 169.254.182.87 | PII400                          | ...                  |     |            | (private use)                     |
| 1  |  | 130.67.231.128 | ti18a67-l1.ti.telenor.net       | ?Oslo, Norway        | 20  | x          | Norsk Data A/S                    |
| 2  |  | 130.67.224.1   | ti18d01-fe2-0.ti.telenor.net    | ?Oslo, Norway        | 23  | x-         | Norsk Data A/S                    |
| 3  |  | 130.67.254.5   | ti18c01-fe8-0-0.ti.telenor.net  | ?Oslo, Norway        | 31  | x---       | Norsk Data A/S                    |
| 4  |  | 130.67.61.122  | ti18c02-fe1-1-0.ti.telenor.net  | ?Oslo, Norway        | 29  | x--        | Norsk Data A/S                    |
| 5  |  | 130.67.61.57   | ti01c01-s3-1-1.ti.telenor.net   | ?Oslo, Norway        | 35  | x--        | Norsk Data A/S                    |
| 6  |  | 148.122.66.33  | nb01b01-fe6-1-0.nb.telenor.net  | ?(Norway)            | 49  | -x         | Telenor AS                        |
| 7  |  | 148.122.65.14  | nb03b01-pos4-0-0.nb.telenor.net | ?(Norway)            | 115 |   x        | Telenor AS                        |
| 8  |  | 144.232.172.25 | sl-gw7-nyc-6-0-0.sprintlink.net | New York, NY, USA    | 117 |   x-       | Sprint/United Information Service |
| 9  |  | 144.232.7.81   | sl-bb12-nyc-3-3.sprintlink.net  | New York, NY, USA    | 123 |   x--      | Sprint/United Information Service |
| 10 |  | 144.232.9.70   | sl-bb12-pen-7-0.sprintlink.net  | Pennsauken, NJ, USA  | 149 |   -x-      | Sprint/United Information Service |
| 11 |  | 144.232.9.238  | sl-bb11-fw-5-2.sprintlink.net   | Fort Worth, TX, USA  | 166 |    x       | Sprint/United Information Service |
| 12 |  | 144.232.11.5   | sl-bb11-fw-8-0.sprintlink.net   | Fort Worth, TX, USA  | 165 |    x       | Sprint/United Information Service |
| 13 |  | 144.232.11.66  | sl-gw13-fw-8-0-0.sprintlink.net | Fort Worth, TX, USA  | 202 |    -x----- | Sprint/United Information Service |
| 14 |  | 144.228.137.6  | sl-dnetfw-1-0-T3.sprintlink.net | -                    | 186 |    x--     | Sprint                            |
| 15 |  | 216.90.2.66    | applink-1.usdlls.savvis.net     | -                    | 162 |    x       | SAVVIS Communications             |
| 16 |  | 216.91.192.19  | beta.hitechcreations.com        | ?Grapevine, TX 76051 | 185 |    x-      | Applink Corp                      |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


------------------
The Wild Vikings
Commanding Officer
lasse-
You smell that? Do you smell that?
Napalm, son. Nothing else in the world smells like that.
I love the smell of napalm in the morning.
The smell, you know that gasoline smell, smelled like victory.

Offline Lephturn

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« Reply #19 on: February 15, 2000, 01:45:00 PM »
Although it does not exactly apply to this thread, take a look at this article I am working on for my web site:
 http://users.andara.com/~sconrad/connection.htm

It's not linked from the main site, as it is in first draft form and I've not finished the part about optimizing your modem connection.  However, I think it will be a good read for those interested in how their connections effect Aces High play.

To boil it all down... Dingy is right on.

------------------
Lephturn
The Flying Pigs
Visit Lephturn's Aerodrome for AH news, resources, and training data.
 http://users.andara.com/~sconrad/

Offline BigJim

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« Reply #20 on: February 15, 2000, 04:22:00 PM »
ok you have convinced me that packet loss may be my problem??? now does anyone have a program where I might be able to see what that loss is??? I am presently using ping plotter which I don't think yields packet loss info.

BigJim

Offline BigJim

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« Reply #21 on: February 15, 2000, 04:23:00 PM »
testing       :0

[This message has been edited by BigJim (edited 02-15-2000).]

[This message has been edited by BigJim (edited 02-15-2000).]

Offline Vermillion

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« Reply #22 on: February 15, 2000, 04:40:00 PM »
I would suggest a little program called UOTrace, its freeware, its small and it was originaly written by a UO player for onlinegameing. It will ping, trace, poll (continuous ping/trace), perform DNS lookup, and will even automatically send an email to the owner of any router that gives a really bad result (if you wish).

Here is the URL, its only 65K

 ftp://ftp.owo.com/pub/uo/uotrace/uotrace.exe

Its what I use.

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Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure,
"Real Men fly Radials, Nancy Boys fly Spitfires"

Offline Spatula

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« Reply #23 on: February 15, 2000, 05:33:00 PM »
I used to have a cable modem, then cause i moved i went back to a simple 33.6K dial up.
The difference in ping speeds changed all of about 20-40 ms its now aroung 380 ms.
Once your packets get over the ppp link (in a dial-up) to your ISP they're are treated exactly the same as packets from a cable modem or any other connection. The difference is that a cable/ISDN can get a packet to your ISP alot faster than a ppp (dial up) link can but this only constitutes (in my case) 1 hop in the 16 odd to get to HTC. So the difference it makes to me is almost nothing. The lag comes about from the number of hops it has to do => more hops, bigger latency => longer ping trip time.
When some people get ADSL/ISDN/Cable and they say their ping went down dramatically its probably bacuse they now have to do less hops to HTC, and/or the old ppp (dial up)link played a significant part in the latency, either beacuse of the way the ISP handles it or maybe a crappy phone line or something.
To cut to the chase, cables/ADSL/ISDN can give good improvements but they, themselves, are not always the cause of it. So dont just go get one thinking you'll eliminate warps, not true.
The best way is to optimise your ppp link.
try this:
1. Change you MTU and MRU sizes to about 512 or so (or to the closest packet size of an Aces High UDP packet - what is it HT?).
2. Turn all compression,buffering etc OFF on your modem.
3. check you TTL too. Too long a TTL means if a packet gets lost it will not die and show up at HTC with some old co-ordinate information of your plane, this is what causes the warp (that and packet loss, but old packets are worse than lost packets).
There are a number of freeware products that let you play with these settings.

Remember a constantly bad ping is not really bad at all. Packet loss and packet delay are THE causes of warping. As long as you get a constant (ie little deviation from the mean ping time) ping time all will be good.

------------------
Overlord Spatula,
1st Airborne Kitchen Utensil Assault Group

"... 10 Me-109s out of the sun..." Aces High, Iron Maiden.
Airborne Kitchen Utensil Assault Group

Offline Lephturn

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« Reply #24 on: February 16, 2000, 08:44:00 AM »
BigJim:  PingPlotter does show you packet loss.  The column on the left will show you packet loss, and at what routers the packet loss is occuring.

Spatula:  The main reason a MoDem has higher latency, is because it must do analog to digital conversions which take time, and increase latency.  Other higher bandwidth connections do not undergo these conversions and the signal stays digital, hence they have much lower latency.

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Lephturn
The Flying Pigs
Visit Lephturn's Aerodrome for AH news, resources, and training data.
 http://users.andara.com/~sconrad/